Base Package for an Intermediate Greek Student

Page 1 of 1 (13 items)
This post has 12 Replies | 1 Follower

Posts 1
Tim Beyer | Forum Activity | Posted: Sat, Jun 30 2012 7:17 PM

My question really has two parts.

First, I am currently scheduled to take Intermediate Greek this coming fall, and in the syllabus for the class, in the "recommended resources" section, the professor suggests getting Bible Works.  However, after a fair amount of research, Logos seems to be in many ways superior, especially when it comes to resources beyond Greek and Hebrew tools.  

So my first question is this: Other than BW being faster (which seems to be the main advantage) are there other reasons I should consider BW over Logos?

Second,  as I was comparing the packages, I narrowed my choices down to Original Languages and Scholars Library.  First I thought Original Languages seemed like the logical choice for my needs, however as I compared them it seems as though Scholars Library offers innumerably more in terms of resources beyond Greek and Hebrew tools while still offering the basics required for Greek and Hebrew work.  I'm not fully up to speed on what exactly all the original language tools offered in "Original Languages" are, but it seems like most of the tools not included in Scholars go beyond the depth of what I'll need in intermediate Greek.

So my second question is this: Does Scholars Library offer enough original languages tools to meet my needs in Intermediate Greek? Or to ask it in a slightly different way, What package would you recommend for a seminary student who feels called to pastor in the future?

Any help is greatly appreciated,

Tim 

Posts 325
Robert Wazlavek | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Jun 30 2012 7:39 PM

Tim Beyer:

Or to ask it in a slightly different way, What package would you recommend for a seminary student who feels called to pastor in the future?

All other things aside, if you're looking to become a pastor in the future, I would recommend Scholar's.  Original Languages is obviously cheaper and may be all that you need at the moment.  However, Scholar's would be the better choice as far as preparing for your future ministry.  If God has indeed called you to pastor, I would again recommend Scholar's Library or higher for this reason.  If I could suggest it, I would say get Scholar's Silver (or higher) actually.  Scholar's Library does lack a number of resources that Original Languages has.  However, Silver has almost all of them.  But then again, like you said, you simply may not need them.  So get the one that you feel God leads you to get.

And remember to sign up for the Academic Discount.  You'll get a big cut off the base package prices.

Posts 9080
DAL | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Jun 30 2012 7:50 PM

Tim,

The best thing (and cheaper) you can do is buy original languages and then for a small fee upgrade to Scholar's edition.  You will get the best bang for your buck without paying that much.  If  you do this you will get all the original language resources that are only available in higher packages (e.g. Platinum) but you will also get a bunch of commentaries and other stuff that are available in Scholar's.  Now, from what I hear, if you buy Scholar's first and then original languages you will end up paying more.  Always talk to a sales rep for a better discount and since you are a student take advantage of Academic Discount! Hope this helps!

Blessings!

DAL

Posts 9080
DAL | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Jun 30 2012 7:58 PM

One more thing: If you can afford it go for Platinum instead.  It'll be a great blessings to have all those resources and you won't have to worry about the original language package since it's a part of Platinum already.  If you wish you can put it on payment plan (about 80 a month for 12 months).  It's a great investment!

DAL

Posts 2729
David Thomas | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Jun 30 2012 8:40 PM

I am very happy with my resources. I have Scholars Silver then added BDAG/HALOT, NIDOTTE, & Lexham Discourse Greek New Testament (7 volumes). I am watching the Lexham Discourse Hebrew Old Testament which is about to come out of Pre-pub pricing. The Lexham Discourse resources will be a HUGE difference between beginniers in orig languages and those with intermediate skills that consider meaning beyond the word level.

Making Disciples!  Logos Ecosystem = Logos8 on Microsoft Surface Pro 4 (Win10), Android app on tablet, FSB on iPhone, [deprecated] Windows App, Proclaim, Faithlife.com, FaithlifeTV via Connect subscription.

Posts 128
Simon Pleasants | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Jun 30 2012 9:09 PM

Tim Beyer:

So my first question is this: Other than BW being faster (which seems to be the main advantage) are there other reasons I should consider BW over Logos?

There's been a helpful discussion about the relative merits of Logos 4 and BibleWorks 9 in this recent thread:

http://community.logos.com/forums/p/50813/374436.aspx#374436

 

 

"Upon a life I did not live, Upon a death I did not die, Another's life, another's death, I stake my whole eternity"

Horatius Bonar

Posts 824
GregW | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Jul 1 2012 1:29 AM

If you are an intermediate Greek student intending to become a pastor, then I would say (as someone who has both) that there is no contest between B****works and Logos.  You will be wanting to use Bible dictionaries and commentaries for sermon preparation, so Logos wins hands down, as the other product really does not do that well, or offer the range of dictionaries and commentaries that Logos does.  The other product does come with Wallace's Greek Grammar Beyond the Basisc, which you will probably need for an Intermediate Greek course, but you can add this to the Scholar's package in Logos.  If you are planning to get heavily involved in textual criticism, and will work purely with the Greek I can see the sense in buying BW, but for all-round exegetical work, sermon preparation, and reseach, you would be much better off following the advice given above. I used to use BW primarily, but since I became a pastor, have stopped using it and didn't take the last upgrade.  Logos offers me far more choices for developing my library, not just in terms of commentaries and dictionaries, but other academic literature as well. 

