Windows Phone

I don't have a dog in this particular hunt, but Bob P. has said it is unlikely they will invest much (if anything) in a platform with less than 10% market share. From a business perspective that makes perfect sense. I did a quick google search and found this data recently reported

http://www.comscore.com/Insights/Press_Releases/2014/1/comScore_Reports_November_2013_US_Smartphone_Subscriber_Market_Share

Don Awalt said:

... Microsoft Office market share in the consumer space has dropped from 95% to 20% since 2004. They are just not a player in the consumer space any more.

Don, Not trying to start anything nor dispute the points made on the phone topic nor Logos' strategy, but I think you may have misstated something. The article with chart you link in doesn't reference Microsoft Office as the source of data that I can see.  It doesn't seem to mention anything specific, just "consumer space".  The author even mentions that he doesn't know what the data is.  That seems to be a little wide open to me.

[:)]

alabama24 said:

 ... you have drunk more MSFT Kool-Aid than I have the Apple Cider. 

Ha!  LOL!  That's funny.

I thought I remember Bob having a lengthy post on this very subject, but I can't seem to find it.  He walked through everything in a clear way.  Does anyone remember where that is?  Or was I dreaming?

I moved to windows phone from iPhone a year ago and I am glad that I did, it is great and much better than apple. 

Saying that I may well move to android in a year as windows phone is not getting the app traction that I need, but if I do move I will miss windows phone as it is such a great platform.

I selfishly wish that Logos would develop for windows phone but if Logos was my company I would not do so, it is hard enough developing for two mobile platforms, let alone three.

Interesting there was an article on Windows 9 that came out yesterday, by Paul Thurrott, one of the big Windows gurus. Interesting in the article, he paints it as a pretty important upgrade because of the current state of Windows 8 - which reinforces Bob's assessment that it's not worth investment now, if they can turn it around to the point the market accepts it and it builds market share, great. You can read the article at this link, or here is the Windows 8 part:

"But Threshold (next release of Windows) is more important than any specific updates. Windows 8 is tanking harder than Microsoft is comfortable discussing in public, and the latest release, Windows 8.1, which is a substantial and free upgrade with major improvements over the original release, is in use on less than 25 million PCs at the moment. That's a disaster, and Threshold needs to strike a better balance between meeting the needs of over a billion traditional PC users while enticing users to adopt this new Windows on new types of personal computing devices. In short, it needs to be everything that Windows 8 is not."

Richard, no one is anti-Microsoft, it is not necessary to categorize people. For myself, I was just trying to post an explanation from a pro-Microsoft source that might indicate, not that there is anything wrong with your preference, but why this platform is not a priority for Logos and other software companies - your preference of phone is a significantly minority preference.

Enjoy your phone, enjoy your software, enjoy your choices. Peace.

Richard, 

     If it's any consolation, I don't use the iOS Logos on my iPhone.  Screen is too small for these imperfect and aging eyes.  The tablet is better.  But I  use and enjoy using Logos 5 on my Windows 8 laptop.  Faster boot that my Win 7 desktop on lesser hardware.  Solid performance ... machine running for a week and longer without issue.  The whole thing you mention with Office 365 is very helpful, even without the phone.  I use it every day.  I think you can find many other positive comments in these forums from very happy Windows users.  Michael Childs has stated his wonderful experience with the Surface Pro 2 many times.  You can search and read his comments, and others as well.  My opinion, Logos is the premier bible study software as a whole for the Microsoft Windows environment.  Who knows, as Bob pointed out, the phone piece may come along some day.

[:)]

I am placing this link here only because it describes in great detail Microsoft's elimination of backward compatibility over time that Bob Pritchett mentioned in his post, which makes a software developer think twice about supporting a platform. (This is actually the reason I stopped using Windows phones, my last one was a Windows 6 phone and when they said it would not run Windows 7 even though it was a new phone, I decided that was it - time to stop letting Microsoft obsolete things I have invested in).  

