I'm sorry to say it, but extremely disappointed in Logos software

OK, after years of owning and using Logos software, I am completely exasperated. This software has never worked well, and of all the software I have ever bought, it is by far the most expensive, the most problematic, and the most disappointing.

I have a brand new MacBook Air 1.8GHZ that should be plenty powerful to run Logos with no problem. The software is sluggish and it crashes all the time. I have followed the procedures on the support pages, but have seen no improvement.

I'm sorry to say this, but I will not recommend to anyone that they buy this software. If people ask me about Logos (and they often do when they find out I have it) I will tell them not to buy it.

These are not isolated or only recent issues. I have been using Logos since Libronix and with each upgrade or new release I think things are going to be better and they never are. I have thought many times of writing and expressing my frustration and have often just felt that others will do the complaining so I won't have to. But today I decided to let my complaint be known. If I were in management at Logos, I would want to know how customers feel about the software, so hopefully this will bring, if even in a small degree, some light on the fact that here is one more customer who does not like Logos software, as much as I would like to like it.

I will keep using it because of all the money, time, work, and resources that I have invested in my Logos installation. I have years of notes that I can only access through Logos. Most of my theological library is in Logos. But I hope to never spend another dime on upgrades because I have zero confidence that this company can produce good software unless something radically changes.

sign me, one very frustrated customer

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Comments

MJ. Smith

I'm a PC user which is a quite different experience based on the forum posts of Mac users. It would be more helpful to Logos if you were a bit more specific about what causes your frustrations i.e. where should the put their resources if they wish to meet your expectations?

bryan jay

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/546938#Comment_546938

First of all, I can see from the number of your posts that you are not the type of user who minds investing time into thinking about and dealing with the software itself. I think I am a more typical user in that I want to spend my time doing Bible study and reading books on Logos.

My post was general because its purpose was not to diagnose the multiple problems with Logos software. It is meant to let the engineers know that their Mac version does not work well in general. I mentioned that the program bombs, but it would be more correct to say that it constantly hangs up. This often occurs when I am trying to shut down my mac, or when I am bringing it out of sleep. It also occurs almost every time that Logos tries to update itself.

The program is so slow that when I just need to find a Bible verse, I don't use Logos, but a website.

My computer has probably already sent hundreds of reports to Logos, so I guess to be honest with you, I would like the engineers to address what those reports are reporting. My expectations would be that the software could work more quickly and without hanging all the time, and that I could get it working well without having to spend money on an upgrade.

DMB

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/546942#Comment_546942

bryan, I have a lot of posts, but not as many as MJ. Plus, I agree with you, so I don't get a red star next to my cute picture.

I really don't think you'll have much trouble finding folks in the same predicament as yourself, on the Mac side. The Windows side works better, but Logos is a Windows company.

On the Mac side, there seems to be no-problem users, and then there's big-problem users. And Logos expresses little distinction on how to move the second group into the first. Many of the Mac developers for Logos live south of us across the Black mountains, and we kind of cringe at the criticism they take pretty regularly.

But bottom line, you shouldn't have to tinker with the software to try to use it. You're right.

bryan jay

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/547006#Comment_547006

I understand that the mac software programmers are probably very nice people doing the best they can. I just finally decided to post not to make people feel bad, but just to add my voice to what appears to be many mac users unsatisfied with Logos' mac version. Like I said before, the company needs to hear this and develop a plan to improve the software. Until it is actually improved, I will not recommend it.

Jack Caviness

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/547051#Comment_547051

Until it is actually improved, I will not recommend it.

Perhaps you should try reading this post 547017.aspx. It addresses a coming fix for the type of problem you mentioned in one of your posts above. However, not all Mac users are unhappy with Logos. In fact, there are quite a few of us who report few problems. Those who experience problems have a choice—they can either complain that Logos does not fix the bugs in the Mac version, or they can submit bug reports and logs to become part of the solution.

I know that there are a few Mac users who are experiencing serious problems, but a series of posts saying this software is lousy, while refusing to provide specific information, helps no one.

