Official: Minimum Crossgrade and free engine download are coming!

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LogosEmployee

David Housholder:

If you go to www.logos.com/upgrade and click on the Gold package you will see that the church history timeline is mentioned as a feature. Since the lower packages simply say "timeline" it looks as though the post NT timeline doesn't appear in less than a gold upgrade. 

I understand now; thanks.

These are exactly the same feature, just worded differently in the popups. I'll pass this feedback about inconsistent wording along to the marketing team.

Posts 8
Robert Tague | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Nov 4 2012 12:13 AM

 

Thanks Bob. I was concerned about the cost of the upgrade and since I am new to LOGOS (less than a month) I was afraid that you were pulling a Microsoft or an Apple on us.

I have many years of bi-vocational experience in the computer industry, and I know that it is expensive to maintain and upgrade a software package. So thank you for explaining what is going on. I will try to be patient as I wait for the crossgrade package to come along.

I will probably upgrade to gold as soon as I pay off my LOGOS 4 bill, in about 10 or 11 months. I hope I can get a good deal then.

Thank You,

Robert Tague

 

Posts 119
ManilaDave | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Nov 4 2012 1:07 AM

I understand your point. But the issue is somewhat larger than that. As in biblical interpretation context, context, context is all important. Logos needs to stop and ask why some loyal Logos customers are not able to  upgrade at this point. There are many of us who are [or rather, were] committed to building our libraries electronically with Logos and have been investing all we could spare on a monthly basis. We can't make the investment now precisely because Logos already has all our discretionary income. And precisely because we have been regular monthly purchasers of Logos products - the backbone of Logos' cash flow [i.e. the backbone of Logos' business which enabled them to keep the development going], we are now devalued as customers. 

There is another aspect to this as well. Once the initial roll out is completed Logos will raise the price of its offer to us. After all their offer to us states a price that is  "today only"! So not only do we backbone customers get devalued in the new launch we get shafted on price later. 

I've raised a similar issue before without response from Logos. When they cluster the release dates of many pre-pubs around the same time we're often forced to choose between resources we really want and make a priority choice on the basis of the resource we consider most valuable to us at that moment. I suggested that in the case where this happens that Logos hold the pre-pub price open for a period for the customers who through their pre-pub order enabled the product to get to production in the first place. But I received no response. I've been unable to purchase several resources [all collections or sets] I really wanted because of this. 

- David

Posts 119
ManilaDave | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Nov 4 2012 2:05 AM

I absolutely agree, Jason. Bob talks about the need to recover the costs of developing the software. What he is forgetting is that many of us are the backbone of Logos' cash flow, spending significant money EVERY MONTH in his company thus enabling him to develop the upgrades. Without us he wouldn't have an upgrade to offer! The reason many of us loyal customers can't upgrade at this time is because of our investment with his company. In devaluing us at the launch time in favour of many that will turn out to be once off and occasional customers is risking cutting off the life blood of his company - cash flow. 

Posts 2964
tom | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Nov 4 2012 3:42 AM

Bob Pritchett:
I made the call to go ahead even with the rough edges. 
And once again, it caused more work in the long run than it would have to taken care of the rough edges before the release.  Not only do you still have to smooth the same rough edges, you have to do some damage control.  In another post, you spoke of the low profit margin Logos has for this year.  Question, how much does doing damage control cut into your profit margins?

Posts 65
Jeffery Ferrell | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Nov 4 2012 4:34 AM

Thanks Bob for the explanation. I have been a user long enough that I trust the heart of the company. I was a little taken aback when I  saw my upgrade price for platinum to platinum. But I also believe that Logos is focused on helping people get deep into the word of God. I love what you're doing keep up the great work!

Posts 28129
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JT (alabama24) | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Nov 4 2012 4:35 AM

Robert Tague:
I will probably upgrade to gold as soon as I pay off my LOGOS 4 bill, in about 10 or 11 months. I hope I can get a good deal then.

When you stick around Logos long enough (and visit the forums at least somewhat regularly), you will discover seasonal discounts. Logos isn't obligated, of course, to offer the same kinds of sales each year… but they probably will. There are generally big sales related to Black Friday / Christmas. There is also another large sale called "March Madness." This year, with the introduction of new base packages, things might be a bit different. 

OSX & iOS | Logs |  Install

Posts 11
Christopher Sanchez | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Nov 4 2012 4:44 AM

Bob,

Thank you for taking a little time to explain the market positioning of the Logos 5 launch.  Like many, I found the initial messaging confusing and seemingly designed to "force" me to buy resources that I may not want.  After all, many of us are rather happy with our current library and with the confusion surrounding the messaging, there is little wonder that many of us are frustrated.  In these economic times who could blame us?

