Outdated and expensive

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Posts 135
Gene Britton | Forum Activity | Posted: Thu, Nov 17 2011 8:21 AM

I am a long time user of Logos but as of late it appears to me that the product is outdated and too expensive.  If I were to start over I do not believe I would make the investment in the product.  My appeal is that the company will energize its efforts to become the state of the art leader that it once was. Am I wrong?  Every week there is something that annoys me; like this morning the ICC commentary set at 1200 and the inability to highlight on my ipad are just typical examples. It use to be fun to scout out what was on Logos but today it is not worth the time and effort.  Is this just me and am I being too critical?  

Posts 569
J. Morris | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Nov 17 2011 8:33 AM

The only couple of things I would agree with is it is expensive and I also would like highlighting on ipad.  However, you said "outdated"...  I would completely disagree.  I have 2 other Bible software programs and Logos blows them out of the water.  I know Logos is working on updating their applications on all fronts constantly (lots of eggs in the basket).  They will continue to be THE premium Bible software choice for the foreseeable future IMO.  I don't agree with all things Logos... but the program can't be beat on the desk-top side of things.

Posts 5321
Dan Francis | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Nov 17 2011 8:45 AM

You are expressing our opinion and that is not a bad thing… It is a bit expensive but outdated is not something I would call it… If you are running it on an older computer it will go very slow, it has many built in advertisements on it's default home screen but these can all be turned off. If you are talking about out of print works being outdated. yes there are a lot of those and in particular if you don;t purchase them in community pricing they can seem exceptionally overpriced. Logos gets current books within a couple years of publication usually (and sometimes within weeks of physical publication), so you can hardly fault them for having less than current published works and usually at a completive price. I personally do not like the mobile APP choices made, i would have preferred to be able to sync on my computer any resources I own, not just ones they can getting  permission to place in their Logos cloud. And on the mobile front I will say things seem to had stalled out, but that is basically because they are trying to get a second mobile platform up and running once Android is out of beta, i would expect to see notes and highlites on the mobile platforms likely being a top priority. I personally would like a quick way to switch resources, like we have on the desktop machines or a way of logging out so only resources we have downloaded to our devices are used. Again these mobile features may make it to a new version sometime but i don;t expect to see anything till Android is caught up.

These are just my feelings in response to your frustrations but i will say while at times regretting an occasional purchase, over all i regret nothing about the over all owning of a piece of software that helps me so much.

 

-Dan

Posts 11433
DMB | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Nov 17 2011 8:55 AM

I can't speak to 'history'. And I thoroughly love my Libronix. But shopping on the A-company site is really depressing sometimes. Even the B-company. Now I get catalogs from the C-company and I have to quickly drop them in the bin in the garage it's so depressing. Back to Libronix.

"God will save his fallen angels and their broken wings He'll mend."

Posts 3134
Doc B | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Nov 17 2011 8:56 AM

Gene Britton:
Am I wrong?

Yes, I think you are.

I think you've started taking this kind of technology for granted and have lost your focus.

'Outdated' is one word I can see that has zero application to Logos. The folks over there are working like crazy with limited resources to get as many requests fulfilled as they can. (I say limited resources because they don't charge much for the software...if you've ever purchased software with similar capabilities on a business model, you know what I'm talking about...this thing would cost forty thousand dollars if it was marketed to businesses by a F500 company.)

If you aren't careful, you may become your own worst enemy. At the (considerable) risk of sounding like R. Schuller, stop looking at the glass as half-empty.

(You asked for an opinion...there it is.)

My thanks to the various MVPs. Without them Logos would have died early. They were the only real help available.

Faithlife Corp. owes the MVPs free resources for life.

Posts 30690
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JT (alabama24) | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Nov 17 2011 9:05 AM

Gene Britton:
the inability to highlight on my ipad

Gene - Logos is working very hard on this. One thing you need to consider is that first and foremost, Logos is concerned about their desktop application. The iPad app is great, they are working on it, but the desktop app drives the mobile app, not the other way around. To be able to bring notes & highlighting to the mobile app, Logos is changing the sync infrastructure in L4. This change is a major (albeit "behind the scenes") feature of 4.5, which is in beta now. 

If you want some hope about the mobile app & highlighting, see THIS THREAD.

macOS, iOS & iPadOS | Logs |  Install

Posts 8
Peter Bowers | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Nov 17 2011 9:15 AM

Outdated?  No, I think there's good functionality and a good UI -- Logos is an excellent piece of software.

