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Posts 10
Brian Collins | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Feb 20 2014 6:42 AM

I agree with Daniel Lee:

Daniel Lee:

My argument: Improve the Windows Store Logos app not because of Windows RT device market share, but because then you tap into all those Windows 8.1 customers who are getting tablets and touchscreen laptops and other devices that can run your app.  Sure, they can install Logos 5 (and then 6, 7, etc).  ... If there's no app, then I am less and less motivated to use Logos.  Then when I see those books sitting idle in my electronic library, I'm tempted to not have the money tied up in Logos.  

If you make it easy to let customers access the books on all their devices, they're more likely to buy Logos books and Vyrso books, whether they need them or not. If you make it hard, they'll look elsewhere - Amazon, Olive Tree, and your other competitors.

 I further agree with his statement that having a table of contents is the absolute minimum feature for the app to become usable. If that one feature can be added, then Logos makes their offerings more attractive for anyone using Windows 8/8.1.

Posts 80
Daniel R Bartholomew | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Feb 22 2014 3:21 PM

Not being a programmer, I have no idea what kind of work is involved in making the Logos "Metro" app more usable.  However, I agree with the stated reasons: it can be a "gateway" to generate more use among others--especially if there's a lot of free features (accessible only when connected to the internet, possibly) available.  But I know that Logos is a business, too, so as much as I'd like to see a better Windows App, I understand if they believe it would be a wasted effort with little or no ROI projected.

Posts 2839
Michael Childs | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Feb 26 2014 12:48 PM

JoshInRI:

I do not think anyone at Logos actually cares about Windows (touch) Tablet users or Windows Phone users.

Hopefully I will be proven wrong soon.

I don't think that I agree with that.  Logos is a business, and I think they are interested in any format that will be profitable.  I would agree that they may be underestimating the potential of the Windows Tablets.  But if there continue to be more and more of us, they will come around.

"In all cases, the Church is to be judged by the Scripture, not the Scripture by the Church," John Wesley

Posts 38
Brian Crawford | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Mar 2 2014 3:05 PM
My argument: 1. The market failure of Windows RT is irrelevant because there are millions of full x86 Windows touch screen tablets and PC's being sold and, as far as I know, Microsoft's tools allow easy compiling to both RT and x86 targets. 2. More and more x86 Windows tablets are being sold, especially 8-inch tablets like the Dell Venue 8 Pro. A full featured mobile app would be much more user friendly than the full desktop application. 3. To be useful for me, I would need the Metro app to include TOC navigation, highlighting, and notes. I've used the Android app and it has many other features, but I would want these three first before any others. In the meantime, if you have an x86 tablet like the Surface Pro, I would suggest you use TouchMousePointer (freeware) along with desktop Logos. This removes the need for an active stylus.
Posts 2839
Michael Childs | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Mar 4 2014 11:48 AM

I run Logos 5 on my Surface Pro 2, and love it.  But I also could see the advantage of a good Windows 8 app for reading Logos.

I think one thing that would be very important in an Win 8 app, is to allow it to access the Logos 5 library so that one would not have to download double copies of books.  Otherwise I would just prefer to put the book in a floating window and read it from Logos 5.

"In all cases, the Church is to be judged by the Scripture, not the Scripture by the Church," John Wesley

Posts 602
Bill Anderson | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Mar 4 2014 12:59 PM

Bob's reply to the current state of the Windows "metro" app may be found here. It has been discussed in that and other threads over the past months.

I like the Windows ecosystem, but as a Logos user I would be concerned with the deployment of resources by Logos to create an app that is not justified by significant market share. It means that resources used to develop and maintain this app are diverted from other areas where development is needed. Logos 5 is still not feature complete and many Logos users want the feature set of the old Libronix app brought into Logos 5. Many OS X users want attention paid to the Mac app. I personally would like to see the lag in the Android app addressed when adding highlighting.

This is a question of the strategic use of resources. Once the Windows "metro" app gains significantly greater traction, I wouldn't be surprised to see Logos develop for it.

Posts 2839
Michael Childs | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Mar 4 2014 4:25 PM

Bill Anderson:

Bob's reply to the current state of the Windows "metro" app may be found here. It has been discussed in that and other threads over the past months.

I like the Windows ecosystem, but as a Logos user I would be concerned with the deployment of resources by Logos to create an app that is not justified by significant market share. It means that resources used to develop and maintain this app are diverted from other areas where development is needed. Logos 5 is still not feature complete and many Logos users want the feature set of the old Libronix app brought into Logos 5. Many OS X users want attention paid to the Mac app. I personally would like to see the lag in the Android app addressed when adding highlighting.