Dan Francis

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/547051#Comment_547051

I understand that the mac software programmers are probably very nice people doing the best they can. I just finally decided to post not to make people feel bad, but just to add my voice to what appears to be many mac users unsatisfied with Logos' mac version. Like I said before, the company needs to hear this and develop a plan to improve the software. Until it is actually improved, I will not recommend it.

As a long time mac user and mac Logos user (since Libronix 3.0 under virtual pc, right up to Logos 5 today). Now I did like the speed and the good mac interface of Libronix mac 1.2.2 but I am happy to have the power of Logos 5.0. Logos 4, for me anyway, was virtually nothing but disappointment, but I am doing quite well with 5. I am sorry to hear you are not happy but I do believe you are in the minority... It may well be a sizeable minority, but I think the majority of Mac Users are happy. I can appreciate your not recommending it, indeed I am a fan of Accordance due to it's speed and stability, but I can say I would not have a problem recommending Logos myself., I would encourage people to look at both applications and decide for themselves which will serve them best.

-Dan

Keep Smiling 4 Jesus :)

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/547051#Comment_547051

My post was general because its purpose was not to diagnose the multiple problems with Logos software. It is meant to let the engineers know that their Mac version does not work well in general.

What are the top three Logos items that generally need improvement on OS X ?

Until it is actually improved, I will not recommend it.

Please elaborate on your top three irritants for using Logos 5 ?

Thankful for many Logos 5 improvements on OS X:

Full Screen => Logos 4 Mac Enhancements

Substantial Feature Parity => Improve Logos 4 Mac Feature Parity with PC

Dreaming about more, especially menu response => Improve Logos 4 Menu Responsiveness (longer than a second always feels slow to a human) and color customization along with completing accessibility for blind users:

=> Complete Access for blind users of Screen-reading Software

=> Allow each pane to have an individual background color

=> Make hyperlink color more distinguishable from black and/or allow user to customize it

The program is so slow that when I just need to find a Bible verse, I don't use Logos, but a website.

Thankful for Logos Bible Book abbreviations => https://www.logos.com/support/windows/L4/abbreviations that can quickly navigate to a Bible verse. Also Thankful for shortcuts so one click in Logos opens a Bible.

Keep Smiling [:)]

Wes Saad

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/547240#Comment_547240

What are the top three Logos items that generally need improvement on OS X ?

How about we keep things simple for Logos and just have two items instead of three: speed and stability. The issues are not nebulous or mysterious, they are experienced by most Mac users of Logos. Surely Logos knows the problems. They have been ongoing throughout the life of Logos on the Mac. From time to time things improve a little, and at times it degrades again. Back and forth. Very, very annoying.

Keep Smiling 4 Jesus :)

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/547252#Comment_547252

How about we keep things simple for Logos and just have two items instead of three: speed and stability.

Specifically, what are the slow things that adversely affect Logos use ?

Apologies: simple list of two items "speed and stability" translates to overall goals that Logos already has without providing insight to real world woes and anguish.

What's irritating about Logos 5 ?

For example, search has a menu to choose from Entire Library, Open Resources, Collections, and Series, which typically takes more than a second to appear.

A number of color combinations are difficult to read due to poor contrast: e.g. black or blue text on grey background. Dreaming of customizable Logos color themes (similar to Windows personalization). Also would like a command to quickly reset colors to default values.

Text size for Bible verse entry does not scale with resource setting so quick entry is unreadable while typing and pop-up text does not match resource text size.

When resources are downloading, can click X to close message at 1 % complete, but notify message across application reappears at 2 % complete. Irony: notify message is easy to read.

Logos 5.2 algorithm for placement of new tabs when opening a resource seems a bit scatter-brained (several times have wished for setting to open search results in this panel).

Keep Smiling [:)]

David Medina

I am sorry to hear about your problems. But my experience is exactly the opposite. I couldn't be happier.

While Logos is far from perfect - no software is - it is incredible how powerful, versatile and useful it is. Just to think the amount of information I have available and able to search almost instantly with results that actually help me to dig deeper… it blows me away.

I run Logos in a 2006 MAC Pro, a 7 years old computer running Lion, which is starting to show its age. Yet, Logos runs fine. I hardly have any crashes (every software I have ever owned - and I have been working in computers since 1979 - will experience crashes.)