But EXPENSIVE?!  YES!  My son just asked me if he could put some Bible software on his computer.  Obviously I was very pleased to help him in this and obviously I started looking at my long-time favorite, Logos.  The packages were not applicable to him because he's just looking for a Bible version or maybe 2-3, but he's not planning on reading books and etc.  So I looked at NIV, NASB, NKJV -- THE CHEAPEST BIBLE I COULD FIND WAS $25!!!  What's the deal with that?!

I will end up either deciding I can kind of call myself the primary user of his computer (it's iffy, but I think I could come down on that side) or else I will direct him to another software package.  Chances are that once he starts using another software package he will gradually invest in it and won't be coming back to Logos.  Not the direction I would prefer, but if he has to pay more for an e-bible than for a print-bible I simply can't in good conscience encourage him to go that way!

Posts 579
Jim VanSchoonhoven | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Nov 17 2011 9:22 AM

I recently had a stroke and lost my memory,but I do know logos is expensive. the cost is very high, buy I remember it changed how I study.  The truth is Logos needs to change some of their pricing, if they do not they will suffer, we do not live in the same times as we did a few years ago, however because of the hard times more people are willing to buy Logos, but they will soon have to stop buying resources if things stay this bad.  Of course Logos could help by making the product more affordable and people would keep buying more resources.

As far as an outdated product goes you have lost me on that one, before the stroke I taught a lot of people how to use different bible study programs, overall I found Logos to me the best out there, can you give an eample of a more up to date program???

From what I have seen, if  I dropped Logos where would I go???

In Christ,

Jim 

Posts 3578
steve clark | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Nov 17 2011 9:28 AM

Peter Bowers:
So I looked at NIV, NASB, NKJV -- THE CHEAPEST BIBLE I COULD FIND WAS $25!!!

If you search the internet for "ebible deluxe" AND libronix  you will find a cheap alternative which runs under Libronix. i did this for my sister and she also got the free Logos4 engine which recognized the books. She later when she could afford it bought a Logos4 base package.

QLinks, Bibl2, LLR, Macros
Dell Insp 17-5748, i5, 1.7 GHz, 8G RAM, win 8.1

Posts 135
Gene Britton | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Nov 17 2011 9:38 AM

These are good replies and you are helping me with them.  I have used Logos for over a decade and it has changed the way I study and prepare my lessons.  I may be in a half empty mode today but I am not usually.  Several of you pointed out that Logos is still king of the desktop and I have used nothing else lately to doubt that.  However I am changing.  I use to carry a laptop with me but I rarely do that anymore and often find myself with my Ipad and Iphone and Logos is just not where I think they should be with those instruments. Logos got to the top of the Bible software industry by being ahead of the game and it just appears to me that they are behind on the direction that some of us find ourselves going.  I do not doubt  that they will get there, but when they do, my concern is they will be behind somewhere else.  I want my favorite software to be the leader in all aspects of Bible study software.  I guess I am in a half empty mode today for sure!

Posts 3134
Doc B | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Nov 17 2011 9:43 AM

Gene Britton:
I guess I am in a half empty mode today for sure!

We all  have those.

Like the guy who was turned into a newt, you'll eventually say (in your best Brit accent), "I got better!"

Big Smile

My thanks to the various MVPs. Without them Logos would have died early. They were the only real help available.

Faithlife Corp. owes the MVPs free resources for life.

Posts 8967
RIP
Matthew C Jones | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Nov 17 2011 9:49 AM

