Logos Asks: What's the output of your Bible study in Logos?

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Mark Smith | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Aug 7 2013 9:15 PM

I do personal devotional reading of the Bible only using my iPad. That is personal learning, or, better, edification.

I read books for personal growth and profit on my iPad. Some are from Vyrso and others from Logos. That is personal learning.

I highlight the Bible and books I am reading usually on my iPad. I don't often take notes in Logos. The highlighting supports all my other output.

I prepare a weekly adult Sunday School lesson for our teachers. This involves using Logos for background study. I create the lesson in MS Word. I sometimes include a map, chart, or graphic directly from Logos in the lesson material for a class room visual. Occasionally I excerpt a dictionary article or a commentary to include with the lesson. I cut and paste into MS Word to do this.

For sermon prep I sometimes use clippings files and note files. Sometimes I make use of a passage list (for topical sermons). I sometimes print these out for reading and to have at hand when I sit and do further study or start outlining or planning my message. The message usually starts on paper then goes into MS Word. At that point I may copy and paste material in the notes files or clipping files from Logos. I handle scripture by using the Smart Tag feature in MS Word. Rarely, but sometimes, I use the Copy Bible Verses feature directly. I rarely use PowerPoint in preaching.

For my mid-week adult Bible study class, I output an outline as a result of my study, sometimes on paper, other times using MS Word. This does not usually contain much that is directly from Logos, but it comes from what reading in and using Logos to study has provided me. I do use PowerPoint quite a bit when teaching. Sometimes I'll add a graphic from Logos to these slides. I have made extensive use of the journals in Logos on a couple of occasions when teaching on a contemporary topic for which I've found good material there. Often I print those articles out. After reading, studying and working with then, I incorporate the info in a MS Word document using copy and paste from Logos, or I sequence reading sections from the print copies into my teaching plan.

Occasionally I have created a devotional or Bible reading guide for use by the congregation. Because it is easier for me I usually use MS Publisher for this type of output. I have used maps and graphics from Logos to illustrate the material. For example one summer we traced Paul's journeys in Acts and correlated (as best I could) his writings to the churches into this itinerary when he visited those places. These as well as the journey readings were the basis for daily Bible readings and reflections. I included maps of his missionary journeys from Logos, and at least one illustration from Logos for each city he wrote to.

You didn't ask, but I have only once directly read from my iPad in Bible study. I have never used it in worship.

Pastor, North Park Baptist Church

Bridgeport, CT USA

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Unix | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Aug 8 2013 10:08 AM

Hi, Bob! It's a pleasure to have You ask!

I do parallel study (by that I don't mean parallel cross-references within the Bible), Gk, make collections. I leave 1-2 dozen books open for months plus very temporarily open more books. Leaving the books open feels like the easiest thing to do, perhaps I will be doing more of saving layouts on the older laptop which has only the maximum 4 GB RAM (my newer laptop has 8 GB and a hybrid disk with 8 GB built-in SSD to speed up some tasks). One of the books that is open all the time, is the Encyclopedia of Christianity, vols 1-3, 4, 5.

I look forward to citing works! That feature is awesome and I'm glad Logos has finally implemented the American Psychological Association 6th Edition format. It's the default citation format so I've learned to like it. Only thing is that I always modify it manually putting a "p." and backspace in front of the page number digits.

The problem is my hardware, but the most annoying thing about Logos is that on my older laptop (2009) scrolling makes the monitor flicker a little bit. I did know that Logos requires good hardware but the seller (a private person working with setting up surveillance cam computers) mirrored for free the Windows 7 installation in it to an SSD and gave a warranty on the SSD, so I couldn't resist it. So I don't have much to complain about. I'm happy with the L5 datasets included in Bronze. I have tried out Silver twice but returned it. Have also tried out Verbum for a year but gave it away to a poor person living on a disability income and having only $7 left each month, she particularly wished she had Roman-Catholic books. The computers still remember the Verbum/Deuterocanonicals settings and I'm glad about that. I don't have the Catechism of the Roman-Catholic Church since I gave away Verbum and can't get it again because of the copyright restriction, but actually I really don't miss it so Logos doesn't need to do anyone efforts about that on my behalf.

My goal is a neat library that can be searched (hence creating collections) and books opened up easy. I have for example a tagging system where I've assigned books categories with both short letter abbreviations, and short 2-3 digit codes, so when working intensely within one of those categories I only need to type 2-3 digits. I use Logos to complement my print library which is much smaller but contains mostly books and Bibles that are not available in Logos, such as the Jerusalem Bible and The Oxford Encyclopedia of the Books of the Bible (2 large vols.).