I am not saying any of these to trivialize or negate your experience, but just to show you that your experience can be much better and that maybe you should contact support and have them help you. Computers are very complex machine and sometime we blame the software when it could be a hardware of another software causing a conflict.

As Dan mentioned, there are alternatives to Logos if you find that you cannot live with it. Accordance is one that while it lacks the sophistication of Logos 5, it is very good stable and fast. Yet, my favorite and top recommendation is Logos 5.

I just hope it gets solve soon and you can enjoy the wonderful benefits of Logos 5.

Fr. Charles R. Matheny

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/547285#Comment_547285

Dear Bryan Jay: You are not alone and, you are not wrong.

There have been times I just wanted my money back, this week is one of them-smile.

At other times, Logos runs "usably" on my mac. The iPhone/ipad apps are useless to me.

You are correct, you will not find any other mainstream program that is written for a mac that runs this inconsistently and/or poorly.
Logos is a Windows program ported to OSX , it is not written "for" OSX, that why we Mac folk find ourselves with a different experience than we are used to.

That said, at times, during some versions, it works decently, but you can never tell what the next update will do to it, thus, don't be an early adopter of the updates.

Suggestions:

1. Turn Auto-update off

2. Turn off all internet access to Logos.

3. log-in "offline".

4. repair permissions on your mac.

5. only allow yourself resource updates , do not get software updates until you see if they are working for most mac users, sometimes you have to skip a version.

These steps, given to me by others here on the forums, have helped me greatly in avoiding downtime.

Generally, I can do my work, not quickly, not smoothly, but functionally.

Hope this helps at least a small bit.

Armin

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/547301#Comment_547301

As I mentioned in various other posts, I recently switched from Windows to Mac and am shocked at the difference. On Windows, Logos was fast and stable. It rarely crashed for me and I was a very happy customer. But my experience with Logos on Mac is the complete opposite: It is the buggiest software I have used in a long time, if not THE buggiest ever. I don't recall having been able to use Logos for 30 mins without crash. I posted many logs on this forum but since I never hear back from Logos, I wonder if they read them. It really is frustrating.

My problem, the endless sync-wheel-spin-CPU-hog crash, seems to be better if I run Logos without the Internet. However, I like the mobile Apps so to keep things synced, I need to start Logos on Mac three times for every study that I do: 1) start Logos with Internet and let the initial sync finish before closing it, 2) start Logos without Internet to do my study and close it at the end, 3) start logos with Internet to let it sync.

I am contemplating installing a Windows environment on my Mac and run Logos on Windows.

Armin

Fr. Charles R. Matheny

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/547312#Comment_547312

Dear Armin: Just call logos tech support. Cant wait in hope a Logos employee reads your posts and calls you.

Just call them, do a screen share and, for the most part, they will fix your issues.

You should not be crashing that often, this issue is very fixable.

I would not even try loading logs on the forums, just call logos, they will fix this issue, you will be much, much happier .

Grace and Peace,

HansK

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/547314#Comment_547314

I am very happy with Logos. I run Logos5 on a MBP 2010 with a SSD card and 8GB mem.

I have more thans 11.000 books installed.

Never had major problems with the program. I do Bible Study, but also my Language Studies with Logos.

However, I must confess I never use the notes in Logos, but I use an external program for note taking (Devonthink and TheBrain).

Kent

I have a brand new MacBook Air 1.8GHZ that should be plenty powerful to run Logos with no problem. The software is sluggish and it crashes all the time. I have followed the procedures on the support pages, but have seen no improvement.

I have a "cheap" 400 dollar Toshiba satellite with logos installed on an external Seagate hard drive, Diamond base package with many additional resources has NEVER crashed or had any problems.

Armin

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/547314#Comment_547314

Just call them, do a screen share and, for the most part, they will fix your issues.

I am currently traveling in a very different timezone so I don't get a chance to call Logos. However, I wonder what the conversation with Logos might look like if I called as the crash cannot be reproduced consistently. It most-likely won't crash when I call them. In another thread, Brad from Logos asked me to post logs. I did that but never heard back.

Armin

Jack Caviness

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/548408#Comment_548408

In another thread, Brad from Logos asked me to post logs. I did that but never heard back.