This letter is written by David Sobeski, a former Windows Manager who left Microsoft in 2006. It's long but to those interested it gives insight into the decisions Microsoft made internally through the 2000's.

https://www.facebook.com/dsobeski/posts/10153683440480008

Sobeski's comments are informative.  However over the last couple of years there has been a clean out of senior management in MS and things look like they are going to take a new direction. 

Somewhere in MS' roots there was/is a requirement for backwards compatibility, but it got obscured in the shuffle and on some product categories got lost altogether. 

Ironically, it's that backward compatibility that may have hindered its smartphone strategy.  WinMo was just too much like conventional Windows and so didn't migrate well to a small screen format. 

Now MS has gone the other way and tried to bring a touch friendly UI to Windows.  Look at the hue and cry about that. 

Yet, in my experience, with a Win 8 tablet, a WP8 phone and a Win 8 laptop, their current strategy makes a lot of sense. All my data and PIM information is now device agnostic.  Its amusing listening to everything chime for the same appointment around the office, even though I'm using Office on the laptop and desktop, Calendar on the Tablet and Windows Phone.

At a macro level it will only be successful if the huge body of applications can be successfully migrated to the new UI and if the UI can accommodate the miriad of use cases that businesses require.

I think Bob's analysis and decision not to support Windows Phone at this juncture and given his more intimate knowledge of Logos' circumstances, is probably the right one.  Yet there is more than one way to skin the cat, one of which I have mentioned in a separate post to this thread.

Wow, sorry but I disagree with Bob.  And that's said news to Windows 8 users because he is the President of Logos.  I do believe Windows Phone is here to stay!  At least as long as the iPhone will be around.  As usual Microsoft is late getting up to speed but they are getting there.  Try searching "Failed Apple Products" and you find no shortage of items on that list. And if anyone is trending down other than Blackberry, it's Apple. But no one is saying "let's keep an eye on them" because they to, are here to stay (at least for this generation & perhaps the next). So this is a new era and it seems to us that Microsoft is pretty much on the 'cutting edge' with Windows 8.  We know people don't like change (companies don't like it either) and every time there is a major change people complain but they eventually get on board and after a short time they wonder how they got along without the very thing they complained about. This is a new day in the computer world. Why is it ok to offer iOS & OSX and not a Win 8 & Win App?  Do you really think Windows is going to regress? I don't think so.  Especially when Windows users out number Apple users and windows 8 & App users are cross platform users that over the natural course of Windows time & "history" shows that neither Windows nor its users regress but people adapt. Things these days are more stable then the days of windows CE, palm pilots, Apple Newton, other 'transitional/venture' technologies.  Today cell phones are here to stay and like Microsoft and computers, Windows Phones have now joined the major players.  Doubling their market share from about 2 to 4%.  Not much you say?  Well Apple had less than 6% when Logos started with a computer program for them and still only have about 10% of the computer market today leaving about 90% using Windows & Others.  One more fun fact is that Microsoft sold over 200 million Windows 8 licenses with confirmed registrations since its release.  Compare that to the 250 million who switched to windows 7 in the same amount of time following its release. Anyone with windows 8 will be able to utilize the windows 8 app store. Like me & most of our congregation who seem to have upgraded and many others plan to in the future.   So, I say there's more to this story. This is definitely something to watch...

Interested in this? There's more here... http://community.logos.com/forums/p/67764/582350.aspx#582350 

Ah yes, but perhaps the main reason Mac users spend so much is because Apple product are very expensive.

alabama24 said:

Ps3">Well Apple had less than 6% when Logos started with a computer program for them and still only have about 10% of the computer market today leaving about 90% using Windows & Others.

Yes... but:

When I was in seminary a few years ago, about 60% of the seminarians were using Mac laptops. Of those who were using windows laptops, most were over 40. Furthermore: Mac users in general spend more on electronics and software than do windows users. There were good, economic reasons for Logos to invest in the platform. Windows phone <might> catch on, but I wouldn't hold your breath. Additionally, iOS isn't just a phone platform, its a tablet platform too. Windows 8 has been an utter failure up to this point. 

