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Matthew C Jones | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Nov 19 2011 11:20 AM

alabama24:
The iPad is NOT an iPhone; The iPad is NOT a laptop. It is a unique device that I use everyday. The millions sold prove that out.

This is where I get confused. The whole Apple approach seems to attempt the convergence of all my hardware devices. Nina & I went to Starbucks last night and I observed a young man who thinks he is digitally connected. He walked in with his laptop bag slung over his shoulder. After setting up his computer he stood up and whipped out his iPhone and his Blackberry, one in each hand, and synchronized them. It just seemed a little burdensome or maybe he just doesn't get the convenience part of being "connected."

Jack Caviness:
Gene Britton:
At this point the Ipad is not much more than a reader
That is pretty much what I thought it was designed to be—an overgrown iPhone without the phone, which is the reason I never purchased one.
My son makes phone calls from his iPad (using VOIP? I don't know. I didn't ask.) But when I finally do get an iPad, and I will, I do not think I will do a whole lot more than reading on it. I try to avoid integrated hardware as much as possible.

If Logos wants to replicate all the functionality of the desktop app on the iPad, more power to them. I just need a reader I can hi-lite.

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JT (alabama24) | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Nov 19 2011 11:52 AM

ST - I don't think you are confused... It's the dork with the blackberry. Stick out tongue

If you only plan on reading with an iPad, don't waste your money. Get a $70 kindle. It would be a better reader.

 

The reason to get an iPad is to use all of the various apps. This includes: reading, email, notes, video, games, social media, web browsing, playing music, calendar, GPS, etc. If you don't plan on doing these things, why spend the money?

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Todd Phillips | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Nov 19 2011 12:06 PM

alabama24:
Get a $70 kindle. It would be a better reader.

Not if you want to read Logos books.

Wiki Links: Enabling Logging / Detailed Search Help - MacBook Pro (2014), ThinkPad E570

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Matthew C Jones | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Nov 19 2011 12:11 PM

alabama24:
If you only plan on reading with an iPad, don't waste your money. Get a $70 kindle. It would be a better reader. The reason to get an iPad is to use all of the various apps. This includes: reading, email, notes, video, games, social media, web browsing, playing music, calendar, GPS, etc. If you don't plan on doing these things, why spend the money?

I like the idea of running all those apps. I just don't think I'd need the iPad to be able to do in-depth studies with Logos. I have a netbook with Logos for those long waiting room stints. Now I am starting to sound like the "well connected " guy at Starbucks. Adding an iPad to my arsenal of hardware when I could be replacing something with the iPad. Maybe I should encourage all the Logos iPad app development I can.

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Matthew C Jones | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Nov 19 2011 12:18 PM

Todd Phillips:
alabama24:
Get a $70 kindle. It would be a better reader.
Not if you want to read Logos books.

I know very little about the Kindle other than I really like the eInk because I can read it so easily.

How much of my Logos library can be accessed from Biblia.com on a Kindle ? I read something about using a Kindle 3G to access websites other than Amazon's.

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MJD | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Nov 19 2011 12:20 PM

alabama24:

 

If you only plan on reading with an iPad, don't waste your money. Get a $70 kindle. It would be a better reader.

It is real difficult to read the Kindle in the dark, you will need a source of light.  IdeaThe Ipad is great to read in the dark!

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Todd Phillips | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Nov 19 2011 12:24 PM

Super Tramp:

Todd Phillips:
alabama24:
Get a $70 kindle. It would be a better reader.
Not if you want to read Logos books.

I know very little about the Kindle other than I really like the eInk because I can read it so easily.

How much of my Logos library can be accessed on a Kindle from Biblia.com? I read something about using a Kindle 3G to access websites other than Amazon's.

You'll have to ask those with Kindles, but if you search the forum, there has been discussion about that in the past.  I don't think biblia works with the kindle browser, but library.logos.com does.