Having said that, some diligent research has revealed just how tremendous the value contained in each of the new packages is.  Nicely done!  I am planning on upgrading this afternoon after my family and I return home from church.  Perhaps in the future a bit more attention to the messaging might avoid this confusion.  Maybe an approach similar to the way FaithLife was rolled out might prove helpful.  Just my two cents!  Keep up the great work!

In His service,

Chris

Posts 38
Scott Stackelhouse | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Nov 4 2012 6:52 AM

Could someone explain what the difference is between crossgrading my L4 Scholar's Library vs upgrading to the L5 Starter package?

Posts 806
Lew Worthington | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Nov 4 2012 6:55 AM

I'm sure this is answered elsewhere, and I'm sorry about the redundancy, but one can only search and look so long before one posts: Will the current discounts still be available when these other options are offered? I would like to compare free/cheap with unfree/uncheap things.

Posts 2964
tom | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Nov 4 2012 6:59 AM

Scott Stackelhouse:

Could someone explain what the difference is between crossgrading my L4 Scholar's Library vs upgrading to the L5 Starter package?

We have to wait and see what is included with the cross-grade. If I had to take a guess, the cross-grade will not have any books, just the databases, and the starter package has some books and some databases.

Posts 667
Jonathan Pitts | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Nov 4 2012 7:04 AM

Scott Stackelhouse:

Could someone explain what the difference is between crossgrading my L4 Scholar's Library vs upgrading to the L5 Starter package?

Both will give you the L5 appearance and engine. The crossgrade (subject to confirmation of details) will give you the new datasets used in L5. L5 Starter will give you a few new books but not all the datasets and related program features: see the bottom end of the comparison table at logos.com/upgrade.

If still in doubt, wait for the crossgrade and make your decision when all of the options are on the table.

Posts 1
Dan Cousins | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Nov 4 2012 7:28 AM

Heavenly Father we pray for your incredible blessing and favour for Bob Pritchett and Logos as a company.   Ultimately, we thank you for your divine Word that truly wrecks us and rebuilds us into your image, but we also thank you for modern tools that help to study, learn, and prepare that Word fully and efficiently. 

We ask you Lord that you meet every financial need in the company with an abundance that can only come as an extension of your grace.  As Bob leads with strength and humility, let that overflow pour into his lap and may his faith RISE over any bill, debt, or future endeavor that is before him. 

In so doing, we believe that you will give him and the whole team the wisdom necessary to steer through this momentary frustration.  There is an answer that covers all the bases!  And it is found in YOU FATHER!  Thank you in advance for this supernatural provision.

 

Bob, and Logos team, we bless you and speak favor into all that you are going through.  May God's supernatural grace, righteousness, favor, and abundance fill you to overflowing and spill into your lap.

 

Okay I feel better now  :)  I was in the frustrated category for the last few days (trying to justify any upgrade to my wife on a church planters salary).  Anyway, woke up praying for you all and found it a better approach.  Sorry it took us so long Bob. 

:Dan Cousins (Church Planter from British Columbia, Canada)

Posts 1
David Braak | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Nov 4 2012 8:10 AM

I am typically one who looks forward to upgrades of software, but Logos 4 did nothing for me. I hope Logos 5 is truly an upgrade. Before Logos 4, I was an avid user of your software. With the "upgrade," however, I found the software confusing and unusable. I've felt the money I spent purchasing the Gold Edition of Logos 4 has gone to waste. Now, looking at another version coming out, I'm wondering if it's worth upgrading or if I should uninstall Logos 4 and try re-installing the old program that worked for me. 

Posts 1880
Philana Crouch | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Nov 4 2012 8:54 AM

David Braak:

I am typically one who looks forward to upgrades of software, but Logos 4 did nothing for me. I hope Logos 5 is truly an upgrade. Before Logos 4, I was an avid user of your software. With the "upgrade," however, I found the software confusing and unusable. I've felt the money I spent purchasing the Gold Edition of Logos 4 has gone to waste. Now, looking at another version coming out, I'm wondering if it's worth upgrading or if I should uninstall Logos 4 and try re-installing the old program that worked for me. 

David,

Welcome to the forums! I'm sorry you had trouble using Logos 4. If choose to keep Logos 4 or upgrade to Logos 5 I hope you will come to the forums and ask for help. If you don't know how to do something or are confused just ask your question in the forums. You will likely get an answer pretty quick.

Posts 4
Chris Bell | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Nov 4 2012 3:59 PM

I'm encouraged to read that a crossgrade is coming soon. I'm not a Logos 4 power user and originally purchased the Bible Study Library (LE). My upgrade to Logo 5 moves me to the Bronze level but I'm not in a position to spend $330. It appears I can upgrade to the Starter level for $70. Though, I'm wondering if it would be still cost effective for me to wait for the crossgrade.

