Ok, you have made me mad!

Terry Poperszky

As I try and follow the posts detailing the use of the greek tools in L4, I am getting really ticked at how much I have let my greek language skills slip over the years and while I still have all my textbooks downstairs in the library I am hoping that there have been some advancements in the teaching techniques over the last 20 years. So, I would appreciate it if I you kind people could recommend a logos compatible resource that would allow me to start to refresh my skills. The Greek in a Week is sounding really tempting right now.

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check out "The Elements of New Testament Greek" by Nunn... that should serve as a good primer/refresher [:)]

These aren't exactly recommendations but you can look at http://www.logos.com/greek/nt for the various Greek tools offered (this page might be slightly outdated, but it'll give you a list of grammars that you can consider using). The grammar I learned on (Mounce's Basics of Biblical Greek) isn't currently available in Logos, but the intermediate (Wallace's Greek Grammar Beyond the Basics) is. I don't know anythings about this resource http://www.logos.com/products/details/4700 but it the description sounds promising (I only link to it because it wasn't on the Logos Greek page and it has a recent copyright date)

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/53359#Comment_53359

Terry,

I tried to feel bad for you but I just laughed!! I started learning Greek a few days at, at 47, and using the learn-it-yourself approach. I'm glad you have some formal training and books to start you back up. When you get frustrated you can laugh at me, still learning the alphabet, sounding out words like a toddler and trying to remember grammar terms I forgot LONG ago. [:O] I can't travel right now to Greek in a Week so this will have to do. And good for you, for wanting to pick it up again!

LaRosa, do you have a beginner recommendation for me? I searched the forum yesterday and found a list of books someone put up this summer but I'm still unsure what might be helpful for someone completely new with no instructor. I'm a visual learner and good with languages in general but I have absolutely no Greek training yet. My only goal is to read in the original language for me own learning needs.

Kaye

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/53366#Comment_53366

Kevin,

I am using the book you posted. I like it because it's very basic, explains one thing at a time and uses sentence diagrams to make it visual. I am BURNING through it. That's why I need something else soon!

K

Unfortunately it's not a Logos resource (SUGGESTION!) But Wesley Pershbacher's "Refresh your Greek" should be about right.

Side note: He's got a great Logos resource - New Testament Greek Syntax: An Illustrated Manual

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/53368#Comment_53368

Kaye,

I would highly recommend that you use Mounce's Basics of Biblical Greek and the workbook for this resource.

The vocab list for this is available in Logos (at least in Logos 3). See:http://www.logos.com/support/lbs/vocabularylists You should be able to print vocab cards from Logos 3.

Then, you would do well to check out Bill Mounce's www.teknia.com. On this site you will be able to create a user login, which will give you free access to Bill Mounce's lectures for each chapter, flashworks program for learning vocabulary, workbook answers and more.

Mike

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/53378#Comment_53378

Thanks very much! I will take a look. [:)]

K

Terry Poperszky

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/53366#Comment_53366

Terry,

I tried to feel bad for you but I just laughed!! I started learning Greek a few days at, at 47, and using the learn-it-yourself approach. I'm glad you have some formal training and books to start you back up. When you get frustrated you can laugh at me, still learning the alphabet, sounding out words like a toddler and trying to remember grammar terms I forgot LONG ago. I can't travel right now to Greek in a Week so this will have to do. And good for you, for wanting to pick it up again!

Kaye, the first day of class, the teacher told us that by the end of the first quarter if we weren't dreaming in Greek, then we weren't studying hard enough! I remember walking around all day carrying rings of vocabulary cards and leafing through them when I had a spare moment at work. I have never worked so hard for a "B" in my life.

BTW, I never did dream in Greek, although in the front of a SS class one day, I forgot the English spelling for patience, all I could remember was the spelling in Greek.

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/53434#Comment_53434

I remember walking around all day carrying rings of vocabulary cards and leafing through them when I had a spare moment at work. I have never worked so hard for a "B" in my life.

That sounds exactly like my first two semesters of Greek.

Terry Poperszky

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/53447#Comment_53447

Here is the culprit right here:

http://www.wheaton.edu/Theology/faculty/vlachos/index.html

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/53453#Comment_53453

OK, now you guys are just scaring me...[:S]

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/53459#Comment_53459

Terry, your instructor has an amazing personal history...

I took Greek 20+ years ago and there has been lots of improvements since then. I would highly recommend Mounce's "Basics of Biblical Greek." It is not in Logos format yet, but I only wish it was available when I took Greek.

Ted Hilderbrandt has done some interesting things with computer learning. He has a old program called Mastering New Testament Greek which I have recommended to others and they have found helpful. I like the drills. I think you can still find it at CBD. He also has some free resources at his Gordon College site that you might find helpful. There is a PDF textbook and workbook that correspond to the computer program and a series of animated lecture on each chapter. It is not the best Greek course out there, but it is not the worst and for FREE you can complain. Here is the web link: http://faculty.gordon.edu/hu/bi/ted_hildebrandt/index.cfm.