I plan on doing Gk heavy lifting in the Logos desktop software and on Accordance in the future. I'm going to study classical Gk first in uni, then theology, then Biblical Gk. I'm also interested in the Septuagint, and I've been trying out the Göttingen Septuagint (67 vols.), I know a little bit of Gk, and have agreed with one person who lives in the capital of Finland, Helsinki, to buy the license for the Göttingen Septuagint from him used, he is asking $270 + the license transfer fee (and offers also the Brill Septuagint Studies Collection but I'm unsure about that one since I've heard it requires a bit of Hebrew knowledge of which I have none and am not going to acquire any).

My most expensive single pre-pub order is: Oxford History of the Christian Church (16 vols.). Second biggest is: T&T Clark Pauline Studies Collection (28 vols.).
I'm not particularly interested in base-package upgrades, but I hope Logos will make an Anabaptist or Mennonite base-package with recent titles or for example the Believer's Church Bible Commentary NT volumes (and perhaps select important OT volumes) which is Anabaptist/Mennonite if Logos's focus is on getting and competing with commentaries. Either with dynamic pricing or great coupon-code deals (25%). 15% off won't nudge me towards buying anything.
I'm not interested in the NIV11. I passed on it when it was briefly offered for free in L5. And if it's going to be included in all base-packages I'm not going to upgrade!! ;-(

When it comes to resources, the only thing that disappoints me, is that the New Interpreter's Dictionary of the Bible looks like it's going to take many years to make it into production in Logos. I know it's expensive to produce and I'm very grateful for the very low pre-pub price, but I wish Logos could lower the production cost estimate on it just a little bit to push it! This Summer I've created a thread once pushing the NIDB.

Sometimes I have a bit of difficulties studying, so I need to really focus and do in-depth work, take classes in classrooms, and learn to use the softwares better (note plural, but mostly referring to Logos).

(When posting I reverse the order, putting my reply above the quote, following the (old?) email standard.)

I make notes and highlightings with no plan written in stone what to use them for in the future. I'm going to use Microsoft Office 2010 Starter if/when needed, too, I have it on one of my two computers (laptops). (On the other laptop, older but with SSD, I have just LibreOffice Writer.) I guess I'll be using my Nook HD 7" only for reading. Working as a pastor would be too much pressure I think. Studying to become a teacher in junior high would take years, would have to study pedagogics so I'm unsure about that as well:

Bob Pritchett:

When you use Logos, what's the 'work product' of your study?

- Personal learning, insight, growth -- all internal.

- Personal notes (devotional or observations on reading).

- A sermon outline.

- An academic paper or article.

- A full-manuscript sermon.

- Teaching slides / outlines for Proclaim / PowerPoint / Keynote, etc.

[...]

If you're preaching or teaching, do you put outlines right into presentation software? Email them to someone? Print them out? Do you look for any supplemental material online? What kind?

Have you ever embedded images / diagrams / screenshots from Logos into a presentation? Do you want more of this kind of media? Have you used media from a resource that comes with teaching media, like the Abraham character study or Runge's HD Commentary on Philippians?

 


Look for discounts on Logos books (I always for example look at the personalized offer emails but rarely click the link and have been greatly disappointed so far about what kinds of books are offered to me), discuss on a few forums (not many more than Christianforums.com and unorthodoxchristian.freeforums.net), work with Accordance 9 on PC-emulator (have version 10 license) where I have UBS Translator's Handbook NT, Comprehensive Crossref (it's a Bible with all manuscript family variants in the NT and cross-references to other literature in both the OT and NT) and New English Translation of the Septuagint. When the Windows native version of Accordance is released I'm going to work with it in parallel with Logos, the current emulator setup doesn't let You unless You fancy switching between them with Alt+Tab a lot. Then I will be letting Logos use about ⅓ of the monitor having just a Bible open and using Prioritize.

Also: Discuss books with a (future) friend.

Currently I'm not purchasing more in Accordance (except perhaps UBS Handbook NT and version 11 Starter Collection for a future friend), instead I'm waiting for the release of NA29 (I don't have NA28 but know about the differences in the text compared to NA27), and meanwhile I have a Syntax module (that I bought at a sale) that can't be used until I have the Gk NT in Accordance:

Bob Pritchett:
What's the first thing (if anything) you do 'outside Logos' when you're done using Logos? (For example, one pastor told me it was searching the Internet for royalty-free images to add to his slides.)

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Alan Macgregor | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Aug 8 2013 11:28 AM

Bob

Bob Pritchett:

- A sermon outline.

I use Logos every week for my sermon preparation. With my Sermon Analysis layout I produce my initial notes as a Clippings file whose individual clippings I then Tag with my sermon headings. Then with my Sermon Synthesis layout, which includes my PB Quotations book, I prepare my sermon using a Mind-mapping program. A fair bit of editing of selected clippings, copying and pasting goes on with scriptural cross-references included using Copy Bible Verses in order to produce my mind-map outline for Sunday.

