What will 16GB of memory do for Logos 4 that 4GB, 8GB and 12GB won't?…

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Michael Anda | Forum Activity | Posted: Tue, Dec 6 2011 12:24 AM

I have two 2GB modules currently installed in two of the four slots on the motherboard.  If I change it ALL out to get the 16, should I look for any particular upgrade?  I'm looking for some specifics here regarding system improvement and/or stability.

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Nathan Madison | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Dec 6 2011 12:31 AM

this is a very techie question and has a lot of things that come into play concerning your system ie.. which operationing system you have mac or windows and if windows which version 32bit or 64 bit. in short the extra memory can be used as whats called cache (temp storage) which helps speed up some computer operations..

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Keep Smiling 4 Jesus :) | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Dec 6 2011 12:43 AM

Currently, Logos 4 is a 32 bit application on Windows (and Mac), which can effectively use up to 2 GB.  Additional RAM helps for many open programs and caching files for quicker access.

A blog article describes Windows 7 memory usage => http://www.zdnet.com/blog/bott/windows-7-memory-usage-whats-the-best-way-to-measure/1786

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Dave Hooton | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Dec 6 2011 4:14 AM

From the Benchmark thread we assume you have Windows 7 Home Premium which will support a maximum of 16 GB memory with 64-bit OS. But check that your motherboard will support 16 GB memory and get a 16 GB kit (4 x 4GB) as these matched components will maximise performance and reliability. But I think a 12 GB kit would be more than sufficient for L4 given that L4 can only be allocated a maximum of 4 GB (as with any other 32-bit process on a 64 bit OS) and probably doesn't consume more than 300-400 MB in normal use. An SSD will have greater impact.

 

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Mark Barnes | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Dec 6 2011 8:33 AM

Personally, I recommend a minimum of approximately 1Gb RAM for every 1,000 Logos books you own. As you'll have noticed, Logos hits your hard drive pretty hard when in use. The more files can be cached in your RAM, the quicker Logos will be. Although Logos itself can only use 2Gb of your RAM, the file-caching is handled by Windows itself, and there's no maximum on how many files can be cached. So 16Gb is probably over-kill for the moment, though getting 16Gb it will be a bit faster than 8Gb or 12Gb. If your budget is tight, I'd be inclined to buy 2x4Gb sticks for the two empty slots. That will give you 12Gb, and you can always upgrade later again if you need to.

So to answer you question specifically. 16Gb may not do much than 12Gb, or even 8Gb at the moment. But:

  1. You can never have too much RAM. If you don't need it now, you will soon.
  2. Buying 2x2Gb sticks limits your future upgrade path. So, if you can afford it, get 2x4Gb. If you find you still want more performance, get another 2x4Gb later. If not, buy some more Logos books!
Posts 233
Michael Anda | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Dec 6 2011 9:54 AM

Is there some worthwhile advantage in having the SAME four modules in each of my four slots?  Is there any advantage in a higher spec memory module for use with Logos 4, MS Office, or Google Chrome.  I don't anticipate any desire to get into any high performance activities like computer gaming.  I do value reliability.  Is that aspect improved by using the SAME four sticks?  Are the answers to these questions in KS4J's link?

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Dave Hooton | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Dec 6 2011 1:45 PM

Michael Anda:
Is there some worthwhile advantage in having the SAME four modules in each of my four slots?

In terms of reliability and compatibility:-

0. Only use combinations of memory type (DDR2, DDR3), frequency and stick size that are allowed by your computer (Motherboard restrictions).

1. Do not mix sticks from different manufacturers

2. Try to use sticks with the same performance specification  (CL, frequency)

3. Use a memory kit

In terms of performance and compatibility 3. is best but you can save money if you follow 2. carefully. Any performance gains of 3. are not noticeable when using the computer. The main challenge is to match the existing sticks if you are just going to fill the other 2 slots.

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Mark Barnes | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Dec 6 2011 2:32 PM

Michael Anda:
Is there some worthwhile advantage in having the SAME four modules in each of my four slots?  Is there any advantage in a higher spec memory module for use with Logos 4, MS Office, or Google Chrome.  I don't anticipate any desire to get into any high performance activities like computer gaming.  I do value reliability.  Is that aspect improved by using the SAME four sticks?  Are the answers to these questions in KS4J's link?

You'll almost certainly have four slots, which can be used as two dual-channel pairs. So, as Dave says, one pair (two sticks) should be identical to get the dual-channel performance gains, and ensure compatibility. In this case identical really means identical - same CAS/latency/size/manufacturer, everything.

