Day 12 of Christmas Special

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Jacob Hantla | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Dec 20 2009 8:56 AM

Randy Hartman:

Exposition of Prayer?  For me this is a big dud.  It's just as well.  No money.

I purchased The Exposition of Prayer on prepub. I have found it very very useful (and heart shepherding) in some areas of the Bible and mediocre in others. Nevertheless, I am very happy with the purchase. And, knowing what I know now after more than a year (maybe 2?) of reading it, I would definitely buy it again.

I know some people (who went to Master's Seminary) who know Rosscup (He has taught the class on prayer there for years). The unanimous sentiment from them is that he is the man they know who prays the most. I want to learn what the BIble says about prayer from a man who knows God in prayer. The resource is an expositional commentary on all of the passages in Scripture that remotely are connected with prayer. And I find that he does a good job of sticking with the text, diligently restraining his statements to what the text actually means, but all of this is well informed by his personal experience with prayer.

So if you are considering buying it, know that this is a good discount on the resource. I'd recommend, if you have the resources, that you go for it. If you find that it isn't what you expected or you are dissatisfied, Logos will give you a refund (I believe that there is a 30-day window on this).

Jacob Hantla
Pastor/Elder, Grace Bible Church
gbcaz.org

Posts 19277
Rosie Perera | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Dec 20 2009 9:08 AM

I've taught a one-day class on prayer twice before, so this title did initially intrigue me. But I decided not to buy it for a couple of reasons:

I already have an extensive print-based library on prayer. Most of them are best read away from the computer, actually. Prayer is something I find very much at odds with the technological side of my life and it's kind of my life's work to figure out how to pray well and spend more time in prayer, in spite of living in this technological society. I also aim to help others learn to do the same.  (See my blog on Faith & Technology.)

If I wanted to get any books on prayer in Logos format, my preference would be for something like Prayer in the New Testament by Oscar Cullman (Fortress Press), a classically trained Lutheran theologian who was a professor of NT at Basel Reformed Seminary; a collection of the classic ancient writings on prayer (Brother Lawrence, Madame Guyon, The Way of a Pilgrim, The Cloud of Unknowing, etc.); or a volume of collected written prayers of great Christians throughout the centuries (such as 2000 Years of Prayer, edited by Michael Counsell, or The Westminster Collection of Christian Prayers, edited by Dorothy Stewart). I looked at the sample pages of Dr. Rosscup's work and while it was his life's work so I don't want to knock it, it reads like a popular book not a scholarly work. And yet...and yet...it's missing something of that richness that the ancient writers on prayer (who were, many of them, just simple Christians writing "popular" works) have. There's a depth to them that draws you in. This tome felt rather dry and expository, which is what it's meant to be (not dry, but expository). However, that isn't the kind of work I need right now. I need either spiritual depth or scholarly rigor (or both), but not a kind of Sunday school manual that doesn't make up for what it lacks in both of those latter with its exhaustiveness. I'm just not likely to read through 5 volumes of this, and it's not "referency" enough for me to use as a "look stuff up in Logos with it" kind of text.

Thos are just my reasons, and I've got my own unique story, so don't let me discourage  you if the price looks tempting. I'm sure it's very true to the biblical text and a through work by a devoted pilgrim of faith. And I'm glad to hear that Jacob has been blessed by it.

Posts 298
Kaye Anderson | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Dec 20 2009 9:08 AM

Thanks, Jacob.  This was helpful to me.

"But you, be sober in all things, endure hardship, do the work of an evangelist, fulfill your ministry."  2 Timothy 4:5 (NASB)

Posts 300
Hapax Legomena | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Dec 20 2009 9:09 AM

I'm sure it's a fine book and all but the disappointment is that we were hoping for a 'boffo' offer like the Yale Anchor Bible commentary set for $199.00.