Thoughts?

Posts 1942
David Thomas | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Nov 4 2012 4:10 PM

Chris Bell:

I'm encouraged to read that a crossgrade is coming soon. I'm not a Logos 4 power user and originally purchased the Bible Study Library (LE). My upgrade to Logo 5 moves me to the Bronze level but I'm not in a position to spend $330. It appears I can upgrade to the Starter level for $70. Though, I'm wondering if it would be still cost effective for me to wait for the crossgrade.

Thoughts?

Have you seen the post about 5 entries above yours that reads:

Both will give you the L5 appearance and engine. The crossgrade (subject to confirmation of details) will give you the new datasets used in L5. L5 Starter will give you a few new books but not all the datasets and related program features: see the bottom end of the comparison table at logos.com/upgrade.

If still in doubt, wait for the crossgrade and make your decision when all of the options are on the table.

Making Disciples!  Logos Ecosystem = Logos8 on Microsoft Surface Pro 4 (Win10), Android app on tablet, FSB on iPhone, [deprecated] Windows App, Proclaim, Faithlife.com, FaithlifeTV via Connect subscription.

Posts 4
Mlthrbrry | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Nov 4 2012 4:11 PM

the answer to that question is that they already have our money

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Keep Smiling 4 Jesus :) | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Nov 4 2012 4:43 PM

tom:

Scott Stackelhouse:

Could someone explain what the difference is between crossgrading my L4 Scholar's Library vs upgrading to the L5 Starter package?

We have to wait and see what is included with the cross-grade. If I had to take a guess, the cross-grade will not have any books, just the databases, and the starter package has some books and some databases.

With dynamic pricing, a minimal crossgrade has potential for 4 price points:

1) Crossgrade from Logos 4 - purchase all the new resources for Logos 5 use

2) Crossgrade from Logos 5 Starter, which has 4 of the 16 new Logos 5 Data Sets

3) Crossgrade from Logos 5 Bronze, which has 12 of the 16 new Logos 5 Data Sets

4) Crossgrade from Logos 5 Silver, which has 15 of the 16 new Logos 5 Data Sets

Keep Smiling Smile

Posts 2
Scott G. Lewis | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Nov 4 2012 4:50 PM

Robert, don't let a payment plan hold you back. While my base package was paid off a long time ago (4 times actually, as I went from Leader's to Scholar's the Silver to Gold, if I recall), I still had a payment plan from some other content I bought 6 months ago. It's generally how I operate. For me, $5 a month in service charge is a great deal to get a thousand or two thousand dollars worth of content now, for 1/12th the price.

Take a look at http://www.logos.com/upgrade - as I did, and click on "new to you" as you browse the various packages. Don't worry about where you are now. If you have Platinum and go to Gold, you don't "lose" any platinum books. You keep 100% of what you had, and get 100% of what's new in that new base package. For me, it was about $120 more to go from v4 Gold to v5 Platinum then to go from Gold to Gold. And rather than wait a few weeks for the crossgrade, I took a good look at what was in Platinum, and decided I wanted it. And I keep all my old stuff, including things like NIV 1984 that are no longer available at any level, or even separately.

But keep paying your payment plan. You agreed to buy something, and have used it for 5 months, but haven't finished paying for it yet. But don't assume you have to "start over", or "wait".

In my case, I keep my Logos monthly budget pretty fixed. Every time I pay something off, I buy something new, but keep the monthly the same, so it's easy for me to budget for my library building. I called Logos on the phone, and they were 100% willing to add in the upgrade to my existing payment plan, resetting it from 6 months to 12 months in the process. The monthly was a bit more than I had budgeted for, so I spoke to my wife, gave them a one time $200 payment, and ended up with a monthly price in our range (went up about $10 a month in my case). The rep even noticed I had my next payment due in 3 days, and spoke to accounting to cancel it, so 12 months starts next month, not in 3 days. That made the $200 even more tolerable for me!

I suspect that even if it was ethical to start over (it's not), it's cheaper to upgrade now with the special pricing than throw away what you paid and pay full price for your package. Or, if you are 100% satisfied with what you have now, content-wise, but like what v5 offers feature-wise - wait a bit, and drop the $100 or less on the crossgrade. But like any other software purchase, once you buy it, you pay for future upgrades, even if they happen 5 weeks after you bought. In Logos' case you have a 30 day return policy. Go buy Microsoft Office at a local store, and try to return it after opening it. They are trying to be fair here, but also stay in business, which as a paying customer with thousands in content, I need... if they go away tomorrow, I have a lot of money invested... 

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