New Feature: Case Frames Guide Section

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Jeremy Thompson (Faithlife) | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Nov 17 2014 11:43 AM

In Rick's example in the initial post, the Agent--Patient frame of εσθιω versus the Agent--[Patient] frame can often (though not always) distinguish between the "eat something" ("he ate the bread") and the "eat; i.e. dine" ("he ate and was satisfied") meanings of εσθιω. So, for example, this tool could help you to explore places where people "dine" as opposed to where they eat a particular food where the verb is εσθιω.

The tool is another way of categorizing the uses of a verb according to meaning. In essence, that's one thing that resources like Louw and Nida and the Bible Sense Lexicon also do, especially with a text that is tagged with those resources. At a very basic level, they allow you to look at similar types of usages together because particular usages have been categorized according to meaning.

For those who want to delve a bit deeper, I'd recommend Paul Danove's work which was the theoretical basis for the case frames data. He explores the usefulness of semantic roles for traditional exegesis, textual criticism, translation, narrative analysis and lexicography in fairly significant detail.

Posts 9946
George Somsel | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Nov 17 2014 11:48 AM

David Knoll:
George where have you been all this time?

I don't have L6 yet so I really can't comment.

george
gfsomsel

יְמֵי־שְׁנוֹתֵינוּ בָהֶם שִׁבְעִים שָׁנָה וְאִם בִּגְבוּרֹת שְׁמוֹנִים שָׁנָה וְרָהְבָּם עָמָל וָאָוֶן

Posts 1150
Anthony H | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Nov 17 2014 11:58 AM

Just for the sake of mutual enlightenment and perhaps another perspective. A little seeing of the trees for the forest...internalized or externalize.

http://danielstreett.com/2014/09/01/exegesis-vs-reading-or-how-to-dismantle-an-atomistic-bomb/

I neither fully agree or disagree but rather see both sides as having significant merit. Big Smile

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Veli Voipio | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Nov 17 2014 12:10 PM

I made a quick test and I like this feature

Gold package, and original language material and ancient text material, SIL and UBS books, discourse Hebrew OT and Greek NT. PC with Windows 8.1

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David Knoll | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Nov 17 2014 12:25 PM

OK I think I understand. This is sort of like arranging the occurrences of the verb according to what it binds:  subject (valency 1) / subject + object (valency 2) etc.

BTW you may need to fix a bug with BWS. If you type אכל and choose eat (i.e. the verb in Qal) you get אוכל food (noun).

I guess this should be added to the thread about the reliability of searches etc.

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Jeremy Thompson (Faithlife) | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Nov 17 2014 12:40 PM

Exactly. This is a terminological problem in the field of linguistics itself. Sometimes different terminology is used for similar things: argument structure, valency, frames, etc. The difference here is that we have analyzed semantic valency (there's syntax underlying the analysis too that we're not showing).

For example, a subject doesn't perform the same function for the active and passive form of a verb - "he ate the food" vs. "the food was eaten". In each of those examples, "food" is in a "Patient" role even though in one case it is an object and in the other case it is a subject.  So, the tool also provides a way of dealing with the ambiguity of grammatical terms like "subject" and "object."

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Jeremy Thompson (Faithlife) | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Nov 17 2014 12:43 PM

Also, I would add the אכל - אוכל issue to the other thread. I'm just a Hebrew nerd Big Smile

Posts 912
David Knoll | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Nov 17 2014 12:49 PM

Jeremy Thompson:

Exactly. This is a terminological problem in the field of linguistics itself. Sometimes different terminology is used for similar things: argument structure, valency, frames, etc. The difference here is that we have analyzed semantic valency (there's syntax underlying the analysis too that we're not showing).

For example, a subject doesn't perform the same function for the active and passive form of a verb - "he ate the food" vs. "the food was eaten". In each of those examples, "food" is in a "Patient" role even though in one case it is an object and in the other case it is a subject.  So, the tool also provides a way of dealing with the ambiguity of grammatical terms like "subject" and "object."

You really need to prepare a detailed guide on how to use this with practical examples and explain how you analysed the verbs and the meaning of each term.  "Goal", "Theme", "Locative", "Benefactive" are not familiar to the average scholar (at least not in the manner that you use these terms). 