You do also get all the Leader's library included in the Scholar's, but the value to you of much of the material there will depend on your theological position.


Running Logos 6 Platinum and Logos Now on Surface Pro 4, 8 GB RAM, 256GB SSD, i5

Posts 15805
Forum MVP
Keep Smiling 4 Jesus :) | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Jul 1 2012 6:01 AM

Tim Beyer:
So my second question is this: Does Scholars Library offer enough original languages tools to meet my needs in Intermediate Greek? Or to ask it in a slightly different way, What package would you recommend for a seminary student who feels called to pastor in the future?

Welcome Big Smile

Looking at comparison charts => http://www.logos.com/comparison noticed Scholar's Gold includes all Original Languages.  Also, Scholar's Gold has my favorite commentary series => UBS New Testament Handbook Series and => UBS Old Testament Handbook Series

My favorite Logos 4 feature is visual filter highlighting; wiki Extended Tips for Visual Filters includes => Examples of visual filters with screen shots showing Logos Greek morphological highlighting in Greek and English resources.  Caveat: initial display of visual filters can take awhile, yet seeing range of verbal expression in a passage offers many insights.  Personally am amazed that Logos 4 can combine a number of visual filters.

Keep Smiling Smile

Posts 2964
tom | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Jul 1 2012 6:45 AM

Tim Beyer:

My question really has two parts.

First, I am currently scheduled to take Intermediate Greek this coming fall, and in the syllabus for the class, in the "recommended resources" section, the professor suggests getting Bible Works.  However, after a fair amount of research, Logos seems to be in many ways superior, especially when it comes to resources beyond Greek and Hebrew tools.  

So my first question is this: Other than BW being faster (which seems to be the main advantage) are there other reasons I should consider BW over Logos?

Second,  as I was comparing the packages, I narrowed my choices down to Original Languages and Scholars Library.  First I thought Original Languages seemed like the logical choice for my needs, however as I compared them it seems as though Scholars Library offers innumerably more in terms of resources beyond Greek and Hebrew tools while still offering the basics required for Greek and Hebrew work.  I'm not fully up to speed on what exactly all the original language tools offered in "Original Languages" are, but it seems like most of the tools not included in Scholars go beyond the depth of what I'll need in intermediate Greek.

So my second question is this: Does Scholars Library offer enough original languages tools to meet my needs in Intermediate Greek? Or to ask it in a slightly different way, What package would you recommend for a seminary student who feels called to pastor in the future?

Any help is greatly appreciated,

Tim 

As someone who has both, I still use BW over L4 because BW was built and designed to study the original languages.  IT IS by far the better program to study the original languages (IMHO). 

#1 BW is much cheaper than L4.  

#2 BW also has Manuscript Project and the vast apparatus in the CNTTS database.  

#3 Syntax databases still are not "all that" because it requires you to know how and why they call different parts what.  It's all subjective and more reflective of current ideas of syntax than ancient ones.  By comparison, BW's morphological analysis is much more objective.

#4 Over 20 years, BibleWorks has put a lot of effort into correcting their texts.   They take errors very seriously. Report an error and you'll find out that within 24 hours it will either be correct or someone will talk to you about it. 

#5 Notes in BW is by far better than L4

This being said, I use L4 more than BW because my study goes beyond just studying the text.  L4 is by far better in this area than BW.  Which package you need can only be answered by you.  I only purchased the OL package, and then I added the resources that I would (and do) use.  IMHO, the scholar packages are filled with a bunch of filler material; Items that I would never use.  

 

Posts 138
LogosEmployee
Clifford Kvidahl | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Jul 1 2012 9:08 AM

Tim,

Send me and email at cliff.kvidahl(at)logos(dot)com. I am currently the academic product manager and would love to help you with your questions. 

Cliff

Posts 8899
fgh | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Jul 1 2012 10:57 AM

tom collinge:
#4 Over 20 years, BibleWorks has put a lot of effort into correcting their texts.   They take errors very seriously. Report an error and you'll find out that within 24 hours it will either be correct or someone will talk to you about it. 

Wow!

"The Christian way of life isn't so much an assignment to be performed, as a gift to be received."  Wilfrid Stinissen

Mac Pro OS 10.9.

Posts 2849
mab | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Jul 1 2012 11:00 AM

Since you are a student, you have the advantage of getting Logos with an academic discount. Bible study is much more than just language-based inquiry.

Back in the day, students were forced to look at the original language text without everything sliced and diced. If you really want to learn, I suggest you do the same before turning on your computer for assistance.

 If you use Logos, get the best package you can even if it means paying it off gradually. You will soon realize just how great it is to have all or most of your resources connected in one place.

The mind of man is the mill of God, not to grind chaff, but wheat. Thomas Manton | Study hard, for the well is deep, and our brains are shallow. Richard Baxter

Posts 2964
tom | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Jul 1 2012 11:07 AM

Michael Ballai:
Bible study is much more than just language-based inquiry.
This depends on what your job is.  I know people who all they do is look at the text and teach the text.

Page 1 of 1 (13 items) | RSS