Unbelievably Frustrated with Logos 4 and the Mac Ver of Logos 3

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This post has 17 Replies | 2 Followers

Posts 41
MajorCedar | Forum Activity | Posted: Sat, Dec 26 2009 11:10 AM

Since this is a forum for support, let me first quickly cite the issue I'm having.  I upgraded to Logos 4 over Christmas since Logos 3 for Mac shares the same fate as Windows 3, 95, 98 - that is, no support!  Since the MAC version is anything but OPERABLE (would be buyers be ware), I installed it on a VMWare Fusion 3.0 Virtual Machine.  It's a shame I did not do this sometime during season of Advent so that each time I tried to run the program I could re-live an 'advent'-like hope/expectation that the software might actually run or execute before Jesus comes, i.e., LOGOS 4 IS HORRIBLY SLOW. (Running Logos 4 in a virtual machine in Fusion gives new meaning to the Jewish 'hyperbolic' expression - [Logos 4] will finish searching and running when the Messiah comes! - chuckle, chuckle.)  So this is my problem.  I've tried turning down graphics, upping ram, etc.  Help!

On another note of frustration, I'm so terribly disappointed with Logos.  This is the case not so much because Logos 4 doesn't run (at least for me) the way I need it to (but, I dare say, that this is frustrating enough!!!!!) but because Logos 3 for Mac never ran as it was supposed to.  Instead of fixing the product that I (and the rest) of the Mac users purchased (a point which seems at odds with many of the consumer-protection laws & regs), we get a note to upgrade to Logos 4 (and as a bonus, the 'opportunity' to pay another hefty upgrade fee for some extra books that are now running as well as the other 'umpteen' books bought in Logos 3 - Yippee and grrrr!).  And then you find yourself contemplating some of the deeper mysteries, like why a product is released when it doesn't work the way it is advertised to work; why not just wait until it works first and then release? 

Other would-be users or buyers NEED to do their homework before purchasing this product.  Granted, I'll painfully "pull through" (to use Twain's expression) and make do with this stuff mainly because I have so much money invested but I'll do so with the same 'humbug' attitude expressed here.  

Now, I'm waiting for the "For the DISAPPOINTED, we'll refund your money" - it'll be 'advent'-like the whole year.  

Cheers.

 

Posts 4508
Robert Pavich | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Dec 26 2009 11:20 AM

Chehaselwood,

I understand that you're frustrated....trust me...I do.

All of what you mentioned has been discussed on the forum before.

You might want to go to the Mac forum and poke around as there are some very specific things you can do to make the performance increase; since I'm  a windows user...I can't tell you what they are....sorry.

Edited to add: HERE IS A LINK TO A POST THAT MENTIONS YOUR PROBLEM AND SOLUTIONS

A number of the Mac users are using Parallels or VMWare Fusion to run the Windows version of Logos 4 in the meantime while they wait for the Mac version to release. Many of them have helpfully posted a number of tips for getting everything setup.

http://community.logos.com/forums/t/6461.aspx

http://community.logos.com/forums/t/6463.aspx

Give that a try and see if some of your concerns get answered....

 

God bless,

bob

Robert Pavich

For help go to the Wiki: http://wiki.logos.com/Table_of_Contents__

Posts 4508
Robert Pavich | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Dec 26 2009 11:22 AM

PS: have you upgraded to A8?

I noticed that your posts all mention A6....they are making improvements all of the time; that might help.

Robert Pavich

For help go to the Wiki: http://wiki.logos.com/Table_of_Contents__

Posts 10826
Forum MVP
Jack Caviness | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Dec 26 2009 2:13 PM

CheHaselwood:
Since this is a forum for support, let me first quickly cite the issue I'm having.  

Che

Have you posted your problem on the Logos 4 Mac Forum? Have you read the Mac FAQ (see my signature)? Can you describe your problems in less inflammatory language?

Perhaps those of us on the Mac forum can help if you request assistance there. I had very acceptable performance using L4 Windows under Fusion 2.0.6 before I upgraded to Parallels 5. Donavon Palmer and others are successfully using L4 under Fusion 3. They can provide advice. However, I must point out that the tone you have used here will diminish the assistance.

Posts 41
MajorCedar | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Dec 26 2009 2:28 PM

Thanks for the responses.

I have checked the Mac forums and as of yet they've not helped with my problems.  I'll keep looking.  

As for the comment about the 'inflammatory' language, I'm not meaning to be offensive though I am perhaps striking a caustic tune.  I think Logos needs to be aware (which I'm sure they are) of what a lot of their consumer base (or would-be consumer base) thinks, particularly with the "Mac Logos 3 to Logos 4" upgrade.  Even more, if I'd read this kind of evaluation I'd been a bit more cautious about upgrading, at least until the bugs carcasses were worked out.

I'll keep at it.  Any thing I figure out, I'll post back.  Again, I'm appreciative of these forums for both support and a needed sounding board.

Blessings!

Posts 73
Chuck Lindsey | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Dec 26 2009 3:12 PM

Basically... 

1. Install VMWARE Fusion 3.01 Let it create a virtual machine for you.

2. Install Windows XP or later using VMWARE

3. In VMWARE settings allocate 2gb or more of ram

4. In VMWARE settings turn OFF 3D acceleration (very important)

5. In VMWARE setting use only one processor

6. If it's still slow... in Windows turn hardware acceleration down to one step up from "none".

 

Not knowing the specs of the machine your using.... but this should help tremendously.