I cannot think of an excuse for this, so I sent an email to Logos stating this opinion.

Bootjack

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/548579#Comment_548579

Why have I always wanted to sheer away from Macs?

DMB

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/548636#Comment_548636

Bootjack ... it's not even the weekend yet.

But I'd agree. My little iPod was driving me crazy giving me no problems. Then I expanded my stable with a iPad Mini yesterday. I was expecting mucho work but iTunes moved my little iPod over to my little iPad with narry a headache. Boy was I steamed.

What's even worse, is my new iPad Mini has my 1690's Go game at the exact position I left it on my iPod. I just dream of the old MS days when headaches were real headaches!

I wonder if Mac people aren't aware they're supposed to be eternally beta testing when confronted with MS software.

Matthew C Jones

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/548658#Comment_548658

my 1690's Go game

Now where did you find that jewel?

Eric

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/548658#Comment_548658

As a PC and Mac user, there are some apps that I *never* run on the Mac side. Would you drag yourself through a pool of needles? Would your slam your hand down on a hot stove? No, just don't do it. If the Mac port is bad - setup Windows bootcamp and run the Windows version - it's free if you own a recent copy of Windows.

This is how we do things in the IT world, and it's just the way it is. It is good that you brought attention to the poor stability of the Mac port. If a company is going to develop a Mac version they might as well do it right or not do it at all! [8-|]

Andre Robitaille

I run Logos on a 2009 Macbook Pro with 8GB RAM and a SSD, the last of those making a massive difference. I would bet that if you're struggling with speed and crashes that you need more RAM than you have. Logos is insanely resource heavy and slow on OS X, so throwing RAM at it should make a pretty big impact. Your Macbook Air should be faster than my MBP if it's recent, so I would have to think there must be something else going on.

Regarding the post about running it in Bootcamp, most people don't want to boot into another OS just to use Logos, much less pay for a copy of Windows to do so. It shouldn't be necessary, and many of us (most?) in IT do not do that.

I agree that Logos is fairly slow, a little buggy, and very laggy with menus on the Mac side, but I'm continually amazed by it. If I just need a really quick read of a passage with light commentary, I'll jump into Olive's products because they're really fast and their iOS app is absolutely fantastic. But if I'm going to sit down and try to read/study something, Logos crushes everything else I've used.

bryan jay

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/548685#Comment_548685

As the guy that started this thread, I'm delighted that the issue is getting some attention, which was my purpose in the first place. I have a MB Air (mid 2012) 1.8ghz with 4GB of Ram and Apple's stock SSD.

However, I would just like to point out that my beef is not necessarily slow performance. It is the fact that the program hangs up ALL the time. I don't often use Logos on my Mac Mini (with 16GB of RAM) but it hangs up on that installation as well.

I think the point has been well-made in this thread that the program was designed for Windows, works better on Windows and has a lot of problems on OSX that are not primarily attributable to the Mac hardware configuration or OSX itself, but to the way this application was developed for Mac OS.

For that reason, as I stated in the beginning, I am frustrated with it. Logos has a mac product that is sub-standard, and I won't recommend it. Bottom line. Period. Stop.

Bruce Dunning

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/548696#Comment_548696

I don't often use Logos on my Mac Mini (with 16GB of RAM) but it hangs up on that installation as well.

I hear your complaint but I've never had any issues with my mini with the same configuration as yours. I'm not sure why some have issues and others do not. I should also mention that I primarily use a PC.

Andre Robitaille

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/548705#Comment_548705

I think I've had it hang once or twice, but in the couple times my wife has used it she had problems because she didn't quit it before putting the laptop to sleep (either left open the window entirely or only closed the window and didn't quit).

Bootjack

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/548658#Comment_548658

Denise, if you think you're steamed, I don't know where that leaves me but at the bottom of the Stew Pot looking for the corner. I'm very disappointed having near 0 problems with Logos 5 on this ASUS. Hopefully, my day will come!!!?! :-]

DMB

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/548710#Comment_548710

Super.Tramp ... the latest SmartGo Kifu contained the historical library (though being new to iOS, it could have been there all along!). The game was Honimbo Sakugen vs Yasui Senkaku. Surprisingly, the strategy is quite modern; absent the date, I'd put it in the 1980s.