Bob Pritchett:

- An academic paper or article.

I used Libronix for my part-time PhD thesis at University of Aberdeen. Steve Runge's Discourse Analysis titles were invaluable, as was some personal advice from Steve himself. With its great search facilities (even in Libronix) Logos enabled me to complete my PhD on time within the strict time-constraints of working as a single-handed pastor with a large two-congregation parish (overall population over 6000). Without Logos I couldn't have done it – in fact I wouldn't have contemplated doing it.

I now use Logos 5 for post-doctoral work, doing research and preparing papers for personal use and, hopefully, for publication.

Bob Pritchett:

- A full-manuscript sermon.

I used Logos in this way from Logos 1.6 in the early 1990s through to 2006 from Libronix, when I switched to mind-mapping sermon outlines.

I would not like to be without Logos, though I have never used its multi-media offshoots, as we don't have video-projection facilities. Anyway, I preach and teach rather than present and lecture.

Thanks for Logos, Bob.

Every blessing

Alan

iMac Retina 5K, 27": 3.6GHz 8-Core Intel Core i9; 16GB RAM;MacOS 10.15.5; 1TB SSD; Logos 8

MacBook Air 13.3": 1.8GHz; 4GB RAM; MacOS 10.13.6; 256GB SSD; Logos 8

iPad Pro 32GB WiFi iOS 13.5.1

iPhone 8+ 64GB iOS 13.5.1

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Kevin A. Purcell | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Aug 8 2013 2:01 PM

I come to Logos usually on my phone or tablet first to read the passage. I also read my daily devotions there and a family devotion.

For study at church, I begin with Bible and notes. I make notes as I read and re-read a passage. Then I ask questions and try to search for answers in various places depending on the question ...

  • language study usually begins with the ESV rev. int. and do I searches for the root/lemma etc. and then after that I consult dictionaries to test my conclusions
  • for background on things like social or cultural I consult Bible background first and then dictionaries
  • for interpretive questions I consult my favorite commentaries (NAC, Expositors, Word, NICOT/NT)

All throughout I record findings in notes attached to the Bible reference.

When it's time to begin to formulate my passage Big Idea (theme) I open Pages and begin to put together my preaching notes document with a working title, passage and then I paste the passage. I do a structural diagram (used to use logos for this but its too clunky) showing relationships of clauses and words to one another.

I write out my main idea in the form of a question - "What's the purpose of the church?" might be one. Then I look back through the passage and my notes to come up with the answer based on the text. If I'm struggling at this point I run a passage guide or sermon guide.

Once I have my outline, I go back and run the passage or sermon guide if I haven't already and get preaching ideas. I go to the internet to find relevant present day illustrations, videos, ideas from movies or TV and images to help me present the ideas of my main idea.

I have a final form of a Pages doc with and outline - no longer do full manuscripts. Then I put together a presentation in Proclaim for now with all the graphics, video clips (if any) and bible passages.

That's for sermons and mostly for Bible Study. If it is a Bible study I don't go as far with it letting the group provide much of the real world illustrations and applications through discussion.

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Edwin Bowden | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Aug 8 2013 3:22 PM

Bob,

Thanks for providing this request for input from Logos users. In reading the forums, Logos seems to be used primarily by "professionals" (pastors/professors, etc.) or students.

I am always encouraged to find users who are Sunday School or Bible Study teachers like me. Unlike many others, I do have the benefit of a degree in Biblical studies. My Greek is very rusty, so I don't rely on my knowledge, but I can benefit from some of the tools the professionals use.

I have taught a Sunday School class for 45 yrs. Logos enables me to accomplish many things that I would not be able to do otherwise. My teaching is through a book of the Bible, verse by verse.

I begin my preparation by copying the scripture text that I will be using into Word. As I read through the passage, I begin arranging the text to structurally show main thoughts and subordinate thoughts. I always go through the book that we are studying and identify the key terms or phrases and highlight them. When the modifications of the text is complete, I print it out so the class has the same passage analysis in front of them.

As I do my research in Logos, I modify my original organization of the text in light of additional insights gained. If I find significant information from a Logos resource, I excerpt it and share it with the class in a handout.

I may compile info into a chart and share that with the class. I occasionally print out the parallel translations for difficult passages for the class.

I spent 3 years teaching through the Gospel of Mark. Although I focused on the material in Mark's gospel, there were times that I would print out a passage in Harmony of the Gospels format. I would line them up phrase by phrase highlighting the differences. When we got to the passion week, I decided to finish the study using the harmony approach so we captured all the events in the finals days of Jesus.

I am currently teaching through the Pastoral Epistles. I am using Rick Brannan's Parallel Passages as my basic text. I have taught through the PE several times, but had never thought of doing it through all 3 books at once until I discovered his resource in Logos. It is a great way to cover that material. 

