Notes = Word Processor...maybe??

Page 1 of 1 (13 items)
This post has 12 Replies | 1 Follower

Posts 47
Kyle Lammott | Forum Activity | Posted: Thu, Jan 17 2013 6:55 PM

Anyone know if Logos may incorporate a word processor into L5?  Maybe add the function and functionality to the already existing notes?

blessings.

Posts 1658
SteveF | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Jan 17 2013 7:21 PM

This is a long standing debate. I realize these forums are hard to navigate so I will just say that Logos continues to say that they are not able/not interested in "re-inventing" the wheel as it were.

They ask us to use "regular" Word processing programs.

From all I have seen and read (for more than 10 years) this seems to be a very firm decision.

Others here will probably chim in with their own favorite software packages.

 

Regards, SteveF

Posts 19193
Rosie Perera | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Jan 17 2013 8:00 PM

Having been on the development team for Microsoft Word, I can tell you it takes more person-years to develop a good word processor than Logos has developers. Even if CEO Bob Pritchett were to set them all onto this task, it would take them at least a year and nothing else would get done in the meantime. They have lots of other projects they are working on, and I agree with Bob's decision not to take a team of them and put them to work focusing on developing a word processor as part of Logos when there are already a number of excellent full-featured stand-alone word processors out there. Anything Logos could come up with would be immediately assailed by Logos users as sub-par when compared with Word, WordPerfect, Scrivener, Google Docs, OpenOffice, Nota Bene, Apple Pages, etc. So why would Logos expend all that time and energy and financial resources to make something that will never truly satisfy anyone. 

Products that attempt to be all-in-one everything-but-the-kitchen sink tools end up being lame in everything they do (remember Microsoft Works which had a built in word processor, spread sheet, database, email, etc.). Better to focus on your core competencies and make the best product you can in that category, than try to merge into it everything under the sun that some other company has already made (particularly major software programs like a word processor).

Most people already have a word processor they like and use a lot on their computer. Logos seems to have made its word process of choice for integrating with Logos be Microsoft Word. You can build Personal Books for Logos in Word. However the Copy Bible Verses command in Logos also works with several other popular word processors (OpenOffice, StarOffice, WordPad, WordPerfect).

Posts 29268
Forum MVP
JT (alabama24) | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Jan 17 2013 8:22 PM

I agree with you Rosie. The real trick would be to figure out a way to incorporate a Word pane into Logos graphically. I don't think this tech exists right now, and computers might need to grow a bit, but it would be really cool.

macOS, iOS & iPadOS | Logs |  Install

Posts 3578
steve clark | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Jan 17 2013 8:32 PM

a better endeavor for Logos would be adding hyperlinking to a PB (aka Word docx) which acted like the Note's links along with setting styles in the hyperlink for showing the note markers in the Logos resources (e.g. the triangle in front of your linked text in the resource). It would also show a popup when hovering over the note link in the resource which showed a preview of what you had in your PB as the note. This would allow the full word processor to be external, yet have the note markers and linking inside the PB. PB's usually can be recompiled in a short amount of time.

QLinks, Bibl2, LLR, Macros
Dell Insp 17-5748, i5, 1.7 GHz, 8G RAM, win 8.1

Posts 19193
Rosie Perera | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Jan 17 2013 10:14 PM

alabama24:

I agree with you Rosie. The real trick would be to figure out a way to incorporate a Word pane into Logos graphically. I don't think this tech exists right now, and computers might need to grow a bit, but it would be really cool.

There used to be something called OLE (Object Linking and Embedding) if I recall, that would allow an app to yield a window to another app to manage the contents thereof, and there was a protocol for sending back and forth links to the content. That how you could have an Excel spreadsheet embedded in a Word document, for example, and if the user edited the source spreadsheet in Excel, the data would get updated in the embedded site in the Word document. And if you edited the spreadsheet in situ within the Word document, the changes would get propagated out to the source.

But that wouldn't work for what people want in Logos. In OLE, the contents of the object were opaque to the container app; that is you couldn't do a Search in Word and have it find stuff that was part of the embedded spreadsheet. So Logos which has all these powerful search capabilities would cede the ability to search within your Notes if they used Word as the Notes editor.