Bootjack ... it's like going to the hospital when you're not sick. You almost have to invent something.

Jack Caviness

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/548658#Comment_548658

I wonder if Mac people aren't aware they're supposed to be eternally beta testing when confronted with MS software.

I use MS Office to give me a hint of what I am missing by avoiding Windows [8-|]

Keep Smiling 4 Jesus :)

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/548696#Comment_548696

As the guy that started this thread, I'm delighted that the issue is getting some attention, which was my purpose in the first place. I have a MB Air (mid 2012) 1.8ghz with 4GB of Ram and Apple's stock SSD.

However, I would just like to point out that my beef is not necessarily slow performance. It is the fact that the program hangs up ALL the time. I don't often use Logos on my Mac Mini (with 16GB of RAM) but it hangs up on that installation as well.

Question about MacBook Air usage ? Is the lid being closed (with default setting to put computer to sleep) ? Does Logos hang later after lid is opened ?

Is sleep being used on Mac Mini ? (can set System Preferences for Energy Saver so computer never sleeps)

Personally looking forward to Logos 5.2a beta => http://community.logos.com/forums/p/78218/547017.aspx#547017

Keep Smiling [:)]

David Medina

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/548696#Comment_548696

The problem is that while I can understand your frustration the fact is that not all MAC users have the same experience. Like I said, I run Logos in a 2006 MAC Pro using regular HD 7200 rpm and runs fine. So a generalization that Logos does not work well in a MAC is overstating the issue, I think. Something do run slow but in general, I use it daily without any major issues.

That said, Can and should be improve? Of course. And I am sure, contrary to what has been implied by some, that performance improvements are top priority for Logos people.

Someone also mentioned that logos iPad app was useless. Again. A gross exaggeration. I run it on a iPad mini first generation as well as on a iPad 3 and it runs wonderfully. As a matter of fact, Logos iPad app is a joy to use. In the only iPad that runs slow is on my iPad first generation.

Would I recommend Logos to a Mac user? Yes. I do all the time. It is the most complete, versatile, advance and powerful Bible study tool available in the market.

Jack Caviness

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/548935#Comment_548935

The problem is that while I can understand your frustration the fact is that not all MAC users have the same experience. Like I said, I run Logos in a 2006 MAC Pro using regular HD 7200 rpm and runs fine. So a generalization that Logos does not work well in a MAC is overstating the issue, I think. Something do run slow but in general, I use it daily without any major issues.

That describes my experience with a 7 year old Mac Pro before I upgraded to a 27" iMac a few months ago. Logos performed well on both machines. I sympathize with those Mac users who have problems, but the gross exaggeration that Logos Mac is useless is way over the top.

DMB

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/548969#Comment_548969

I don't know ... seems like if GM Cadallacs had problems for a lot of purchasers (didn't say 'all' ... didn't say 'most' ... certainly more than 'some' ... us MS'ers have been watching this drama for several YEARS), I'd suspect some potential customers might want to test the waters first.

But I'd think most (not 'all') people would think after YEARS of this type of discussion (and YEARS of similar discussions about performance on the MS side), the Cadallac company might maybe dig into it a bit.

bryan jay

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/548898#Comment_548898

Hi KS4J,

Sorry, I can't figure out how to put quotes in my reply, but I want to reply to your questions about usage.

Yes, I like to leave Logos open (so I don't have to wait for it to load each time I need it) when I leave the computer or close the lid. And yes, it is often then that Logos hangs.

I've also noticed it hanging it up when installing new updates, although not every time.

To those who mentioned "gross exaggeration" I would just like to point out that I never made any generalized statements about Logos not working on Macs in general, I simply stated that based on my experience I would not recommend Logos. If others would recommend it, that's fine and I have no problem with that. You let people know your experience with Logos and I'll let them know mine.

Bryan

Andre Robitaille

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/549030#Comment_549030

Yes, I like to leave Logos open (so I don't have to wait for it to load each time I need it) when I leave the computer or close the lid. And yes, it is often then that Logos hangs.

Do I like that Logos hangs on sleep/wake-up? Nope. But that's going to cause the hang ups pretty often.

"Doctor, it hurts when I do this."