Wiki Links: Enabling Logging / Detailed Search Help - MacBook Pro (2014), ThinkPad E570

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Michael Childs | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Nov 19 2011 1:00 PM

I have been buying only Logos software for Bible study for at least 16 years. I think more, but it is hard to remember. I had the old CDWORD program before Logos, and Logos bought the rights to CDWORD content, and I upgraded to what must have been close to the first Logos program available. Since Logos came along, I have tried to get my resources in Logos format exclusively.

I still think Logos is a great program. It has helped me to build a wonderful library for which I am thankful. In the earlier days it seemed that the company bent over backwards to do the right thing with every customer. Lately, not so much.

I am beginning to wonder if my strategy of exclusive Logos Bible resources is still wise. Frankly, I have been somewhat turned off by what I consider deceptive advertising. I get a solicitation for a price that is 60% off, but in reality is far less off. That 60% is off an imaginary price that no one on the planet charges, including Logos. The real discount may be 30 or 20%. The first and only time that I bit at one of those artificial bait prices was the day that my naive trust in Logos ceased. Some degree of the exclusive loyalty that I felt died. It may not bother others, but it does me. It is mighty close to a lie, in my opinion.

The realization that the fee for books purchased in a "payment plan" is higher than my credit card charges in interest for a purchase of around $500 is another thing that bothers me. Apparently it doesn't bother most, but the return exceeds 15% per year. That is on top of the profit in the resource purchase, and it bothers me. Especially, when I read posts talking about how generous Logos is to offer the payment plan.

The price of many resources are simply too high, but I do not blame Logos for that exclusively.  Publishers have much of the blame, but some of it I suspect lies with Logos as well.  I feel I have little reason to think that they would not do anything - right up to deception to maximize profits.

I no longer trust anything Logos tells me until I verify it. That is not a good feeling about your Bible software company.

Also, the "fan boy" attitude toward Logos, which I used to share, is a real turn off.  I can not blindly applaud everything they do.

But, at this point I have far too much invested to not stick with Logos. Besides, it is a great program, and I do most of my serious study with it. I still love it, but I sure have a "lover's quarrel" with it too.

 

"In all cases, the Church is to be judged by the Scripture, not the Scripture by the Church," John Wesley

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MJ. Smith | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Nov 19 2011 1:21 PM

Michael Childs:
Frankly, I have been somewhat turned off by what I consider deceptive advertising.

agreed

Michael Childs:
The realization that the fee for books purchased in a "payment plan" is higher than my credit card charges in interest

agreed, although I would point out that putting it on your credit card is always an option.

Michael Childs:
The price of many resources are simply too high

agreed but assume the market forces support them ... compare some of the Brill prices in traditional formats.

Michael Childs:
I no longer trust anything Logos tells me until I verify it.

My trust level has not changed ... it all depends on your starting point, I guess.

Michael Childs:
Also, the "fan boy" attitude toward Logos,

I find the forums evenly balanced at the extremes - fan boys and nay sayers. Of the two, the nay sayers are the more annoying in their abuse of objective information; the fan boys more dangerous in the responses they evoke. I hope they are both better exegeters of Scripture than they are of forum posts.Stick out tongue

 

Orthodox Bishop Hilarion Alfeyev: "To be a theologian means to have experience of a personal encounter with God through prayer and worship."

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George Somsel | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Nov 19 2011 1:31 PM

MJ. Smith:
I hope they are both better exegeters of Scripture than they are of forum posts.Stick out tongue

Yes, they do give one the "jitters" sometimes.  Perhaps they could get us another Jeter (Go Yankees — next year).

george
gfsomsel

יְמֵי־שְׁנוֹתֵינוּ בָהֶם שִׁבְעִים שָׁנָה וְאִם בִּגְבוּרֹת שְׁמוֹנִים שָׁנָה וְרָהְבָּם עָמָל וָאָוֶן