 

I use it everyday this way... it's really pretty great. Not native speed... but definitely better than "usable" and it's stable.

Posts 1539
Terry Poperszky | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Dec 26 2009 3:16 PM

One other thought, to rule out a problem with VMWare, download a trial version of Parallels and try that. They will run side by side.

 

 

Posts 29
Matthew Bookspan | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Dec 26 2009 5:23 PM

Chuck - why turn off graphics acceleration? What difference does it make?

Thank you,

Matthew

Posts 73
Chuck Lindsey | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Dec 26 2009 6:03 PM

For most it makes a tremendous difference within the emulator. VMWARE slows to a crawl if I enable 3D acceleration. I haven't heard of anyone being able to run Logos 4 effectively with the hardware acceleration option "on".

Not sure if it has anything to do with hardware... I have an almost brand new machine... 17in MacBook Pro 2.93 Intel Core 2 Duo w/ 4gb ram and nVidia 9600 GT

Maybe it becomes an issue of trying to accelerate through the emulator, then windows is doing it, then Logos is doing something else?

Posts 10826
Forum MVP
Jack Caviness | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Dec 26 2009 7:15 PM

Matthew Bookspan:
Chuck - why turn off graphics acceleration? What difference does it make?

Matthew

In both Fusion and Parallels, the entire Windows machine is software based. Since 3D Acceleration is software based, it takes resources away from the operating system and therefore slows everything to a crawl.

Posts 29
Matthew Bookspan | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Dec 27 2009 2:35 AM

Thank you for the replies!

I am aware of the potential, although my 3Ghz iMac with 4GB of RAM has an NVidia 8800GS card with 512MB of RAM. Haven't really noticed any slowdown with Fusion running graphics acceleration (having tried it both ways).

In fact, when I disable the graphics acceleration, the Logos menus look somewhat garbled. Anyone else seeing this?

Lastly, I have my VM set to 1.5GB of RAM, turned sharing off and enabled the graphics acceleration. Other than the fact the VMware is slower than Parallels (for overall load times of the VM), once in the VM, things are quite performant.

Matthew

 

Posts 69
Ernesto Ochoa | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Dec 27 2009 3:09 AM

Hi CheHaselwood.

You can use Virtualbox. It´s a free virtual machine software. It´s very fast. Try it.

I use L4 in Mac (Unibody, 4 Gb RAM) with Parallels Desktop 5 and I´m happy but VirtualBox it´s fast.

Ernesto

Posts 29
Matthew Bookspan | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Dec 27 2009 3:49 AM

Ok, just did some additional trials. Turning off graphics acceleration does speed up the application, especially when displaying new content. Thanks for the tips guys!

Posts 10826
Forum MVP
Jack Caviness | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Dec 27 2009 2:18 PM

Matthew Bookspan:
my 3Ghz iMac with 4GB of RAM has an NVidia 8800GS card with 512MB of RAM. Haven't really noticed any slowdown with Fusion

With that powerhouse, you probably would not see any slowdown no matter where you set Graphic Acceleration.

Matthew Bookspan:
when I disable the graphics acceleration, the Logos menus look somewhat garbled.

When I was using Fusion 2.0.6, I had some display anomalies, although they were not related to Graphic Acceleration.

Posts 10826
Forum MVP
Jack Caviness | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Dec 27 2009 2:20 PM

Matthew Bookspan:

Ok, just did some additional trials. Turning off graphics acceleration does speed up the application, especially when displaying new content. Thanks for the tips guys!

You spoiled my previous reply while I was still typing Geeked. However, it is good to know that you could get more speed.

Posts 29
Matthew Bookspan | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Dec 27 2009 4:53 PM

Ok, trying some additional settings:

  • 2GB RAM, graphics acceleration enabled = good performance
  • 1.5GB RAM, graphics acceleration disabled = great performance

I am going to stick with the 2GB RAM settings for now as I would like to test it out a little more. If I have to de-res, at least I know I have a high-performant option.

For those new to the thread, this is VMware 3.0.1, not Parallels 5.

Oh, I also made one big change. Using MacPilot 3.5.1, I enabled the 64bit Kernel. I moved as many apps to 64bit as I could and removed any old 32bit kexts that might have slow things down. Overall, everything is more snappy.

(I have not performed any real timed trials, just feels faster).

M

Posts 351
Luuk Dondorp | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Dec 28 2009 12:13 AM

Chuck Lindsey:

I haven't heard of anyone being able to run Logos 4 effectively with the hardware acceleration option "on".

Yes, I do.

I tried just because I was curious but experienced no difference in the L4 behaviour. So I leave it set on "on". 

Logos 4 is running fine: MacBook Pro, 2.2 Ghz Intel Core 2 Duo, 4 GB SDRAM --> VMware Fusion 2.06 + Windows XP + 2 GB Dedicated

Luuk

 

Posts 1956
Donovan R. Palmer | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Dec 28 2009 12:19 AM

Matthew Bookspan:
Oh, I also made one big change. Using MacPilot 3.5.1, I enabled the 64bit Kernel. I moved as many apps to 64bit as I could and removed any old 32bit kexts that might have slow things down. Overall, everything is more snappy.

Thanks for these tips. Very helpful!

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