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/53459#Comment_53459

Mounce's "Basics of Biblical Greek" is in my opinion one of the finest first year grammars available, it baffles me that it has not made it's way into Logos by now but I'm sure they are trying to get it.

For second year and beyond and definitwely as a reference Wallace's "Greek Grammar Beyond the Basics" is without peer and IS available in Logos. I have it and the sheer breadth of the work is worth the price alone. I own both these books in print and Wallace in Logos as well.

If you really need a first year grammar that is in Logos, the Kairos set might be worth a look. It includes a workbook and is pretty straightforward as well.

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/53453#Comment_53453

Terry,

Here's mine: http://www.moody.edu/edu_FacultyProfile.aspx?id=5692

An incredibly Godly man! It doesn't mention it but I'm almost positive Dr. Sauer was a former Marine. I vaguely remember him calling students who whined about the course-load "wimps."

It was said as an obvious jest but years later I still can't shake the feeling that deep down it may not have been. I kept my whining to myself just in case.

Terry Poperszky

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/53463#Comment_53463

Terry, your instructor has an amazing personal history...

Truly an amazing man, totally lacking in a sense of humor, which made our relationship a bit bumpy to say the least. Although I hear that he did have one surgically implanted later on in life.

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/53476#Comment_53476

You guys are awesome! I will order the Mounce for now since it got LOTS of votes, get the vocab list for Logos 3 (might as well use 3 for something...) and check out the websites and other resources to help me along.

You may never hear from me again...until I get stuck!!

Peace and a wonderful weekend to you all...

K

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/53492#Comment_53492

You may never hear from me again...until I get stuck!!

See you tomorrow.

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/53495#Comment_53495

[:D] I won't even have the BOOK by then!

Terry Poperszky

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/53496#Comment_53496

Well lookie at what I just found:

http://www.logos.com/products/prepub/details/5876?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+LogosPrepubs+%28Logos+Pre-Publications%29

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/53496#Comment_53496

Here is a new Greek and Hebrew training resource now in prepub if anyone is interested

http://www.logos.com/products/prepub/details/5876?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+LogosPrepubs+%28Logos+Pre-Publications%29

Terry Poperszky

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/53509#Comment_53509

Yup, I just put it on my pre-pub order list.

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/53516#Comment_53516

See how quick and responsive we are!

[:D]

Terry Poperszky

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/53518#Comment_53518

Ohhh..... I feel some flames coming about missing features after that comment. [:O]

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/53519#Comment_53519

WOW! What a super resource! Just what I was looking for. Only one problem...no $$$[:(]

Dr. Charles A. Wootten

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/53518#Comment_53518

See how quick and responsive we are!

whoo hoo!!! Sumbuddy out thar luvs us'ns!!!! Yawl got muh order!!

Izzit reddy yit?

How come it isn't downloading into L4 as I type this? Izzit a bug in L4? [:^)]

I caint even spell patience in Greek let alone English.....but it's almost like French in spelling...hmmmm... [;)]

But, seriously, thanX!! This is one way to learn how to use this software even better. Hopefully you'll get enough orders to process it soon!

God bless

{charley}

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/53538#Comment_53538

This looks great but with the cost of the videos AND BDAG it is over my limit for now. Could I just get the Greek for half??

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/53631#Comment_53631

Could I just get the Greek for half??

It is already cheaper than half price for the Greek videos. The prepub price is $160. The sale price (which will be the price once the materials go live) is $500. That is definitely a less than half-price option :-)

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/53636#Comment_53636

I know...but sadly still out of my sphere. My daughter is getting married in May so I will stick with some lesser but still very useful methods for now. I'm glad it's being offered though and with the great discount. I think it will be good for lots of people and will almost certainly improve how people use Logos!

K

Terry Poperszky

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/53636#Comment_53636

Besides, until you learn the Greek, what are you going to do with BDAG?

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/53640#Comment_53640

It was recommended to go along with the training set and they were using it in the demo as part of a lesson. Not required but seems like it would be very good to have after watching them compare it to other resources in my base package.

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/53640#Comment_53640

I purchased the Leaders LE and after looking at the web site and videos it seems it is recommended if you purchase this product you should update to the Scholar package and have BDAG...guess I was talked out of it...

Terry Poperszky

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/53643#Comment_53643

Sorry Kaye, I hadn't noticed. When I ran across the link, the video's hadn't been put up yet.

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/53647#Comment_53647

Maybe the BDAG will be one of the 12 days of Christmas!! That would be a help.

Terry Poperszky

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/53721#Comment_53721

Maybe the BDAG will be one of the 12 days of Christmas!! That would be a help.

