How to find a Greek word in the LXX

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Bootjack | Forum Activity | Posted: Sun, Dec 15 2013 8:09 AM

Let's suppose I have a word up from the NT and then let's suppose Vines / BDAG shows where that word is used in the LXX.

Sometimes, it is difficult to see exactly which word is intended, so my question is - is there a way to get the exact Gk word that is used in the LXX.

Let me illustrate to try and make myself clear. I have the word "wronged" used in Philemon 18. BDAG says that Gk word is used in Isaiah 9:8. How do I know exactly which word it is that is used in Isaiah other than guessing? Hopefully my question is clear as transparent mud.  :-}

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DMB | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Dec 15 2013 8:38 AM

I use the LXX lexicon which lists the usages. I have it linked to BDAG.  But Isa 9.8?? 

"God will save his fallen angels and their broken wings He'll mend."

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Rich DeRuiter | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Dec 15 2013 9:01 AM

Bootjack:
Let me illustrate to try and make myself clear. I have the word "wronged" used in Philemon 18. BDAG says that Gk word is used in Isaiah 9:8. How do I know exactly which word it is that is used in Isaiah other than guessing?

There may be a more elegant way to do this, but here's what I do:

From the Reverse Interlinear right-click on "wronged" choose the lemma (ἀδικέω) on the right-side of the right-click menu, and then choose Bible Word Study (BWS) on the left. Now scroll to the bottom of the BWS and under "Textual Searches" choose "LXX."

The results are all in Greek of course. If your Greek isn't that great (like mine), choose "Add Versions" at the top left of the results pane. I suggest using a the Lexham English Septuagint (LES), if you have it, since it is a translation of the LXX (not the BHS). If you don't have the LES, then choose a version like the NRSV, which includes the Apocrypha. Whichever one you might choose, enter it in the input box and then click the arrow to create a second, parallel column to give you a virtual diglot for the verses in the LXX that include your target Greek word.

 Help links: WIKI;  Logos 6 FAQ. (Phil. 2:14, NIV)

Posts 9947
George Somsel | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Dec 15 2013 10:09 AM

Bootjack:

Let's suppose I have a word up from the NT and then let's suppose Vines / BDAG shows where that word is used in the LXX.

Sometimes, it is difficult to see exactly which word is intended, so my question is - is there a way to get the exact Gk word that is used in the LXX.

Let me illustrate to try and make myself clear. I have the word "wronged" used in Philemon 18. BDAG says that Gk word is used in Isaiah 9:8. How do I know exactly which word it is that is used in Isaiah other than guessing? Hopefully my question is clear as transparent mud.  :-}

The word "wronged" is a translation of ἀδικέω, but I find no listing of the Isaiah passage under αδικεω.  Here is a morph search for ἁδικέω in the LXX

george
gfsomsel

יְמֵי־שְׁנוֹתֵינוּ בָהֶם שִׁבְעִים שָׁנָה וְאִם בִּגְבוּרֹת שְׁמוֹנִים שָׁנָה וְרָהְבָּם עָמָל וָאָוֶן

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Bootjack | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Dec 15 2013 10:10 AM

Denise, I'm also now looking for Is 9:8. Apparently one of those glorious Senior's moments. Just great!!!

Richard, I'm beaddled as to where Choose Versions is at the top of the left pane. I'm not seeing anywhere that I can find that. Can you please clarify ...

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Bootjack | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Dec 15 2013 10:15 AM

Here's a screenshot of where I am right now - this is why I'm not able to see where the "add versions" might be ...

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Bootjack | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Dec 15 2013 10:16 AM

And I would need the English rendering of that word in the LXX ... sorry George, I cannot read Greek.

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Bootjack | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Dec 15 2013 10:37 AM

Richard, I have the LES but since it is does not have Strongs numbers with it, it still leaves me wondering as to what word is actually which. Is there something that I'm not seeing in addition to the others that I am not seeing ???

Posts 9947
George Somsel | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Dec 15 2013 10:42 AM

Bootjack:

And I would need the English rendering of that word in the LXX ... sorry George, I cannot read Greek.

This is a screenshot of Lust A Greek Lexicon of the Septuagint.  In the upper right corner it list the number of occurrences of the word in various sections of the LXX which is not of concern to you.   The "A" listings are active while the "P" listings are passive.  Here is the section of interest to you

"A to be unjust, to do wrong, to act unjustly 1 Kgs 8,47; to wrong, to injure [

τινα] Gn 21,23; to wrong sb in sth [τινά τι] Prv 24,29; to sin against [ἔν τινι] (semit., rendering Hebr.-מעל ב) 2 Chr 26,16"

george
gfsomsel

יְמֵי־שְׁנוֹתֵינוּ בָהֶם שִׁבְעִים שָׁנָה וְאִם בִּגְבוּרֹת שְׁמוֹנִים שָׁנָה וְרָהְבָּם עָמָל וָאָוֶן

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Bootjack | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Dec 15 2013 11:02 AM

This is exactly what I'm after George. My next question is - let's say I'm still looking at the word "wronged" here in Philemon and I see that this Gk word is used in Jer 37:18 according to the Complete Word Study Dictionary. How can I have it automatically bring up that word to the location you have shown me? I've tried "send hyperlinks here" but that's doing nothing. I'll appreciate your furthered help. Thanks!

