New Schaff-Herzog Encyclopedia of Religious Knowledge (13 vols.)

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This post has 36 Replies | 2 Followers

Posts 199
Travis Walter | Forum Activity | Posted: Fri, May 10 2013 12:25 PM

Not sure what just happened, but I had this on CP for a long time and now its going to pre-pub soon.. I had it on CP for $50 and its now $20!.

L must have lowered the production cost.

Anyways, a good reference for $20!

https://www.logos.com/product/8567/new-schaff-herzog-encyclopedia-of-religious-knowledge

Posts 297
JPH | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, May 10 2013 12:33 PM

I'm . . . . . confused  Confused

Posts 1147
Ken McGuire | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, May 10 2013 12:34 PM

Maybe they found a source of it digitized and so don't have to do it.

The Gospel is not ... a "new law," on the contrary, ... a "new life." - William Julius Mann

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Todd Phillips | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, May 10 2013 12:36 PM

The line is so far off of the chart that if the scale started at zero, it would be free.

I think this is a glitch.  We'll see.

Posts 172
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Kent Hendricks | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, May 10 2013 12:44 PM

This is a glitch. We're working in on this right now. I hope to have an answer soon.

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Evan Boardman | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, May 10 2013 1:25 PM

And I was excited that it was gonna go thru. Perhaps some people will bid on it now.

Posts 172
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Kent Hendricks | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, May 10 2013 2:19 PM

We've confirmed that this is not over 100%. Bidding will not close next Friday, as the product page currently indicates. We're working to get this fixed.

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Mark Barnes | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, May 10 2013 6:05 PM

Kent Hendricks:

We've confirmed that this is not over 100%. Bidding will not close next Friday, as the product page currently indicates. We're working to get this fixed.

The system has sent out emails to all the bidders, too. You'll need to send another one, to explain the error.
Logos Community Pricing Bid Information:
Bidding will close on 5/17/2013 at 12:00pm Pacific time for New Schaff-Herzog Encyclopedia of Religious Knowledge (13 vols.).

The current community price for this product is $20.00.

Your bid for this product is $50.00.

Upon closing, your current bid will be successful and your Pre-Pub order for this product will be placed at the community price. 
Posts 27
JZ | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, May 10 2013 6:19 PM

I want to confirm these emails went out.  I got one which claimed the community price was $20.  Thanks for confirming the mixup, I'll watch this thread and the resource's page for updates.

In God we trust. All others bring data.
Posts 8526
George Somsel | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, May 10 2013 8:14 PM

Kent Hendricks:

We've confirmed that this is not over 100%. Bidding will not close next Friday, as the product page currently indicates. We're working to get this fixed.

That's quite a glitch since it is nowhere near going over the top.  I wondered at the time that I received my notice since I have been keeping tabs on it.

george
gfsomsel

יְמֵי־שְׁנוֹתֵינוּ בָהֶם שִׁבְעִים שָׁנָה וְאִם בִּגְבוּרֹת שְׁמוֹנִים שָׁנָה וְרָהְבָּם עָמָל וָאָוֶן

Posts 7682
fgh | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, May 11 2013 3:39 AM

Mark Barnes:
The system has sent out emails to all the bidders, too. You'll need to send another one, to explain the error.

If this had been any other company doing a thing like this, I would have had an apology and correction in my inbox within the hour. But not Logos... Oh no, they just go home for the weekend, leaving customers in darkness and confusion to figure things out for themselves -- if they can. Nothing in the mail, nothing on the product page. Amazing...

"The Christian way of life isn't so much an assignment to be performed, as a gift to be received."  Wilfrid Stinissen

Mac Mini late 2010 8GB RAM 10.6.8

Posts 7682
fgh | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, May 11 2013 4:43 AM

And they just did it again....

Yesterday Logos put up a huge bunch of new prepubs. I glanced at them, but there was no prepub discount whatsoever for any of them, so I quickly decided to ignore them. 

Today I find a blog claiming that most of them are 40% off for the first two weeks, while a few others are 10% off. 

