Logos 5 Botched Marketing Roll Out

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This post has 30 Replies | 5 Followers

Posts 258
Aaron Sauer | Forum Activity | Posted: Thu, Nov 1 2012 8:48 PM

Excited for Logos 5...it looks great! However Logos botched the roll out on this by creating a lot of confusion as to how to upgrade and how it relates to the revised base packages for existing users. They should have better explained options for existing customers and offered the crossgrade right from the beginning or at least given us a date when it would be offered. It makes existing users feel like 2nd class.

Posts 8660
TCBlack | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Nov 1 2012 9:52 PM

Aaron Sauer:
Logos botched the roll out on this by creating a lot of confusion as to how to upgrade and how it relates to the revised base packages for existing users.
Perhaps it's because I've been around Logos so long that I'm not confused. But I certainly see your point, reading the forums after being gone a few hours, confusion seems to have filled the air.

Let me provide a few answers that you probably already know Aaron, but others will read this too.

1.  You will always own the books you own right now.

2. If you own a package like GOLD JG,  you will ALWAYS own that package unless you upgrade to something else.

3. Even if you "downgrade" to the Home Library, you will STILL and ALWAYS own all the books you own right now.

4. Scholars Gold JG is Just plain different than Gold L5.  Perhaps it was a negative idea to re-use names. But what's in a name? I don't tattoo my library name like a status symbol to my forehead. (EDIT: sorry about that)

Aaron Sauer:
They should have better explained options for existing customers
In hindsight, extra explanation is always a good idea. And someone in my church is going to complain they didn't hear the announcements even if it is printed in the bulletin.

Aaron Sauer:
and offered the crossgrade right from the beginning or at least given us a date when it would be offered.
I suppose giving a date wouldn't have hurt at all. But then maybe it would have.  

Aaron Sauer:
It makes existing users feel like 2nd class.
That really bums me out. Aaron I believe I remember you being around for the L4 rollout. If not, I do remember your name. (It might be because my first Greek prof was named Dr. Sauer - any relation?)  Anyway my point: Hang on for another day or ten. I'll bet the surprise will begin to wane and clarity will come to many of the questions.

I can almost guarantee there are some marketing guys drinking pepto-bismol tonight. 

Hmm Sarcasm is my love language. Obviously I love you. 

Posts 9947
George Somsel | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Nov 1 2012 10:01 PM

TCBlack:
4. Scholars Gold JG is Just plain different than Gold L5.  Perhaps it was a negative idea to re-use names. But what's in a name? I don't tattoo my library name like a status symbol to my forehead.

Is that reserved for the triple 6?  Devil

george
gfsomsel

יְמֵי־שְׁנוֹתֵינוּ בָהֶם שִׁבְעִים שָׁנָה וְאִם בִּגְבוּרֹת שְׁמוֹנִים שָׁנָה וְרָהְבָּם עָמָל וָאָוֶן

Posts 8660
TCBlack | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Nov 1 2012 10:12 PM

George Somsel:

TCBlack:
4. Scholars Gold JG is Just plain different than Gold L5.  Perhaps it was a negative idea to re-use names. But what's in a name? I don't tattoo my library name like a status symbol to my forehead.

Is that reserved for the triple 6?  Devil

Actually I was just coming back to this thread to delete that bit. It was snarky and rude of me. I regret typing it.

Hmm Sarcasm is my love language. Obviously I love you. 

Posts 9
Nathanael King | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Nov 2 2012 12:05 AM

Totally agree!

Posts 258
Aaron Sauer | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Nov 2 2012 12:31 PM

I love Logos...the software and the company. However, I feel that the software/package upgrade roll out has been horrible. Existing users are very upset about thinking they have to pay several hundred dollars or even over a thousand dollars to upgrade to Logos 5. People are not only venting their frustration here on the forums but also on twitter and facebook. Logos should step in quickly and do damage control based on the confusion with the upgrade pricing options. The big risk here is alienating their existing users and bad press.

Logos please clearly communicate to your existing users what their options are if they want to upgrade to Logos 5 but don't want to upgrade their base package. I have a much better understanding after pouring through the forums but it is clear that many people still are not aware of the upcoming (hopefully soon) crossgrade. Many people don't use the forums so Logos needs to put this on their main website.

Posts 2519
Ronald Quick | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Nov 2 2012 12:47 PM

TCBlack:
Perhaps it's because I've been around Logos so long that I'm not confused.

I think the reason I am not feeling confused is because I remember the upgrade from L3 to L4.  But I do understand the reasons why others are.