Posts 9947
George Somsel | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Dec 15 2013 11:17 AM

Bootjack:

This is exactly what I'm after George. My next question is - let's say I'm still looking at the word "wronged" here in Philemon and I see that this Gk word is used in Jer 37:18 according to the Complete Word Study Dictionary. How can I have it automatically bring up that word to the location you have shown me? I've tried "send hyperlinks here" but that's doing nothing. I'll appreciate your furthered help. Thanks!

I don't know where you're getting your information, but it seems to be completely in error.  There is no appearance of the word "to wrong" (ἀδικέω) in Jer 37.18. 

george
gfsomsel

יְמֵי־שְׁנוֹתֵינוּ בָהֶם שִׁבְעִים שָׁנָה וְאִם בִּגְבוּרֹת שְׁמוֹנִים שָׁנָה וְרָהְבָּם עָמָל וָאָוֶן

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Bootjack | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Dec 15 2013 11:27 AM

Look up the word "wronged" in Philemon 18 - click on the strongs number 91 - have it open the Complete Word Study Dictionary - under number 1, you'll see a list of references where this Gk word is used in the LXX ... i.e. 1Kings 8:47 / 2Chron 26:16 / Ps 106.6 / Jer 37:18.

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Bootjack | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Dec 15 2013 11:34 AM

And maybe I jumped the gun in saying "this is exactly what I want" ... maybe it isn't. Sometimes, one will be given the passage where a NT Greek word is used in the LXX, but when one looks that up, one is left wondering *sometimes* as to which word it actually is. Is what I am saying / asking making sense?

Is there something within Logos that would bring up the LXX with the Strongs numbers used the same way it is in the OT / NT?

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DMB | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Dec 15 2013 12:34 PM

Bootjack, what you're trying to do makes perfect sense; that's what I do mainly because in the first century, that's what they'd do.

The problem is trying to use Strongs; Logos isn't Strongs happy.  My OliveTree LXX uses the Strongs embedded in both the NT and LXX which would make your world easier to track.

"God will save his fallen angels and their broken wings He'll mend."

Posts 9947
George Somsel | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Dec 15 2013 12:45 PM

Bootjack:

Look up the word "wronged" in Philemon 18 - click on the strongs number 91 - have it open the Complete Word Study Dictionary - under number 1, you'll see a list of references where this Gk word is used in the LXX ... i.e. 1Kings 8:47 / 2Chron 26:16 / Ps 106.6 / Jer 37:18.

I don't seem to have the Complete Word Study Dictionary or, perhaps, I hid it.  I would advise you to hide it as well.  Any resource which rather consistently gives inaccurate results is not worthy of consideration.  Do you have a LXX?  if so, you might try copying the lemma αδικεω which appears on right-click and select "Morph Search" without all the silly letters after it.  This will give you the appearances in the NRSV (?) where it is translated.  Change the resource to "Septuagint with Logos Morphology" and you will get all of the appearances in the LXX.

george
gfsomsel

יְמֵי־שְׁנוֹתֵינוּ בָהֶם שִׁבְעִים שָׁנָה וְאִם בִּגְבוּרֹת שְׁמוֹנִים שָׁנָה וְרָהְבָּם עָמָל וָאָוֶן

Posts 732
Bootjack | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Dec 15 2013 12:59 PM

Now George, you don't have to resort to lies about the Complete Word Study Dictionary!!??!

As to your further instructions, you're totally confusing me. Maybe you or someone else could clarify - or is there a specific video with this regards.

Posts 9947
George Somsel | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Dec 15 2013 1:06 PM

Bootjack:

Now George, you don't have to resort to lies about the Complete Word Study Dictionary!!??!

As to your further instructions, you're totally confusing me. Maybe you or someone else could clarify - or is there a specific video with this regards.

Just the facts, sir.  If you enjoy being wrong then continue to use that POS.

george
gfsomsel

יְמֵי־שְׁנוֹתֵינוּ בָהֶם שִׁבְעִים שָׁנָה וְאִם בִּגְבוּרֹת שְׁמוֹנִים שָׁנָה וְרָהְבָּם עָמָל וָאָוֶן

Posts 732
Bootjack | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Dec 15 2013 1:10 PM

George, do you think you're able to clarify as to what you were trying to help me with regarding the LXX? Denise, I notice you say that Logos isn't Strong's happy - am I to take it then, there is no LXX that has Strong's numbers in it? If so, what I'm looking for, isn't going to be there, correct?

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David Paul | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Dec 15 2013 2:17 PM

George Somsel:

Just the facts, sir.  If you enjoy being wrong then continue to use that POS.

For all you children in the audience, POS = "Pearl of Septuagintism"

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Posts 11433
DMB | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Dec 15 2013 2:20 PM

I know of only 1 LXX that has Strongs numbers: Septuagint with Logos Morphology. Unfortunately they were careful to include hebrew with the greek, but not english.  I think George paid them a tidy sum, though it looks very interlinear-ish.

"God will save his fallen angels and their broken wings He'll mend."

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