  • If I hadn't seen the blog, I would have already lost my chance to buy at 40% off.
  • There still is no sign whatsoever outside the blog that these are discounted, much less that they are so for two weeks only. They show up with prices in black, no regular price, no saving, and no yellow warning.
  • Consequently, if I filter the prepub list by On Sale, they all disappear...
  • What price am I to pay? Is it 40% off the 'black' price, or is the 'black' price the discounted price?

Zip it!

"The Christian way of life isn't so much an assignment to be performed, as a gift to be received."  Wilfrid Stinissen

Mac Mini late 2010 8GB RAM 10.6.8

Posts 678
Evan Boardman | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, May 11 2013 4:53 AM

fgh:

Yesterday Logos put up a huge bunch of new prepubs. I glanced at them, but there was no prepub discount whatsoever for any of them, so I quickly decided to ignore them. 

Today I find a blog claiming that most of them are 40% off for the first two weeks, while a few others are 10% off. 

I was wondering about that also,seeing how we had a post  about the price of Moo's Galatians commentary.

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Mark Barnes | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, May 11 2013 6:29 AM

fgh:
What price am I to pay? Is it 40% off the 'black' price, or is the 'black' price the discounted price?

The black price is the discounted price. If you click through you'll see that the discount is compared to the print edition.

I suspect that the issue here is that most Logos pre-pubs have three 'prices' set: Pre-pub price, Logos RRP and Print RRP. The search screen shows the discount of the pre-pub price compared to Logos RRP. In the case of these new Baker publications, the Logos RRP is the same as the print RRP, and therefore is ignored, and no discount is set.

In other words, I think this is a technical issue caused by the now wrong assumption that the Logos RRP will always be below print RRP. It just needs a techie to tweak the code slightly.

As regards yellow warnings - most pre-pubs go up in price fairly soon after being launched. That's the norm nowadays.

Posts 1011
David J. Wilson | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, May 11 2013 6:56 AM

Getting quite confusing: Not only the email re the Schaff-Hertzog Encyclopedia but the wave of Pre-pub listings with black pricing.

I too have generally been ignoring pre-pubs with prices in black as up to this point the price in black has always meant this is the non-discounted regular price. Having to wade through literally dozens of new titles posted this week is none too much fun either, not the least of which is that the sequence of new items in the listing keeps changing as new ones are not always added at the top (several later appeared within the ranks of the individual Catholic Bible Study listings for example).

I would recommend that Logos stick with its former practice of indicating directly on the resource page what pre-pub discount % is currently being offered with respect to the intended regular price for the Logos electronic version.

My practice with pre-pubs has been to place orders on a combination of interest in the title, reputation of the author, relevance to current projects or needs and price offered. Those offered with a clear significant discount which meet the other criteria have a good chance of getting a "Quick Buy", others that do not have a current project/need and have a low or "fuzzy" discount are generally parked until the budget improves.

Posts 7682
fgh | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, May 11 2013 7:36 AM

Mark Barnes:
If you click through you'll see that the discount is compared to the print edition.

I know. I can count as well as you.Wink I was just illustrating how confusing they've made it for us.Geeked

The thing is, Logos never counts discount compared to the print edition these days. We finally got them to stop that practice, remember?Smile

Mark Barnes:
I think this is a technical issue caused by the now wrong assumption that the Logos RRP will always be below print RRP.

I had no such assumption. What I do have is an assumption that if the prepub price is different from the regular price, the regular price should be listed as well. They have to, the page is coded like that. Without a regular price, the page can't calculate the discount and the savings, and doesn't understand it should make the price red.

The way those pages look right now, they're telling me that How We Got... costs $12.95 now, will cost $12.95 in three weeks, and will cost $12.95 after it's shipped as well. Since no regular price is listed, $12.95 is the regular price. Especially since it's also in black.

Mark Barnes:
As regards yellow warnings - most pre-pubs go up in price fairly soon after being launched. That's the norm nowadays.

It is?? I can't find any of my prepubs that have gone up in price since I ordered, except CP's and a few that specifically said they would. 

In fact, I thought we had gotten them to stop that practice as well, but unfortunately they've brought it back for some items. At least this time they have -- until now -- given us those yellow warnings in advance, which is certainly a great deal better than two years ago, but I still find it a stupid practise. They're forcing us to immediately order everything we're even thinking of, which can only result in a large amount of cancellations later. But I guess if that's the way they want it, I can go along and add a lot of prepubs I have little intention of buying at the time of shipping...