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Jack Caviness | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Nov 19 2011 1:34 PM

alabama24:
Jack - I've never seen you so wrong... Stick out tongue

My bride would probably tell you that I have been much more wrong than this, but then she has lived with me for 50 years Geeked. Nice to know that the iPad is more than I thought it was, but still not tempted to purchase one—or am I? A fellow Church member brings one on Wednesday evenings and uses it to record prayer needs. Guess he could tell me more. Have to be careful though, as he manages a Verizon store Big Smile

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Matthew C Jones | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Nov 19 2011 1:47 PM

MJ. Smith:
the fan boys more dangerous in the responses they evoke. I hope they are both better exegeters of Scripture than they are of forum posts.Stick out tongue
At the risk of evoking a bad response from an MVP trained in linguistics & philology, Is the correct word not "exegeses" rather than "exegeters?" Devil Oops, I should've abstained from my exegesis of urban colloquialisms. Zip it!


As for me, I would much rather ride the slow train to Boston with a bunch of positive passengers than complainers.

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George Somsel | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Nov 19 2011 1:59 PM

Super Tramp:
At the risk of evoking a bad response from an MVP trained in linguistics & philology, Is the correct word not "exegeses" rather than "exegeters?" Devil

"Exegesis" is the practice of explicating a text.  I think she was referring to those who practice exegesis. 

exegete (ˈɛksɪˌdʒiːt) or exegetist (ˌɛksɪˈdʒiːtɪst -ˈdʒɛt-) n a person who practises exegesis [c18: from Greek exēgētēs, from exēgeisthai to interpret; see exegesis]

Collins English Dictionary.  

8th ed., Complete & unabridged ed. Glasgow: HarperCollins, 2006.

george
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יְמֵי־שְׁנוֹתֵינוּ בָהֶם שִׁבְעִים שָׁנָה וְאִם בִּגְבוּרֹת שְׁמוֹנִים שָׁנָה וְרָהְבָּם עָמָל וָאָוֶן

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Denise | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Nov 19 2011 2:05 PM

Well, this thread has been quite illuminating.

I was most surprised with the iPad comments. From what it looks like, folks want a portable PDF reader (not literally, but in terms of functionality ... read, notes, highlight). Plus listen to music and do email, I guess.

Then there's the group that is really uncomfortable with less than positive comments. Here in Sedona, they call that 'disinformation' and it's always wrong. But I'm always curious why.

It's VERY easy to look at the view counts and see people really like to read negative comments. Especially when they're always wrong.

 


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Matthew C Jones | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Nov 19 2011 2:24 PM

MJ. Smith:
Of the two, the nay sayers are the more annoying in their abuse of objective information; the fan boys more dangerous in the responses they evoke. I hope they are both better exegeters of Scripture than they are of forum posts.Stick out tongue

First, diagram the last sentence in MJ's quote above. Then go find "exegeters" in any reference other than the urban dictionary. It's not there. I believe MJ  chose this word for the same reason she uses "idjiot", or however she spells it. Surprise

George Somsel:
"Exegesis" is the practice of explicating a text. 
True, and "exegeses" is the plural of "exegete." And an "exegete" is a person who does "exegesis." An "exegeter" is closer to a sports hero named Jeeter or a dude that casts demons out.

Denise Barnhart:
Well, this thread has been quite illuminating.
I aim to educate and enlighten. Failing that, I will settle for amuse and annoy. Coffee

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Matthew C Jones | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Nov 19 2011 2:37 PM

Denise Barnhart:
It's VERY easy to look at the view counts and see people really like to read negative comments. Especially when they're always wrong.

Hollywood has trained this generation well. We tune in for the drama.  It is a well known fact people who are satisfied generally never make a big fuss over it. We just leave a bigger tip on the table for the waiter. It is the customer who gets the rock in their soup that makes a scene and yells for the manager or chef. (And they have every right to be unhappy about it.)  But to assume just because we all tune in to the drama on the inflammatory hyperbolic threads does not mean a good 90% of the 750,000 user base is having a bad experience with the software.