This is a question of the strategic use of resources. Once the Windows "metro" app gains significantly greater traction, I wouldn't be surprised to see Logos develop for it.

Bill, you make some good points.  I am sure Bob and the Logos leadership will carefully analyze what is in the best interest of the company in allocating resources.  Bob has proven a very good and visionary businessman.

In the mean time I am happy as can be with Logos 5 running on my tablet.  Unless a Windows 8 app allowed use of my full library, including personal books, I would probably wouldn't use it at all.  I would be interested in a windows 8 interface that did allow such use. 

"In all cases, the Church is to be judged by the Scripture, not the Scripture by the Church," John Wesley

Posts 274
Daniel Lee | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Mar 23 2014 10:44 AM

I tried Logos 5 and it's frustratingly clunky (without a keyboard) in terms of all the steps involved to do something simple like swap between books in reading mode.  Most of the time I'm not using all the bells and whistles but rather just wanted to do reading of the content I've bought in Logos format.  I'll come up with questions and do searches later, but at first, I'm just reading the text(s).

This is hard to do in Logos 5 (sans keyboard) but easy in Android.

In the Android app...open the app, select library, tap search, tap once more to open the book. Want to switch to a new book? Library, search, open the book. In Logos 5, you have to go to library, find the book, open it, click the book name, pick reading view, then to switch to a new book, click the book name, turn off reading view, go to library, search, open book, tap book name, back to reading view.

This is compounded because the keyboard doesn't pop up automatically except on keyboard apps. So picking verses is even worse...click book name, exit reading view, click spot to enter text, manually pop up keyboard to enter text, pop it down to see the screen, tap book name, select reading mode, etc. Logos 5 is great with a keyboard but tedious without it.

This is where a simple app for would serve for simple Bible and book reading, then someone can hook up a keyboard for in-depth study or research and use Logos 5. Please consider fixing the Metro/Windows Store app.  Add basic features like table of contents, search, passage guide, and then you have the core features of the Android or iOS apps.  This gets casual users 'in the door' and open to buying more resources over time.

As I said before it's not about who's using Windows RT but regular Windows users moving to Windows 8 who want simple apps as well as full featured programs. As things stand right now I can't just buy one device - a Surface or Asus T100 or Dell Venue or similar all in one - and have a Windows Store/Metro app for reading/initial study and then full Logos 5 when it's time to finalize the study/sermon/paper.  I have to buy a laptop or desktop plus a phone or iPad/Android tablet/Kindle Fire to get reading as well as full Logos.  Which means more money spent on hardware to access the books I already have and less money for me to spend buying Logos books.  I may be a unique situation but I'm guessing I'm not the only one.

Posts 19
Eric Gren | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Mar 23 2014 11:04 AM

Daniel Lee:
I tried Logos 5 and it's frustratingly clunky (without a keyboard)

I have been struggling with this all week and came on here to post a comment about it when I read Daniel's post.  I have an ASUS t100 and it runs Logos 5 well enough but I only use it when I travel and don't want to carry the big laptop or am just reading.  The biggest problem I have is that I need to highlight what I think is important in my textbooks for reference later but there is no highlight option.  I like to float the panel for whichever book I am reading to make it full screen and then put it in reading mode so I can turn pages instead of scrolling but when I do that I can't bring up the keyboard.  Without the keyboard I can't highlight without adding a note but then I have little note icons all over and it distracts from when I really add a note.  I understand that Logos is a business and as such needs to be profitable and that requires decisions on where to allocate resources but the answer that there is no need to develop a Windows 8 app because users can run full Logos doesn't make sense.  If Logos was more optimized for touch input rather than a keyboard I could accept the logic.  Please consider further development of the Windows app or make the full Logos touch capable for simple highlighting and switching between books.

Posts 274
Daniel Lee | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Mar 24 2014 12:16 PM

Eric Gren:

Daniel Lee:
I tried Logos 5 and it's frustratingly clunky (without a keyboard)

If Logos was more optimized for touch input rather than a keyboard I could accept the logic.  Please consider further development of the Windows app or make the full Logos touch capable for simple highlighting and switching between books.

This is the crux of the issue for me.  Better touch support in Windows 8 for Logos 5 would be an acceptable solution.  A full-fledged Windows Store/Metro app would be ideal, but I could live with Logos 5 if it had better touch support. 

Posts 1
Jeremy | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Jan 2 2016 2:47 PM

Has there been any movement with the Windows app? I have the Asus T100 and would love to have an app for the Logos 6.

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