Posts 987
Josh Hunt | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Nov 2 2012 12:54 PM

Aaron Sauer:

I love Logos...the software and the company. However, I feel that the software/package upgrade roll out has been horrible. Existing users are very upset about thinking they have to pay several hundred dollars or even over a thousand dollars to upgrade to Logos 5. People are not only venting their frustration here on the forums but also on twitter and facebook. Logos should step in quickly and do damage control based on the confusion with the upgrade pricing options. The big risk here is alienating their existing users and bad press.

Logos please clearly communicate to your existing users what their options are if they want to upgrade to Logos 5 but don't want to upgrade their base package. I have a much better understanding after pouring through the forums but it is clear that many people still are not aware of the upcoming (hopefully soon) crossgrade. Many people don't use the forums so Logos needs to put this on their main website.

Totally agree.

Straightforward question. I can upgrade to the cheapest package, get the new software for $50 and keep all my books, right (currently platinum)

Posts 1843
Ken McGuire | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Nov 2 2012 1:17 PM

Josh Hunt:

Straightforward question. I can upgrade to the cheapest package, get the new software for $50 and keep all my books, right (currently platinum)

My understanding is yes - you will keep your books.  But you will not get all the new addins, some of which you may very much desire for full functionality...

Personally I am waiting for money and a clearer upgrade path for my Original Languages package.

SDG

Ken McGuire

The Gospel is not ... a "new law," on the contrary, ... a "new life." - William Julius Mann

L8 Anglican, Lutheran and Orthodox Silver, Reformed Starter, Academic Essentials

L7 Lutheran Gold, Anglican Bronze

Posts 709
Russ Quinn | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Nov 2 2012 1:18 PM

They certainly didn't help to make this an impulse buy!

I'm having to work really hard to study the upgrade options to see what path is best for me.

I would have recommended capping an upgrade price for staying with in same package (gold to gold, platinum to platinum, etc) at $299.

That price point probably would have been a no-brainer, impulse buy (for me anyway).

A price point of over $500 to upgrade within my same package has made me think about it too much to close the deal.

I'm not quite sure what I'll eventually do at this point?

Posts 350
Chuck P. | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Nov 2 2012 1:34 PM

As for me, I am only using my Logos 4 to prepare Sunday School lessons, as I am not a Pastor.  Logos 4 is working great for me with a lot of money invested in my library....I don't know of any new features in the engine that I need....I have the Scholars Library and they want me to update to Silver, but I have an extensive library and the additiona books in Silver really do not look appealing to me for the price.  There's a lot of features I never use in Logos 4...I do not use Notes at all....all my work is done on Microsoft Word.

Chuck

Laptop: Lenovo P580 - 15.6" IdeaPad Laptop
 - 6GB Memory - 750GB Hard Drive - Windows 7
 Iphone5s            Logos 7, Bronze

Posts 29730
Forum MVP
JT (alabama24) | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Nov 2 2012 1:37 PM

Russ Quinn:
I would have recommended capping an upgrade price for staying with in same package (gold to gold, platinum to platinum, etc) at $299.

Russ Quinn:
A price point of over $500 to upgrade within my same package has made me think about it too much to close the deal

"Staying with in same package" is a misnomer. In a way, it is unfortunate that Logos kept the same named packages… but really it is irrelevant. The base package you have currently, you keep. The base package you may choose to purchase is brand new. You will pay for the NEW resources. The question you need to ask yourself is: "are the new resources worth it to me?" When you do this, forget what named package you had before and look at 1) what you can afford and 2) what resources you would like to have that are new to the base packages.

Here is a comment from Bob:

Bob Pritchett:

I'm sorry for the confusion created by the package names. We've been "re-using" collection names for changing collections for many years. (We've had a "Scholar's Library" for over a decade.) The collections are always changing -- the (KF) (JG) and other letter designations reflect changed collections as books are added, removed, etc. based on user needs and publisher licenses.

This particular cycle involved much bigger changes to the collections than in the past -- we even did away with some names (like Christian Home, Bible Study Library, Leader's, etc.) and decided to standardize this time on a more obviously hierarchical value proposition: Bronze, Silver, Gold, Platinum, Diamond, etc.

This name re-use has confused some people, for which I'm sorry. Having Platinum 4 doesn't mean you can only move to Platinum 5 -- you can upgrade to Bronze 5, or any other collection you'd like. In every case you just get (and only pay for!) what's different between what you have and what you're getting.

The levels are levels of book and content collections -- there isn't anything else to a level. We could call Platinum "The Fred Collection" -- it's just a named set of resources that's a different set than Bronze ("The Joe Collection"). We named them in hierarchy just to indicate which one has more resources. But really, all the 5 generation collections have more and different resources than the 4 generation.