Gene Britton:
Is this just me and am I being too critical?  
Thanks for asking. Big Smile I think your perspective is a little skewed today.
Gene Britton:
like this morning the ICC commentary set at 1200
That is a sale price. That could also be another car in my driveway Yes, it is not pocket change but is a significant savings over the regular selling price. Does any other Bible study software offer a refined (legible & tagged) version of ICC?
Gene Britton:
My appeal is that the company will energize its efforts to become the state of the art leader that it once was
Many have complained they thought Logos already has too many irons in the fire. Funny thing is, each of us wants our iron to be the one being heated. I personally have no need whatsoever for Proclaim. I don't own an iPad or Android (yet) and I don't think Logos should try to replicate the desktop on a handheld. I am still using OneNote, so notes in Logos is not my pet project either.
Gene Britton:
as of late it appears to me that the product is outdated and too expensive.
Logos seems to be attempting to be all things to all Bible students. There are efforts to offer many scholarly works (Brill, T&T/Clark, SPCK, Baker Academic.) There are efforts to publish multilingual works (Chinese, Korean, Czech, Russian, Spanish.) They keep up with the the latest in manuscript & original language studies (Dead Sea Scrolls, SEBS, Reverse Interlinears, Near Eastern documents.) Logos moved to the cloud based syncing model so all of your devices will have parallel access. They are reaching out to Women, Catholics, many smaller denominations, and some esoteric readers. They seem to be set on publishing every commentary ever printed. The prolific release of resources indicates Logos does not expect for each of us to buy everything they produce. If one becomes silly enough to want everything,  (think Stick out tongue Matthew C Jones & Stick out tongue Lynden Williams & Stick out tongue Rosie) they will quickly be drowned in the flood of new releases. But, oh, what a nice way to go.

imho: Logos is not cheap, nor is it outdated.  Thanks again for asking.

 

Logos 7 Collectors Edition

Posts 5337
Kevin Becker | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Nov 17 2011 9:53 AM

Gene Britton:
my concern is they will be behind somewhere else

I find Bob's post here: http://community.logos.com/forums/p/40084/299243.aspx#299243 to be very illuminating on this issue (the main point of the thread is Mac, but it touches on mobile too)

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JT (alabama24) | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Nov 17 2011 10:30 AM

Peter Bowers:
I will end up either deciding I can kind of call myself the primary user of his computer (it's iffy, but I think I could come down on that side) or else I will direct him to another software package.

Is you son at home, or is he grown? If he is at home, I think you could justify it. Other than that, the questions I would want answered is 1) why does he want "bible software" and 2) what will he use the software for? There is certainly some cheap software out there, but you "get what you pay for." Actually, much of what you can do with the cheap software you can do online for free. 

Logos is a great program for serious study. It's usefulness is expanding with the mobile apps and the Vyrso store. 

macOS, iOS & iPadOS | Logs |  Install

Posts 11433
DMB | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Nov 17 2011 10:38 AM

Alabama ... goodness! On eSword, one doesn't do 'serious' Bible study? I've more 'serious' resources on eSword than I do on Logos.

No offense (truly) mind you, but Logos' behavior really seems to bring out a lot hand-wringing, rationalization on rules, etc. It's amazing to see how well meaning pastors struggle to remain positive.

And for Gene, I've the greatest admiration. Go FC!

"God will save his fallen angels and their broken wings He'll mend."

Posts 8
Peter Bowers | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Nov 17 2011 11:05 AM

This is MUCH more reasonable!  If it had NIV I would purchase it immediately (he does all his memory work in NIV).  We may yet go down this road...  Thanks for the idea.

Posts 30690
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JT (alabama24) | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Nov 17 2011 11:06 AM

Denise Barnhart:
Alabama ... goodness! On eSword, one doesn't do 'serious' Bible study? I've more 'serious' resources on eSword than I do on Logos.

I didn't mean to be insulting. Are you saying that eSword's library is as vast as Logos?

Denise Barnhart:
Logos' behavior really seems to bring out a lot hand-wringing

Since you have more "serious" resources on eSword, and since Logos brings you so much hand-wringing, why do you waste your time here?

macOS, iOS & iPadOS | Logs |  Install

Posts 11433
DMB | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Nov 17 2011 11:11 AM

That's easy. Because I'm not as smart as George!

"God will save his fallen angels and their broken wings He'll mend."

Posts 30690
Forum MVP
JT (alabama24) | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Nov 17 2011 11:19 AM

Denise Barnhart:
I'm not as smart as George!

Alas, who is, Denise, who is? Stick out tongue

macOS, iOS & iPadOS | Logs |  Install

Posts 579
Jim VanSchoonhoven | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Nov 17 2011 12:42 PM

When it comes to tablets and phones Logos is a little behind, but how many other programscan be run on so many platforms?

As far as a good free bible program for the man's son try looking at theWord, I have over 3700 resources and many of those are commentaries, so the book count is much higher, they offer a limmited amount of pay copyrighted bibles,  bibles such as the NIV at good prices. You can make collections and search one collection or all your books at once. It has an easy to use note system and you can write your own books in it.  It is not Logos but it is the way I must go in order to have many public domain books that can be searched.

In Christ,

Jim

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