"Then don't do that!"

bryan jay

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/549042#Comment_549042

I should add also, that sometimes Logos just hangs up when I go to close it. The computer hasn't been in sleep and there is no apparent action that I do that causes it. I just notice that many times when I go to shut down my computer, either Logos won't close, or if I just hit "shut down" with a bunch of apps open, the computer will tell me that Logos cancelled shut down.

Andre Robitaille

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/549057#Comment_549057

That's got to be a permissions or bad preferences files. If I were in your position I'd try repairing permissions first with Disk Utility. If that doesn't work, I'd be surprised if Logos tech support can't get it fixed.

What you're talking about just isn't pointing to a problem in the code with how (if?) they ported Logos from Windows. That sort of thing happens usually when a preferences file or user account gets messed up. At the absolute worst case scenario, after all other avenues are exhausted, following the uninstall procedures (which I remember to be quite elaborate) and installing from scratch would probably fix it.

bryan jay

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/549060#Comment_549060

OK, I'm repairing permissions now and will also follow up with tech support if I still encounter problems. I'll give it a month and see if there is any improvement. If so, I will report back to this thread. Believe me, I want to like Logos and to recommend Logos. It's just that I had such high hopes that all my Logos woes would be solved when I bought new computers this summer. Yes, the software runs a lot faster than it did on my 2006 MB, but still lots of problems...

Jack Caviness

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/549066#Comment_549066

Bryan

In another thread David Mitchell (Logos) reported that they had located a bug in mono that caused L5 Mac to freeze after waking from sleep. This would be fixed in an upcoming release. As a work-around in the meanwhile, you should avoid allowing your computer to sleep while Logos is running. If memory serves the fix will be first tested in 5.2a beta and then released to the stable version.

Will now look for that thread.

Scott E. Mahle

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/549101#Comment_549101

Will now look for that thread.

KS4J has included it in his reply . . .

Jack Caviness

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/549108#Comment_549108

Will now look for that thread.

KS4J has included it in his reply . . .

Thank you. It is indeed difficult to find when you have identified to incorrect Logos employee. I said, David Mitchell, then thought maybe it was Marvin Potter. Now I learn that it was Tom Philpott Many thanks Scott for the correction.

Hope 5.2a will fix Bryan's—and many other Mac users'—freeze problems.

Lee

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/549110#Comment_549110

Mono-related problems are bound to be frequent and hard to troubleshoot. Par for the course for freeware and complicated porting libraries.

If users isolate patterns (usage, etc.) and work with Logos, hopefully major bugs will go away.

The Mac side of things is looking better and better. More incentive (not yet total no-brainer) for folks to go "native" now.

Erik DiVietro

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/549057#Comment_549057

I should add also, that sometimes Logos just hangs up when I go to close it. The computer hasn't been in sleep and there is no apparent action that I do that causes it. I just notice that many times when I go to shut down my computer, either Logos won't close, or if I just hit "shut down" with a bunch of apps open, the computer will tell me that Logos cancelled shut down.

Logos 4/5 has always hung up when you try to shut down the Mac. It has something to do with the way Macs write information for shut down. I don't pretend to understand it; but it is just the way it is. I always manually shut down Logos before turning my 2009 MBP (8GB RAM, 250 GB SSD) off. I also no longer use sleep because with the SSD, the MBP boots up in less than 20 seconds.

I am certainly no stranger to complaining about Logos 5, and I can empathize with you, Bryan, but I have not encountered anything near the level of frustration you seem to be having.

Allow me to make 2 suggestions:

Manually close Logos 5 when you are shutting down your MBA by pressing Cmd+Q and allow it to completely sync and shut down.
Apply some of these tips (http://blog.alutam.com/2012/04/01/optimizing-macos-x-lion-for-ssd/) for your MBA. Since it uses a SSD, you do not need to have all of the sleep options on. Of particular interest might be turning off Hibernation Mode.

Keep Smiling 4 Jesus :)

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/549030#Comment_549030

I've also noticed it hanging it up when installing new updates, although not every time.