Anyway, I might be wrong about some of this, as it's been many many years and I haven't worked in software development all these years, and things have certainly advanced since those days (surely OLE has been superseded by now). So something along these lines might be feasible. But still, whether Logos would want to go there (when they've been doing all they can to release themselves from dependencies on external software -- e.g., IE) is another question. They would need to have all kinds of hooks into it to make it understand Bible references and turn those into links, and be able to handle right-to-left Hebrew text, etc.

I think what they need to do is improve on (or maybe even rewrite) their Notes editor, maybe add support for a few often-requested features like tables, but not make it a full-blown word processor. Even so, I'm sure they will never be able to please everyone. Logos generally operates on the 80-20 rule, or something approximating it. They aren't going to spend a large chunk of their time adding in a few complex features that are being requested by a very few (albeit vocal) users.

Posts 1987
Donnie Hale | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Jan 18 2013 7:03 AM

alabama24:
The real trick would be to figure out a way to incorporate a Word pane into Logos graphically.

Unless MS has disabled COM support in Word 2013, this is absolutely do-able (at least on Windows). There are numerous apps which use COM (previously given the name "OLE," as Rosie pointed out) which allow Word to be embedded and driven from another application. That's the direction I've argued for with Logos for a while, especially given that Logos has used / exposed some of its own COM interfaces in the past.

In addition to just the dev effort required to create this feature, the downsides for Logos and its customers are (at a minimum):

- May not work on Mac
- Only available to customers who have MS Word

Donnie

 

Posts 11433
DMB | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Jan 18 2013 7:25 AM

Not arguing with the above, but if I'm not mistaken, the multi-platform strategy of Logos would seem to be the driver in keeping the notes reasonably simple.

The problem facing Logos, is they don't know next year's 'new' platform that users will want support for, etc. Just my guess.

"God will save his fallen angels and their broken wings He'll mend."

Posts 2964
tom | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Jan 18 2013 7:59 AM

Kyle Lammott:

Anyone know if Logos may incorporate a word processor into L5?  Maybe add the function and functionality to the already existing notes?

blessings.

I am under the impression that Logos is working on a text editor.  While this will not be a word processor, hopefully it will  have better than what we currently have.

Posts 29268
Forum MVP
JT (alabama24) | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Jan 18 2013 8:33 AM

tom:
I am under the impression that Logos is working on a text editor.  While this will not be a word processor, hopefully it will  have better than what we currently have.

That is my understanding as well. Yes

macOS, iOS & iPadOS | Logs |  Install

Posts 1130
Keith Larson | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Jan 18 2013 8:59 AM

Not to sound too dismissive of this request, but five widows short-cuts solve the problem Alt-Tab I am in my word processor, Ctrl+A I select all the text I just typed, Ctrl+X I cut all the text, Alt-Tab I am back in Logos, Ctrl+P and I paste the text into the note. Maybe add at most three seconds to the whole process--big deal. It is not worth Logos time to develop a word processor.

Posts 323
Doug | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Jan 18 2013 10:08 AM

If they would let us integrate a Word panel into L5, that would certainly be helpful to many of us.  I'd actually like a OneNote panel.  Sometimes notes is about more than just notes.  Pics and such are helpful to illustrate a point.  

Posts 3578
steve clark | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Jan 18 2013 10:12 AM

Having note creation/linking added to PB's would put the power of Notes into our hands. We would be able to use Word to add text & its formatting the way we want it as well as embed images into our notes and embed tables if desired.

EDIT: this would eliminate the ever continuous requests for various changes to the Note file editor and architectural changes. The current note system would be left in place for the users who don't want to have more control over the notes system (e.g. simple notes). The PB note system could then be added as Advanced Notes entry into the db's (Notes.db). A lot of the mechanics already exist in the Logos engine which could be smoothly integrated into accessing notes in a PB.

This then could free up developers to progress on to completing items which have been promised and hopefully are in the pipeline (e.g. PBs which are accessible in other computers/devices).

QLinks, Bibl2, LLR, Macros
Dell Insp 17-5748, i5, 1.7 GHz, 8G RAM, win 8.1

Page 1 of 1 (13 items) | RSS