But that's not the case with the two pairs. Each pair operates independently from the other, except that all four memory chips will run at the speed of the slowest. One pair can be a different size, come from a different manufacturer, have different spec to the other pair, without problems. Except, as I said above, the two pairs will run at the speed of the slowest.

So:

  • Don't buy a new pair that's slower than your existing pair.
  • Don't spend more to get a speed faster than the maximum your motherboard supports.
  • Don't spend more to get a speed faster than your existing pair, unless you think you may also replace the existing pair in the future, in which case get the fastest you can afford and your motherboard supports.

Posts 233
Michael Anda | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Dec 6 2011 9:40 PM

I notice that the two 2GB memory modules factory installed are separated from each other.  IOW, there is one unfilled memory slot separating one another.  Is this done for heat reasons, or some other technological nuance?

Is there a preferred memory stick for performance and/or reliability?  Do I want or need heat sinks, yada, yada, yada?  I doubt I'm going to find the same exact memory that's currently in the machine.  I tend to have one or two MS Office applications and Logos 4  running simultaneously along with Google Chrome with LOTS of tabs open.

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Michael Anda | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Dec 6 2011 9:57 PM

dual channel

quad channel

I don't think heat sinks will fit into my little box

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Keep Smiling 4 Jesus :) | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Dec 6 2011 10:32 PM

Michael Anda:
I notice that the two 2GB memory modules factory installed are separated from each other.

Sounds typical since many mother boards have:

  • A0 - Dimm is paired with A1
  • B0 - usage paired with B1
  • A1 - Dimm is paired with A0
  • B1 - usage paired with B0

Michael Anda:
quad channel

If all four Dimm slots have same memory capacity and specifications, memory operations can be spread across all four Dimm's.

Michael Anda:
Do I want or need heat sinks, yada, yada, yada?

Overclockers prefer (need) heat sinks since running components at faster speeds does generate more heat.

Michael Anda:
I tend to have one or two MS Office applications and Logos 4  running simultaneously along with Google Chrome with LOTS of tabs open.

Observation: each Google Chrome tab has its own memory allocation.

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Michael Anda | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Dec 6 2011 11:34 PM

One last question—hopefully.

EEC or Non-EEC? that is the question. 

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Keep Smiling 4 Jesus :) | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Dec 6 2011 11:45 PM

Michael Anda:
EEC or Non-EEC?

http://www.crucial.com/kb/answer.aspx?qid=3692

Servers tend to have EEC memory while personal computers tend to have non-EEC.

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Michael Anda | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Dec 7 2011 12:01 AM

Who knew?  Thanks, KS4J  Geeked

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Mark Barnes | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Dec 7 2011 2:52 AM

Michael Anda:
IOW, there is one unfilled memory slot separating one another.  Is this done for heat reasons, or some other technological nuance?

It's technology. The four slots are almost always built in the configuration ABAB, and coloured that way. So I'd expect the factory setting to use the two A slots.

Michael Anda:
Is there a preferred memory stick for performance and/or reliability?

Not really. Buy branded, but for you needs to don't need ultra performance. Crucial, Kingston, OCZ, G-Skill, Corsair are all reputable brands. The more expensive chips will allow you to overclock and still be reliable. You probably don't want to do this, because overclocking is an art that takes time to learn, and requires significant investment in cooling for various components.

As regards to ECC/non-ECC, as KS4J says, ECC is for servers. It's unlikely your motherboard supports it, and even more unlikely your existing chips would be ECC. ECC sacrifices speed for ultra-reliability. You don't need it.

My recommendation remains the same. By 2x4Gb and see if you like the speed increase. If you find your getting lots of disk-churning even at 12Gb (which I doubt), then buy another 2, and throw away your old chips. You've got nothing to lose by only buying an additional 8Gb to start.

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Bill Moore | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Dec 7 2011 7:16 AM

I don't know what will be gained by 16GB, but I would do as Mark suggested and get two 4GB modules and have 12GB total.

My Lenovo ThinkPad T500 notebook came with two 2GB. Logos 4 has been relatively slow since I've had the computer for some two years now. With the lower prices of RAM, I bought two 4GB Crucial modules from Newegg and installed them a couple of days ago--probably the best $32.95 I have spent in a good while. The difference in speed is very noticeable.

Pastor, Cornerstone Baptist Church, Clinton, SC

Posts 233
Michael Anda | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Dec 7 2011 7:56 AM

One more 'concern' arose today.  Opening up the case I see that one SDRAM is not likely removable without removing the optical drive.  Do I want to go to the extra trouble?  Looks like adding two 4GB modules is the most practical approach in more ways than one.

Thanks, all.   

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