Posted a thread => Bug - Logos 5.2 SR3 Indexer abruptly crashing with recent 5.2 SR3 crashes on Windows 7. In July 2013, experienced some 5.1 SR 1 Indexer crashes on OS X 10.8.5 so share [:(] about Logos indexing reliability (at times). Thankfully can restart indexing while wishing restart was not needed.

Yes, I like to leave Logos open (so I don't have to wait for it to load each time I need it) when I leave the computer or close the lid. And yes, it is often then that Logos hangs.

Tom Philpot replied on 29 Nov 2013 => http://community.logos.com/forums/p/78218/547017.aspx#547017

Thanks to your persistence (and all the other Mac users who report bugs and post logs), I think we have a fix for this crash on quit. It seems there was a bug in Mono that we were finally able to track down earlier this week.

It seems this bug was a race condition that could occur when Logos was running when waking from sleep. There was about a 10 second window when waking from sleep in which Mono could think that some internal book-keeping data was no longer necessary and throw it out. When this occurred, the program might crash while running, but more often than not it resulted in a crash on quit.

This might also explain why people who quit Logos Mac before putting their Mac to sleep had a more stable experience, as this bug appears to only occur when waking from sleep.

We have a fix that should resolve the issue in the first 5.2a beta. We'll monitor the crash reports for the 5.2a beta when it ships and see if the number of reports for this issue decreases in 5.2a. If we determine that the change is effective, we'll push this change back to the stable releases as well.

Keep Smiling [:)]

Josh

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/549150#Comment_549150

I currently run L5 on two machines. One is a 2009 iMac running Snow Leopard (OSX 10.6) and the other is a 2012 Macbook Pro running Mountain Lion (OSX 10.8). Both are the most basic stock models.

I find it odd that some Mac users have major issues and some don't. The only problem I have with L5 is a problem that the Windows side has too - the constant updates and indexing! Everything else is fine.

If we are using the SAME machines and the SAME software - why is there such a wide performance gap between Mac users? So strange.

Lee

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/549185#Comment_549185

If we are using the SAME machines and the SAME software - why is there such a wide performance gap between Mac users? So strange.

Answer: maybe you're NOT running the same software, e.g. some system setting like system locale, some other piece of software that's been installed or not installed, some update that's been applied or not applied, some software that's also running at the same time or not running.

Maybe you're NOT running the same hardware, e.g. RAM, HD (which firmware build?), CPU. Or it could be one of those file permissions issues that crop up for no particular reason. Or, PRAM. Or, some particular usage pattern that exposes a latent problem ...

Of course, the problem may not actually reside with Logos code per se ("this is a Mono bug"...) but the fact that users running Logos encounter problems makes it in everybody's (=Logos and users) interests to track down what is causing them. [:)]

Jack Caviness

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/549249#Comment_549249

the fact that users running Logos encounter problems makes it in everybody's (=Logos and users) interests to track down what is causing them.

Agreed, that is why we need detailed explanations—and especially logs—when problems occur

Michael McLane

I did not bother reading every reply as they seem to be mostly about the Mac functionality. Therefore, I would like to respond to the original post and add my two cents on functionality in general.

I would like to see Logos live up to its basic functionality that it lets us know about on nearly every resource page; namely that every resource is linked. Logos, the one thing that your software should be doing, and doing well, is either none existent, poorly implemented, or thoroughly inconsistent in its implementation both within a single resource and across resources.

Here are a couple of current threads on the topic:

http://community.logos.com/forums/t/78548.aspx

http://community.logos.com/forums/t/73301.aspx

I could go on with screen shots and further explanation, but that has all been done before. The point is that the most basic functionality of the software has deteriorated over time. Please hear me, I do not wish to be overly harsh. I have been a long time Logos user and run an installation on all platforms. I have tens of thousands of dollars invested in this software. I want to love Logos, but they make it so hard when every time I click a link and one of the inconsistent results is a bib reference to copy that does me no good. Then, I have to go to my library and manually look it up. Really? I have to manually look up a reference to BDAG from a Pillar commentary, two of the most common resources? I am actually embarrassed for Logos.

Like the OP, I cannot recommend Logos. I cannot use it in group Bible study, because it is inconsistent in its workings, I never know what it will do and how many hoops I will have to jump through. I don't even tell people I own Logos. I am sorry, that is bad. Just make the links work, and work consistently. I have actually started moving to buy my resources on Kindle, at least they are cheaper there for what is about the same functionality, an e-reader.