I seldom disagree with my good friend from Bama, but to say "Windows 8 has been an utter failure up to this point" is a silly statement, and a false one.  Windows 8 is a great success, and will continue to be so.  I wouldn't swap my Windows 8 Surface Pro 2 for any machine Apple ever made.

alabama24 said:

Michael Childs said:

I seldom disagree with my good friend from Bama, but to say "Windows 8 has been an utter failure up to this point" is a silly statement, and a false one.  Windows 8 is a great success, and will continue to be so.  I wouldn't swap my Windows 8 Surface Pro 2 for any machine Apple ever made.

Now, now. I didn't mean to get you in a huff. Let me put it this way: Sony came out with Betamax, which was far superior to JVC's VHS. Despite the superiority of the platform, it was an utter failure as a consumer device, We can bicker over win 8 and surface all day... But that was never my point. Up to this point, MSFT does not have a "successful" product. It doesn't matter how "good" the product may be. See these links: 

Yes, the fact is that if Sony had of sold 200 million Betamax machines everyone would have had one pretty much like windows.  We banter back and forth about Microsoft but it's still Windows we're talking about. Eventually Vista/7/8  will be a part of history like XP.  Also the future of technology has grown to include tablets & cell phones which 10 years ago didn't exist.  So people are making choices bc not everyone can afford to by a tablet & a desktop/laptop.  Also, those who don't like to change don't have to right now unless they have XP and want to.  But like it or not W8 is the transition into the OS future that has set a new standard.  IMHO the W8 pro type tablets all speak to that fact.  Just ask someone who uses one.  And keep in mind that  by trying to maintain Betamax as a private standard, Sony yielded an early marketing lead to JVC, who licensed the VHS standard to all comers. Consequently, VHS recorders were available from more manufacturers for a significantly cheaper price than Betamax recorders. This why they failed and why Microsoft hasn't.  Even the articles you refer to do not call W8 an "utter failure" and by the time you read through the article the tone changes from the questionable reader attracting headline to a more acceptable acknowledging of the facts.  By the way, Sony Betamax machines had a market share of 12% and were made up until as late as 2002 when Sony switch production to increase laser products. I do believe at last count the iPhone had 12-13% and Apple still makes those.

Sorry, I stand corrected,  Apple has sold more than 100 million combined sales of iphones and ipads.  But still less then 200 and still only a total combined sales amount of about 316 million in its history.

Aloha and good morning all

Yes it is still morning here in paradise.

I am going to have to add my voice and vote for a Windows Phone version of Logos.

I currently use an iPhone 4.  But would dearly like to be off it.

I moved to iOS when my old WinMo 6.1 (HTC Touch Pro 2) phone died.  The only supported platform then for my mobile Bible app (Laridian Pocket Bible) was iOS..  So I went to Apple (albeit kicking and screaming).

So Logos - please give us a Windows Phone version/thank you.

I was shocked when I saw this comment by bob too "People who won't pay Apple's price / hate Apple / want to be different / etc.". Basically he saying that anyone who buys Android is only buying it because they are poor and broke. And what is wrong with wanting to be different and not simply following the crowd. This gives me the idea that Logos is an apple fanboy organization that looks down on PC users. I have a Windows 8 PC an Android Tablet and a Windows Phone 8 phone. They refuse to create a Windows Phone version of their application because there is not much money to be made on it but what they fail to see is that just because we own a Windows Phone does not mean we aren't able to run the program on our laptop's or tablet. If I would have known that Logo's does not have any plans to support Windows Phone I would have gone with a different company. I have bought various extra libraries which is money they could be losing because I may not make future purchases anymore and go with something else instead. I am not going to switch cell phones just because of Logos when there is other companies creating programs for the Windows Phone. 

Logos needs to look at the common denominator that people who own Windows Phones also own Window's PC's and those are sales they may lose