Posts 42
JM | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Dec 20 2009 9:24 AM

Tom Geswein:
Hhmm...  I was kind of excited when I saw this, but now I wonder.  Are the negative comments because you own it and don't like it, or are you "just not interested?" 

Well...I bought this resource on PrePub for $79.95.  Yeah!  Logos!!!  Big Smile  But back to this resource...Although I haven't used it in the past year, it's a good resource because it has revolutionized the way I define and hence approach prayer.  The 5 volume resource basically handles all scripture as prayers and present them as such...At least that's what I got from them.  So now, as a result, prayer for me is ANY communication where God is mentioned (conventional closing of eyes and folding of hands), thought about...pondered and treasured about (like Mary)....even grips, and expression of anger are prayers (David in the Psalms)...But the key is not so much to "include" God into our lives as the goal is to enter into His.  To include God into our lives is noble, but to enter into His world...Aaah!...That's a horse of different color!...From the Wizard of Oz.  (Do you want Obama to hang out with you...where you live?  OR, do you want to hang out with Obama and enter into where he lives?  Whether or not you like Obama, I bet you wouldn't mind tagging along with him for a week or a day just to see what goes on!  That feeling should be the same way with God.) 

So long as God is included in any thought, it qualifies as a prayer.  A Baptist Congregational Meeting or Board Meeting as heated as it can be--is a prayer...so long as God is acknowledged and even if He is not acknowledged...that's a prayer too...And that's why we must be careful in ALL we say (or post Ick!...please don't admonish me...I'm just a pup in Christ...Sad)  and how we act and react...because we are actually praying ill or good when we do.  For our "prayers"--including lack of prayers, we will be held accountable.

The reason I haven't opened and read this 5 volume collection in quite a while--along with every new purchase I buy--is because I'm constantly distracted and pulled away by the latest and greatest shiny new Logos "toy" I've purchased on PrePub, Upgrades, Deal of the Day, Library Builder, AND a la cart downloads when I can't get a deal even!  I haven't finished reading all of NAC or put a dent in my "Gold" Library (at the time I got NAC).  So why have I bought WBC, BST, ITC, Boice, Interpretation, Pradis EBC-NIVAC-NT/OT Prophet and Scholar's Library, Life Application, Preacher's, Lange, all JPS stuff, Ariel's, Answering Jewish Objections, NICOT/NT, Pulpit..I didn't own a base package at that time because it was "too expensive"?  Even though some of you have talked me out of the Portfolio upgrade, I STILL WANT IT!!!  AND ANCHOR BIBLE TOO!!!

Logos Anonymous anyone?  Wink

Incidentally, I just put in an order for a new computer to run all this more efficiently.  Hopefully I'll have up and running by tomorrow, a brand-spanking new computer with 2.8 Ghz quad core CPU, 8 GB RAM, 1 GB video RAM, and 750 GB hard drive indexing my Platinum Library in about...2 secs.  Super Angry

Posts 653
Alex Scott | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Dec 20 2009 9:52 AM

StevenLeavitt:
I for one am quite sadden to the negative responses against this item.
(Rosscup)

I don't think the 'negative responses' came about so much about the resource itself as the disappointment about the last day.  Day 1 started off with an item that if I'm not mistaken was given away free at one time, or at least it was peanuts as far as savings go.  That was hardly surprising as it wouldn't make sense to run everyone out of money on the first day.  But as time went on, I think we were all looking forward to some kind of grand climax on day 12, and what we got was a grand disappointment to most of us.

Speaking for myself, I was kind of disappointed in the whole thing.  There was only one item that I didn't already have, and it was tainted by the addition of a more than $20 shipping charge which negated much of the savings.  However, what do you buy someone that has everything? (not that I have all the resources - not by a long shot).

Still, on the other side of things, I have been extremely grateful for all the additional resources at great savings in upgrading to the Portfolio package, as well as the great savings over the years on other Christmas specials, the PrePubs, and Community Pricing issues.  I think we should all be happy for the newer users with less resources than we who have benefited from the current specials.