-- Bob

macOS, iOS & iPadOS | Logs |  Install

Posts 987
Josh Hunt | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Nov 2 2012 1:44 PM

Russ Quinn:

They certainly didn't help to make this an impulse buy!

I'm having to work really hard to study the upgrade options to see what path is best for me.

I would have recommended capping an upgrade price for staying with in same package (gold to gold, platinum to platinum, etc) at $299.

That price point probably would have been a no-brainer, impulse buy (for me anyway).

A price point of over $500 to upgrade within my same package has made me think about it too much to close the deal.

I'm not quite sure what I'll eventually do at this point?

Waht i did before was work my way through the packages one at a time. once you buy #1, #2 is that much cheaper. 

Posts 47
JD | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Nov 2 2012 2:36 PM

Hello there!

Alas, I fully agree with Aaron.  I've been around computers and windows since early 1990's and never seen so FUBAR-ed roll out.  Hypothetical reasons IMHO: people in Software Marketing no longer have degrees in Software Engineering and Discrete Logic.  I have spent an hour trying to figure out how my current Logos 4 Original Languages RELATES TO Logos 5...Upgrade, update," Buy-againer' or "Keep-what-you-haver" ???

Posts 18
Marc Johnson | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Nov 2 2012 2:39 PM

what information about upgrading to Logos 5 are you looking for that is not available http://www.logos.com/faq ?

Posts 2964
tom | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Nov 2 2012 2:48 PM

Kenneth McGuire:
Personally I am waiting for money and a clearer upgrade path for my Original Languages package.
YesSame here.

Posts 3915
Forum MVP
Friedrich | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Nov 2 2012 2:49 PM

Josh Hunt:

Russ Quinn:

They certainly didn't help to make this an impulse buy!

I'm having to work really hard to study the upgrade options to see what path is best for me.

I would have recommended capping an upgrade price for staying with in same package (gold to gold, platinum to platinum, etc) at $299.

That price point probably would have been a no-brainer, impulse buy (for me anyway).

A price point of over $500 to upgrade within my same package has made me think about it too much to close the deal.

I'm not quite sure what I'll eventually do at this point?

Waht i did before was work my way through the packages one at a time. once you buy #1, #2 is that much cheaper. 

I did that as well.  And we still have that as an option.  Each package has received a new set of books, So, I, at Portfolio, can still go to Gold ("back" as some might say) and STILL get new resources and all the features.  and once I am Gold (almost wrote "God"!), i can keep working up when I have the money, or if I want to.  And since it has been 3 years since 4 rolled out, i imagine we will experience an extended period before Logos 6 comes out (i've self-edited what I thought might have been funny to call it, but decided against it.  Let the reader understand. Wink  )

I like Apples.  Especially Honeycrisp.

Posts 31
Kendall Sholtess | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Nov 2 2012 2:52 PM

I am very upset that it costs so much to upgrade to L5. I cannot afford hundreds of dollars, since I lost my job. This is the first time I have felt so angry with Logos. No matter what, I never have felt L4 was what It was hyped up to be. This is all starting to feel like politics. 

Posts 2279
Andy | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Nov 2 2012 3:57 PM

Kendall Sholtess:

I am very upset that it costs so much to upgrade to L5. I cannot afford hundreds of dollars, since I lost my job. This is the first time I have felt so angry with Logos. No matter what, I never have felt L4 was what It was hyped up to be. This is all starting to feel like politics. 

Hi Kendall,

I am very sorry that you are disappointed and sorry to hear of your difficult situation.

I appreciate that the focus is presently on the base package upgrades (which, depending upon your current library, may prove expensive). 

I understand that a minimal cross-grade (which I expect will cost less than some of the base package upgrades) and the free engine will be made available following launch. This will mean that you are able to access the L5 and your present resources at, I anticipate, a lower cost.

Posts 987
Josh Hunt | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Nov 2 2012 5:47 PM

Andy Evans:

Hi Kendall,

I am very sorry that you are disappointed and sorry to hear of your difficult situation.

I appreciate that the focus is presently on the base package upgrades (which, depending upon your current library, may prove expensive). 

I understand that a minimal cross-grade (which I expect will cost less than some of the base package upgrades) and the free engine will be made available following launch. This will mean that you are able to access the L5 and your present resources at, I anticipate, a lower cost.

If I understand right, a simple explanation on the blog would clear a lot up. All we have to do, as I understand it, is buy the cheapest package. In my case that is less than $50. This gets me the new software plus a number or resources that I don't have. Then, at some later date, I can make decisions about buying new packages that were not available before. Nothing that I purchased will be lost. Am I understanding this right?

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