And the programmers need to set the default when you type Hebrew characters in BWS to Hebrew and not Aramaic. It is very annoying.

Posts 113
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Jeremy Thompson (Faithlife) | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Nov 17 2014 12:52 PM

We have tried to make a start with this with the Lexham Glossary of Semantic Roles. I hope the link works. My first try at a link into the software from the internet I think.

Posts 912
David Knoll | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Nov 17 2014 1:00 PM

Jeremy Thompson:

We have tried to make a start with this with the Lexham Glossary of Semantic Roles. I hope the link works. My first try at a link into the software from the internet I think.

Very interesting. I'll read it through. Perhaps you could put a link to this glossary near the wheel so that the user would know where to find the definitions if he is puzzled.

Posts 1150
Anthony H | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Nov 17 2014 1:06 PM

David Knoll:

Jeremy Thompson:

We have tried to make a start with this with the Lexham Glossary of Semantic Roles. I hope the link works. My first try at a link into the software from the internet I think.

....Perhaps you could put a link to this glossary near the wheel so that the user would know where to find the definitions if he is puzzled.

+++Yes

Posts 113
LogosEmployee

David Knoll:
Very interesting. I'll read it through. Perhaps you could put a link to this glossary near the wheel so that the user would know where to find the definitions if he is puzzled.

I'm pretty sure Rick is following this thread. So, I'm certain a note will be made of this request. I would also mention that the definitions are available when you scroll over the lists below the wheel. Clicking on one of the roles should take you to the glossary.

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David Knoll | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Nov 17 2014 1:18 PM

Thank You! I haven't noticed that.

Posts 1150
Anthony H | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Nov 17 2014 1:25 PM

Jeremy Thompson:

David Knoll:
Very interesting. I'll read it through. Perhaps you could put a link to this glossary near the wheel so that the user would know where to find the definitions if he is puzzled.

I'm pretty sure Rick is following this thread. So, I'm certain a note will be made of this request. I would also mention that the definitions are available when you scroll over the lists below the wheel. Clicking on one of the roles should take you to the glossary.

+Yes  When all else fails click everywhere. lol

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Fr Devin Roza | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Nov 18 2014 12:19 AM

David Knoll:

And the programmers need to set the default when you type Hebrew characters in BWS to Hebrew and not Aramaic. It is very annoying.

Yes

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Keep Smiling 4 Jesus :) | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Dec 27 2014 10:25 AM

Rick Brannan (Faithlife):

How does it work? 

The distribution of case frames for the verb is shown by the ring graph, and a concordance of case frames is provided. Examining specific instances can help you understand what pieces of information to look for to better understand what is being communicated. For instance, if the verb is ἐσθίω (esthiō "to eat"), it is useful to identify the Agent (the entity eating) and the Patient (the entity being eaten).

What is the significance of [] ?

Example results has two lines with Patient surrounded by [] once:

  • Agent - [Patient]
  • Agent - Patient

Keep Smiling Smile

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MJ. Smith | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Dec 27 2014 1:22 PM

[ ] ==> implied or missing "required" element

Orthodox Bishop Hilarion Alfeyev: "To be a theologian means to have experience of a personal encounter with God through prayer and worship."

Posts 3673
Francis | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Dec 27 2014 1:45 PM

This, in essence, is the fundamental problem with the lack of proper documentation. We are given features like this which sound very powerful. But for documentation we have very basic descriptions and definitions and not concrete examples of how to use them. For instance, I read Jeremy Thompson's blog. Thank you for posting it but, in my opinion, it stops short of demonstrating in what ways it can be useful and not just interesting. There should be several different and concrete illustrations of use. 

When I go to the help menu, what I get is stuff like "searches helps you find things". "click on Bible to search Bibles"...

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Dave Hooton | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Dec 28 2014 12:05 AM

The Lexham Glossary of Semantic Roles is quite helpful.

Dave
===

Windows & Android

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Keep Smiling 4 Jesus :) | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Dec 28 2014 11:07 AM

Dave Hooton:

Thanks Smile

Keep Smiling Smile

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