 

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Kent | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Aug 8 2013 3:26 PM

Unix:
I'm not interested in the NIV11. I passed on it when it was briefly offered for free in L5. And if it's going to be included in all base-packages I'm not going to upgrade!! ;-(

Unix, one resource would keep you from upgrading?

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Dave Moser | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Aug 9 2013 8:11 AM

My three Logos outcomes:

  1. A full-manuscript sermon (written in MS Word)
  2. Academic paper (written in MS Word)
  3. Questions for a small group Bible study on a particular passage (written in Logos notes file)

I don't add visuals because I don't use slides.

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Unix | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Aug 9 2013 9:21 AM

Hi, Kent! Follows my reply about the NIV11 and base-packages.
That's right, I don't want to encourage Logos if they are including such a Bible and I would be telling everyone not to get a base-package! Base-packages are the weakness of Logos. Those who make the decisions at Logos may think that they are making a profit on the base-package and thereby being able to lower prices on the rest of what is offered and that is how it should be, but honestly the base-packages could contain much newer works, less of dogmatic and systematic theology, and be more varied. It's strange how a base-package such as Silver which I have tested twice, has overlapping works such as for example Bible Exposition Commentary (which is NT only) by Wiersbe and Opening Up which seems to be by Baptists. It seems to me that it would have been more logical to include the entire OT BE-series in Silver instead of Opening Up - the total price could have been kept down too. Those together with NAC make Silver a quite Baptist base-package.
It's also peculiar how each base-packages Bronze and up contains everything from the lower base-packages. I understand that one reason for that is simplicity, but anyhow I think it's a drawback. The only exceptions being Biblical Languages and that the regular base-packages don't contain the Verbum books. Biblical Languages would be a fine option for me, except that I have Original Languages and I got LSJ really cheap in Logos in 2013.
An idea might also be a combined Evangelical/Reformed/Protestant/Roman-Catholic base-package. I find the step to Verbum Basic to be pretty steep. I used to have L4 Catholic Foundations and upgraded it to L5 Verbum Basic, but eventually gave it away. Needless to say the lowest Verbum base-package would have to develop a whole lot to appeal to me again - I'm very dissatisfied with the Early Church Fathers set in it I would rather not have it. I'm actually considering buying the Worship in the Early Church: An Anthology of Historical Sources even though it only contains snippets and is pretty expensive at the $99 pre-pub price locked for me, just because it has a fresh translation from the original languages (I have volume 1 as printed matter that's why I'm hesitating I'm unsure about paying that much to get the rest, having the first volume in Logos could be convenient though):

Kent:
Unix, one resource would keep you from upgrading?

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Sleiman | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Aug 9 2013 9:28 AM

I may be the odd one out here, but thought of sharing anyway.

I'm not a liturgist/cantor/deacon/pastor/priest/elder/minister/bishop/pope/etc... Not a Sunday school teacher/worship leader/youth minister/choir member/women's league member/knight of Columbus or even an altar boy. Not in any other specific ministry either... My profession is as secular as it can be.

But I happen to be a son of God who loves the church and the bible and wants to study it and read about it and about the church and saints and history and and... all for  the sole purpose of personal edification.  

Logos might be overkill for my purposes but I like it. 

Therefore, no physical output from my use except perhaps an answer to an online thread or a comment on a blog.

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Bruce Dunning | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Aug 10 2013 5:06 PM

Thanks for asking Bob.

I use Logos for a variety of purposes. Here they are in order of frequency:

  1. Personal devotions and Bible reading daily
  2. Original language study to increase my knowledge of Scripture
  3. Preparation for teaching and preaching (Generally I have not used Logos a lot to imbed images and for presentation purposes but I may be interested in doing this in the future)
  4. Personal interest reading

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Keep Smiling 4 Jesus :) | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Aug 11 2013 7:40 PM

Bob Pritchett:
When you use Logos, what's the 'work product' of your study?

Logos wiki and screen shot(s) for forum discussions.  Thankful for Logos sharing of documents.

Posted => Suggestion: Parallel Bible Print-on-Demand since one output of Logos is printed screen shots.

Personal growth.

Keep Smiling Smile

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JT (alabama24) | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Aug 11 2013 7:58 PM

Bob Pritchett:

When you use Logos, what's the 'work product' of your study?

  1. Personal Devotions via mobile app
  2. Reading for growth (generally via mobile app)
  3. Study for "talks"

I have known about Logos, and have even owned resources at various points for many years. When I gleefully switched to Mac many moons ago, that changed. I was reintroduced to Logos during my last semester of seminary. I wish I had been reintroduced a little sooner... Smile

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Josh | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Aug 11 2013 7:59 PM

All of the above. Smile

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