Some people have been known to draw a lot of attention walking out of the bathroom with toilet paper stuck to their shoe. But the vast majority of people walk out without fanfare. If we bother noticing, we only talk about the minority that created the drama of the day.

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George Somsel | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Nov 19 2011 2:40 PM

Super Tramp:
I aim to educate and enlighten. Failing that, I will settle for amuse and annoy. Coffee

But you can't annoy half as effectively as I can.  Nah, nah, nah.  Stick out tongue  Big Smile

george
gfsomsel

יְמֵי־שְׁנוֹתֵינוּ בָהֶם שִׁבְעִים שָׁנָה וְאִם בִּגְבוּרֹת שְׁמוֹנִים שָׁנָה וְרָהְבָּם עָמָל וָאָוֶן

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Denise | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Nov 19 2011 2:51 PM

You could be right, ST.

But absent some expert knowledge of sociology (your area I think), most people at heart just don't want whatever it is to happen to them. Spilled soup, waiter that gets the order wrong, or the major car pileup on the 5pm news.

Presently I'm investigating a new PC and Logos4 will be a star participant.  I would very much like to purchase a PC that I will be confident will run L4 breezily. But the absence of any usable(?) advice from Mother Logos and mucho usable(?) advice from the noisy Logosian children causes me pause. I would far prefer accurate advice from the Logosian experts who live just south of the Canadian border.

So maybe the noise level might also be associated with the limited information gleanable from those most qualified to comment.

 


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Praiser | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Nov 19 2011 4:00 PM

Super Tramp:

Todd Phillips:
alabama24:
Get a $70 kindle. It would be a better reader.
Not if you want to read Logos books.

I know very little about the Kindle other than I really like the eInk because I can read it so easily.

How much of my Logos library can be accessed from Biblia.com on a Kindle ? I read something about using a Kindle 3G to access websites other than Amazon's.

 

I just got my Kindle keyboard a couple of weeks ago. Yes I can access my Logos books on it via Biblia.com and library.logos.com using the wireless connection.
Use your computer to sign into these sites and see how much of your library would be available to read on a Kindle. I have a large library and 94 percent of it is available.

 

You can use the experimental browser to log into the sites.

I like using Biblia.com the best in "mobile view" since I can change the font size and it makes my Logos resources more like the other books that you can read on the Kindle. The drawback is moving from one screen to the next as you have to tab the "arrow cursor" to be over the arrows that advance biblia to the next screen. Advancing down the same screen works well with the "next page" "previous page" buttons.  I have done passage guides using library.logos.com and they have worked fine.  It takes some getting use to the Kindles way of navigating the pages, but it works and the more I use it the easier it seems to get.  For a reader I am really liking it.  The e-ink is much more enjoyable than a back lit screen.

Photos below are of the Kindle using the experimental browser logged into biblia.com. The book is ICC Romans by Cranfield. The first one is at 200% the second one is at 300%

 

I'm REALLY LIKING IT.Big Smile

I can access every website that I have tried using the browser with my home wireless router.

 

I have copied this post to a new tread here. Since it really doesn't have anything to do with this treads topic.

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George Somsel | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Nov 19 2011 4:08 PM

OK, cough it up.  How do I connect?  I haven't figured that out yet and I don't recall seeing any instructions on it (And you think Logos doesn't provide enough documentation? Surprise).  I'm going to the hospital Monday for some minor surgery so it would be nice to be able to connect there — maybe I can read while they're carving.  Wink

george
gfsomsel

יְמֵי־שְׁנוֹתֵינוּ בָהֶם שִׁבְעִים שָׁנָה וְאִם בִּגְבוּרֹת שְׁמוֹנִים שָׁנָה וְרָהְבָּם עָמָל וָאָוֶן

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