Longtime Logos user (more than $30,000 in purchases) - now a second class user because I won't pay them more every month or year.

Posts 3810
spitzerpl | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Dec 20 2009 10:18 AM

Rosie Perera:
Prayer is something I find very much at odds with the technological side of my life and it's kind of my life's work to figure out how to pray well and spend more time in prayer

If you'd like I could generate a macro to take over some of your more routine praying. :-)

Posts 9947
George Somsel | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Dec 20 2009 10:35 AM

Randy Hartman:

Exposition of Prayer?  For me this is a big dud.  It's just as well.  No money.

I'm just glad that the items I would want were things that I already have -- I saved money that way.  I have far too many things on prepub to be spending now.

george
gfsomsel

יְמֵי־שְׁנוֹתֵינוּ בָהֶם שִׁבְעִים שָׁנָה וְאִם בִּגְבוּרֹת שְׁמוֹנִים שָׁנָה וְרָהְבָּם עָמָל וָאָוֶן

Posts 9947
George Somsel | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Dec 20 2009 10:38 AM

Rosie Perera:
I already have an extensive print-based library on prayer. Most of them are best read away from the computer, actually. Prayer is something I find very much at odds with the technological side of my life and it's kind of my life's work to figure out how to pray well and spend more time in prayer, in spite of living in this technological society. I also aim to help others learn to do the same.  (See my blog on Faith & Technology.)

You could follow the Tibetan practice an make a prayer wheel then set it outside to catch the wind so that as it turned your prayer would be repeated.  Oh, that's right -- we're not to be heard for our much speaking or to make vain repetitions.  Big Smile

george
gfsomsel

יְמֵי־שְׁנוֹתֵינוּ בָהֶם שִׁבְעִים שָׁנָה וְאִם בִּגְבוּרֹת שְׁמוֹנִים שָׁנָה וְרָהְבָּם עָמָל וָאָוֶן

Posts 187
Rev. D. | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Dec 20 2009 11:04 AM

I have a ton of resources, both in Logos and in print, on prayer which is why this resource wasn't something that I was particularly interested in at this time. My disappointment certainly had nothing to do with this particular offering, I'm sure it's great. My heart was really set on the Anchor Yale Bible Commentary; however, it is indeed great to sit back and think about all of the resources I have at my disposal and it is indeed a blessing. 

 

iMac 27 inch, 3.1 GHz Core i5, 1T HD, 4 GB RAM

 

Posts 1674
Paul Golder | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Dec 20 2009 11:09 AM

Philip Spitzer:
If you'd like I could generate a macro to take over some of your more routine praying. :-)

Phil, will this run in Logos 4, or is a 3rd party program required? :-)

 

"As any translator will attest, a literal translation is no translation at all."

Posts 187
Anthony Etienne | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Dec 20 2009 11:22 AM

JimVanSchoonhoven:

I just hope that all of our blessings do not get in the way, of our relationship with Christ!  And yet, I admit, I am egarly looking forward to more resources to further round out the library that God has blessed me with!

Your brother in Christ,

Jim

Preach it brother!

Amen

Anthony

Posts 3810
spitzerpl | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Dec 20 2009 11:22 AM

I've been working on it all day, but every time I go to test it out lighting strikes my house and takes out my computer. I'm on my 3rd one now!

Posts 42
JM | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Dec 20 2009 11:49 AM

George Somsel:
I'm just glad that the items I would want were things that I already have -- I saved money that way.  I have far too many things on prepub to be spending now.