I apologize if I sound a bit frustrated, but a product should deliver on the most basic of its promises and I do not see Logos doing that.

Thanks for listening and I look forward to learning if I am just doing something wrong.

Bruce Dunning

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/549454#Comment_549454

I would like to see Logos live up to its basic functionality that it lets us know about on nearly every resource page; namely that every resource is linked. Logos, the one thing that your software should be doing, and doing well, is either none existent, poorly implemented, or thoroughly inconsistent in its implementation both within a single resource and across resources.

Here are a couple of current threads on the topic:

http://community.logos.com/forums/t/78548.aspx

Regarding the above thread, Kyle Anderson from Logos gave what I thought was a very good response on page 2.

Lee

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/549409#Comment_549409

the fact that users running Logos encounter problems makes it in everybody's (=Logos and users) interests to track down what is causing them.

Agreed, that is why we need detailed explanations—and especially logs—when problems occur

For the known, intractable problems, Logos and users need to be in direct contact. Logs are almost certainly not going to capture sufficient info to isolate the causes.

Fr. Charles R. Matheny

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/549454#Comment_549454

One of the recent arguments revolves around: "Not all Mac installs are the same".

This is, of course true.

However, that argument is a pretty poor argument, Mac, Windows etc.

Why?

Because it should not happen anyway.

Most people, companies,businesses would not use a software that crashed frequently and, gave inconsistent results, Especially if said software company blamed it on their usage of other normal, mainstream software installs.

On the Mac side of things, most if us use extremely stable software, not junk, not unstable, but very high quality and very stable software. Macs own software bundles, MS Office , mainstream browsers etc. All stable software.

Mac users ( and modern day Windows) owners just are not used to crashes, failures, freezes.

As a "for instance" , the ONLY software on my Mac that ever crashes, is Logos. It's the only software that uses over 100% of my processors from time to time, it's the only software that is extremely slow to load etc, etc.

If Logos knows that are "software conflicts" with other software and thus, install paths, sharing GPU etc, then we should be notified of this, both Logos and the customer could try to make adjustments.

Installs: While it is true, that installs differ, it isn't true that this should be, or is, the underlying issue for most problems, at least on the Mac side.
Server side issue at Logos cause some of the issues, install issues on Logos side are some of the issues ( database issues) .
Another recurring issue IS code, it just is what it is.
Code issues that fix one thing, break another, code issues within one resource, that when used, crash the program, thus, if one person has that resource and another does not, then one will have the problem, one will not.

Posting Logs: This is great for getting help on the forums, yet, posting Logs here, does not mean Logos software engineers are going to get those logs.

I have spoken to Logos support by phone several times, screen share etc, and been told that yes, a problem is known, or, no, this is the first they have heard of it- in both examples, many people had same issue and many logs had been posted.

The bottom line is simply that we, the consumer, have no easy answers and, basing someone else's situation from our own experience can often be less than helpful. I cannot say all Logos experience is like mine, weather good or bad, nor that it should be like mine, good or bad and, the last thing we should do is make someone feel like the problem is because they have an inferior product, weather it be a Mac or Windows unit.

Logos just has issues, code issues, sever issues and, is very sensitive, very hard on ones computer resources.

When it works- it works, when it fails, it fails.

I had gone a couple of months with No crashes, then upgraded my Verbum Tuesday, nothing else on my Mac Changed- nothing. Logos/Verbum now crashes several times a session. Cant be my Mac, it was running fine before the upgrade and, all other systems and programs are normal.

I will call tech support, hopefully we will get it fixed again and all will be back to normal, which is slow and clunky-smile, but normal.

We just have to remember that Logos is "supposed" to work like our other software and, most of us go very long periods without crashes, major issues when it comes to Word processors, Browsers, banking software, printing software etc, etc.

People are dissappinted when Logos does not function as other stable software. Logos is not advertised as unstable, but as stable and best, not as beta or alpha etc.

When Logos gets to the type of stability that is "normal" on most platforms, we will see threads like these disappear, until then, frustration is going to be a regular conversation.

Just sayin.