Kaye, all I can do is share what God has been repeating to me over and over this year: When God calls, God provides.

It has kept me at things, when I would have walked away from them, and helped me to walk away from things that He was no longer part of.

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/53636#Comment_53636

OK, I like to order the prepub version, but not the DVD but as a download, how to order?

ton verdam

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/53496#Comment_53496

I won't even have the BOOK by then!

Here are two you can get from Amazon quickly

Crosby & Schaeffer, Introduction to Greek http://tinyurl.com/ye3zw6o
Henry Weir Smyth, Greek Grammar http://tinyurl.com/ye3ylga

These are both geared to classical Greek. I used Crosby & Schaeffer in 1st year and hated it. I now have great respect for it. I remember sitting up until 3:00 am reading Greek for my morning 2nd year Greek class and pouring through Smyth. Even though it's geared to classical there is a considerable amount that is pertinent to NT Greek. It's the absolute best grammar in the English language. Don't read Greek without it.

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/53764#Comment_53764

George, Amazon is my best friend some days. I'll look these up!

Terry, you are right. God provides me with everything I need and all I have ever had. If he wants me to learn Greek at this point in life for his purposes, I won't lack the resources to accomplish it. If not, I'll enjoy dabbling with the resources I currently own in my Logos library!

K

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/53861#Comment_53861

Terry,

Since you mentioned "Greek in a Week", check this out (website for the course): http://www.biblicalgreek.org/classes/giaw/#1

After watching the course description and part of the alphabet video, I may need to look at those pre-pubs again!

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/53639#Comment_53639

I know...but sadly still out of my sphere. My daughter is getting married in May so I will stick with some lesser but still very useful methods for now. I'm glad it's being offered though and with the great discount. I think it will be good for lots of people and will almost certainly improve how people use Logos!

K

Kaye,

In addition to the free course from Ted Hildebrandt is mentioned in my earlier post, there is also a free course at BiblicalTraining.org: http://www.biblicaltraining.org/class/nt201. Mounce is the instructor. You will need to purchase Mounces text book. But I hope you can see that God has indeed provided the resources one needs to get started learning biblical greek, and all for FREE or next to free!!! God is good and we live in an amazing time, full of opportnities for those who make an effort to take advantage of them.

I hope this helps and encourages you.

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/54033#Comment_54033

I'm looking at Hildebrandt's free book right now! And you're right, I will have whatever I need. I love my "toys" but the Holy Spirit can teach in any circumstance and sometimes more toys = less time spent in the real work!

I'm happy with what I have. I appreciate your testimony to me.

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/54033#Comment_54033

I'd also like to put in a plug for the new video resources on pre-pub (http://www.logos.com/products/prepub/details/5876). The authors of this resource (who are both with Logos) have taken a new approach focusing on how to effectively use the tools, even if your command of the language isn't everything it might be (or never was [;)] ).

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/54437#Comment_54437

Sean,

I must be late to the party! I had no idea that there was a prepub of these vids...

Are they the same ones on Youtube right now?

If what's on You tube are "samples" then these are valuable vids and I'm the last one to know.

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/54593#Comment_54593

OK. I have removed a few things from my pre-pubs that were gathering interest and added these videos. I'm still hoping Santa Logos will have a nice BDAG discount for me before the 12th day is over so I can add that recommended item to my library before these vids are ready.

Terry Poperszky

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/54639#Comment_54639

Sean and Robert, you guys are both late to the party [:P] (See top of page 2). That is Kaye's quandary: whether to eat, or order the videos.

I will say they are gathering interest at quite a fast rate.

Reuben Evans (Faithlife)

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/53645#Comment_53645

Id'd recommend BDAG, but it is by no means required to get value out of the Video Tools. You'll learn so many principals and techniques that you can apply to whatever lexicon you are using. Once you get the resources to buy BDAG it will help you. But we want to train you to think through the context of your passage or word and not just rely on BDAG. It is referenced, but nowhere close to every lesson. Hope that helps!

Reuben Evans (Faithlife)

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/53746#Comment_53746

There will be over 15 hours of HD content, so it is just too much too offer via download (at this point anyway). Also you may not want to keep all those videos on your Hard Drive if you have a laptop with limited HDD space. But you can copy the videos off the DVD to your hard drive.

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/54863#Comment_54863

Id'd recommend BDAG, but it is by no means required to get value out of the Video Tools. You'll learn so many principals and techniques that you can apply to whatever lexicon you are using. Once you get the resources to buy BDAG it will help you. But we want to train you to think through the context of your passage or word and not just rely on BDAG. It is referenced, but nowhere close to every lesson. Hope that helps!

I'd recommend BDAG, HALOT and BDB (if you can afford it). Don't accept any substitutes for these 3.

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/54892#Comment_54892

Here is the BDAG / HALOT bundle

http://www.logos.com/products/details/2078

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