I agree but not at first.  Like many of you, I was also disappointed this morning--but not because of the resource itself--but because I already have it.  It's still a blessing nevertheless because I was actually dreading that the last day's deal would be too irresistible.  I was fearing to see this this morning:  "You've asked for it...Even prayed for it...So now...FOR ONE DAY ONLY...Logos Ultimate Collection Upgrade!  EVERYTHING in our Logos library for just pennies on the dollar...Just use our discount upgrade calculator for you personalized upgrade price and the next time you open up Logos 4, you'll see "What you have" and "What you'll get with Logos Ultimate Upgrade"...Payment plan available..."  Big Smile

Note:  I'm not mocking Logos at all or any of their marketing methods...Sad

I'm curious...Do I have enough space on my new computer to house the complete Logos Library all indexed?  Hmm

Also, a final note, I'm glad I can finally get to bed at a decent hour.  I'm in the east coast and have to wait until past 3am to get an early glimpse of the Deal of the Day.  And when I did purchase--three times I might add--I stayed up for another hour downloading and sync-ing...in both L4 and L3 until I got to bed at about 4am.  Then I'd get up at 5:30am to do my devotions and start my day meeting God through Logos!  Praise God!  Life is good...Thanks Logos, for depleting my funds and depriving me of sleep...And I do mean that in the very best way.  Wink  It's been really fun!

Posts 1956
Donovan R. Palmer | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Dec 20 2009 11:55 AM

JonelyMoy:
I'm curious...Do I have enough space on my new computer to house the complete Logos Library all indexed?  Hmm

It's not just the hard drive space, but the time it would take to index 10,000+ resources. I would be curious to know if the guys in the Logos labs have done this with everything that is available to Logos and how long it took.  I have about 2,000+ and it takes 6ish hours as it is! I would guess then it would take in excess of 30 hours. That wouldn't be so bad as a one off, but merging indexes and having to reindex in the event of a problem would be a real drag... literally a drag on your computer. Wink

Posts 569
J. Morris | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Dec 20 2009 12:53 PM

If I remember correctly, Bob (Logos Commander-in-Chief) said they had not planned on doing a Christmas special this year because they were offing great discounts on base packages for both new-users and us old-timers.

So I suppose we were lucky to get what we got... That being said, I didn't buy anything, although I would have loved to have had the funds for that great commentary set, there just wasn't anything that was of great intrest to me. (a counseling collections would have "tempted" me the most)

Posts 3810
spitzerpl | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Dec 20 2009 1:23 PM

RalphMauch:
I agree Floyd, but Phil, what resources do you think Luther had to buy, or the rest used?

True enough, and you make some great points to keep in mind. For me I have about $150 that I can use only on education resources and need to use them this year, so this is definitely catching my eye. I just hope that those who are disappointed with Day 12 are not disappointed because its "just" a book about prayer.

Posts 59
Westie | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Dec 20 2009 1:54 PM

Are you kidding me?

This commentary is a real blessing.  It has the most extensive topical index on prayer, that links to scripture, that I have ever seen.  The index alone is worth the purchase.

Anyone who loves to pray will love this resource.

 

Posts 383
Stephen Thorp | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Dec 20 2009 3:35 PM

Sure! it would be lovely to have a big commentary resource on offer at a fantastic price that I could afford (even at a discount the WBC set was too much for me!) BUT I did buy "The Drama of Scripture" with it's wonderful exploration of 'Covenant' and I purchased "The Kingdom of Priests" which looks like a great over view of OT history (which even refers to Bimson's early date for the Exodus which most scholars now favour) so all in all I'M HAPPY & CONTENT with what was  offered. Thanks Logos for a great Christmas sale. 

With a mere 534 resources at my disposal may I suggest to folk that it's not the number of resources that make you a great scholar (or preacher) but how you use what you have.

Christmas Greetings everyone!

Ps. I do have to agree with our forum thread leader that Day 12 seemed a bit of an odd choice - but each to their own I guess!

 

Posts 3810
spitzerpl | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Dec 20 2009 3:58 PM

Stephen Thorp:
With a mere 534 resources at my disposal may I suggest to folk that it's not the number of resources that make you a great scholar (or preacher) but how you use what you have.

I'm building up a large library because I'm banking on implantable neurological chips in the near future.

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