"The Christian way of life isn't so much an assignment to be performed, as a gift to be received."  Wilfrid Stinissen

Mac Mini late 2010 8GB RAM 10.6.8

Posts 7327
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Mark Barnes | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, May 11 2013 8:00 AM

fgh:
I can't find any of my prepubs that have gone up in price since I ordered, except CP's and a few that specifically said they would. 

Most was an exaggeration, sorry. But several do. These are just current pre-pubs that are now more expensive than when I ordered them. I expect more will rise in price before they're released:

fgh:
The thing is, Logos never counts discount compared to the print edition these days.

Oh, they do. We just got them to rename it from "Sale price", or whatever it was, to "Reg". So the latest prepub has a pre-pub price of $44.95, a regular price of $54.95 and a print price of $71.98. So after prepub it will go up to $54.95. The discount that's listed is the discount on the regular price.

With the Baker titles, I think the regular price and the print price are the same, and that's what's causing the confusion.

Posts 7682
fgh | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, May 11 2013 9:22 AM

Mark Barnes:
These are just current pre-pubs that are now more expensive than when I ordered them

Yes, and I could probably list a few more, but they're a still a small minority, and for most of them I know for a fact that they had yellow warnings about price changes at the time of posting. 

Mark Barnes:
So the latest prepub has a pre-pub price of $44.95, a regular price of $54.95 and a print price of $71.98. So after prepub it will go up to $54.95. The discount that's listed is the discount on the regular price.

Exactly. 

Mark Barnes:
Oh, they do. We just got them to rename it from "Sale price", or whatever it was, to "Reg".

No, they don't. They used to use the highest price as the reference price, which meant that even their perfectly normal price counted as a discounted price. Now their normal price counts as a non-discounted price, and all discounts are counted off that price. That makes an awful lot of difference.

For your linked example: 

  • According to present calculation method: $10, 18% off at prepub. $0, 0% off after shipping.
  • According to earlier calculation method: $27.03, 38% off at prepub, $17.06, 24% off after shipping. 

You pay the same, but which sounds more attractive? And on top of that they often used hugely inflated reference prices, making it seem like a book was temporarily on sale for a few percent of its regular price, when, in fact, it was being sold at its perfectly normal price.

The current practice -- current until yesterday, that is -- was an enormous improvement, both ethically and in customer friendliness.

Mark Barnes:
With the Baker titles, I think the regular price and the print price are the same, and that's what's causing the confusion.

I have no problem with that. The problem is that they don't list the regular price, making it seem like the prepub price is the regular price.

My suspicion is that someone, seeing that the two prices were the same, and not realizing the consequences, simply didn't bother to type in the regular prices. And no supervisor bothered to check the work. I may be completely wrong, of course, but until Logos says otherwise, I prefer to believe this is just sloppiness, not an intentional change in how to display pricing.

"The Christian way of life isn't so much an assignment to be performed, as a gift to be received."  Wilfrid Stinissen

Mac Mini late 2010 8GB RAM 10.6.8

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NB.Mick | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, May 11 2013 9:32 AM

fgh:

Mark Barnes:
With the Baker titles, I think the regular price and the print price are the same, and that's what's causing the confusion.

I have no problem with that. The problem is that they don't list the regular price, making it seem like the prepub price is the regular price.

My suspicion is that someone, seeing that the two prices were the same, and not realizing the consequences, simply didn't bother to type in the regular prices. And no supervisor bothered to check the work. I may be completely wrong, of course, but until Logos says otherwise, I prefer to believe this is just sloppiness, not an intentional change in how to display pricing.

I think you wrote it up as precise as we will get to it without inside information. 

And congrats to your 5555th post:  - Smile

running Logos 5.2a (Classic MCs, Verbum Master+) on Acer Extensa 5230E - now modified with 4GB RAM & 250GB SSD - with Win7 Home Premium 32bit & some Android apps on Kindle Fire

Posts 2859
David Paul | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, May 12 2013 12:55 AM

Mark Barnes:

When did you place your hold on this, Mark? Thanks.

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