Hebrew Cantillations - is it working for you?

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Mark Smith | Forum Activity | Posted: Mon, Nov 3 2014 7:31 PM

I continue to get virtually nothing when I try to use the Hebrew Cantillations Interactive. Part of a verse and that's all.

Is anyone getting more than this?

Pastor, North Park Baptist Church

Bridgeport, CT USA

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John Kight | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Nov 3 2014 7:34 PM
I'm having the same issue.

For book reviews and more visit sojotheo.com 

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Mark Smith | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Nov 3 2014 7:37 PM

John Kight:
I'm having the same issue.

There was some trouble with this tool in the beta process. I guess it hasn't been fixed.

I just wanted to be sure the problem wasn't just with my installation. Thanks.

Pastor, North Park Baptist Church

Bridgeport, CT USA

Posts 1562
John Kight | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Nov 3 2014 8:16 PM

Yeah, no worries. It will be an amazing tool once everything is worked out. 

For book reviews and more visit sojotheo.com 

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George Somsel | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Nov 3 2014 8:53 PM

I'm wondering what this might be.  Do we not already have cantillations in the Hebrew text?

george
gfsomsel

יְמֵי־שְׁנוֹתֵינוּ בָהֶם שִׁבְעִים שָׁנָה וְאִם בִּגְבוּרֹת שְׁמוֹנִים שָׁנָה וְרָהְבָּם עָמָל וָאָוֶן

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Abram K-J | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Nov 3 2014 9:05 PM

I had the same issue in beta. Maybe they should have waited another week to launch....

Abram K-J: Pastor, Writer, Freelance Editor, Youth Ministry Consultant
Blog: Words on the Word

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Caleb S. | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Nov 3 2014 9:51 PM

It looks like it is not showing all of the cantillation marks, just some of them. I saw more when I went to Est 1:1. It looks like it is also one verse at a time and not multiple verses. It seems to me that Hebrew Cantillations is not complete yet. I'd like all of them marked, and a glossary telling me what each one mean and in what part of the verse as well (since some look the same, but have different uses). So, 1) they need to add all the rest of the cantillations, and 2) they need to expand the tool so it has more functionality (such as the ability to click on each Cantillation name and go to a glossary where it is defined, and examples are given, and the ability to mouse over the name and see a pop-up of the definition. Also, the ability to actually do a whole range would be good too.

Also, I am seeing that the tool is running Hebrew words together. That just irritates me. They need to fix it so the words themselves to do NOT run together. So, as others have said, they have a LOT of work to do before this tool is truly usable. Right now, it is annoying and even irritating...and NOT user-friendly (in my opinion anyway).

I also think that if they created a way to use this while you are actually in your Hebrew Bible, that would be sweet! I'd think they could put it under Visual Filters and with one click, your whole Hebrew Bible shows the breaks and pauses etc. that the Cantillations are indicating.

Logos 8.1.0.0016 + Faithlife Connect | macOS Mojave 10.14.2 | Mid 2015 Macbook Pro 15" | 2.8 GHz Intel Core i7 | 16 GB RAM | 1 TB SSD PCIe Express

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BKMitchell | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Nov 4 2014 5:51 AM

Cable I agree, and really like what you had to say. In addition I think faithlife/Logos needs to add the ability to actually search on the cantillation marks as well. That feature is already standard in two other major BibleSoftware platforms.

חַפְּשׂוּ בַּתּוֹרָה הֵיטֵב וְאַל תִּסְתַּמְּכוּ עַל דְּבָרַי

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Lee | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Nov 4 2014 6:03 AM

@BKMitchell:

Email Bob, he may be open to it: https://community.logos.com/forums/t/93903.aspx

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Russ Hawkins | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Nov 4 2014 1:21 PM

We greatly appreciate everyone's comments, and based upon a number of bug reports and critical (in the best way) feedback, we have decided to go back to the drawing board for this interactive.

Here's a glimpse into the future:

(Mark - the single verse that is currently displayed is the result of a performance limitation that was imposed just prior to launch. It's a thing of the past in the new version.)

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Eli Evans (Faithlife) | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Nov 4 2014 1:56 PM

As of 5.2 you can use [match accents] to force accent-sensitive matching, so:

See more here: https://wiki.logos.com/Search_Matching_Commands 

On the left, 679 hits for elohim (with athnach, normal sensitivity which ignores accents), and on the right, 57 hits for the same term, but with [match accents] added to the query.

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Mark Smith | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Nov 4 2014 1:59 PM

Russ Hawkins:
Here's a glimpse into the future:

That certainly looks better and easier to read. Thanks for the update. I look forward to the final product.

Pastor, North Park Baptist Church

Bridgeport, CT USA

Posts 468
BKMitchell | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Nov 4 2014 2:20 PM

Eli Evans:
As of 5.2 you can use [match accents] to force accent-sensitive matching

That's, great but, will this also allow for accent-sensitive search with wild cards? In other words can I search for accents and accent combinations without specifying the word/words?

For example:

BKMitchell:

 ... Is, it yet possible to search on combinations of accents without specifying what word they fall on. So, for example I wanted to search for every place in the Hebrew Bible where: the accent pattern is Yetiv followed by Pashtat ...https://community.logos.com/forums/t/92588.aspx

AND, thank you Russ and Faithlife for the glimpse into the future it looks fabulous!

Russ Hawkins:

We greatly appreciate everyone's comments, and based upon a number of bug reports and critical (in the best way) feedback, we have decided to go back to the drawing board for this interactive.

Here's a glimpse into the future:

חַפְּשׂוּ בַּתּוֹרָה הֵיטֵב וְאַל תִּסְתַּמְּכוּ עַל דְּבָרַי

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Anthony H | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Nov 4 2014 2:43 PM

Russ Hawkins:

Here's a glimpse into the future:

What kind of screen real estate are we potentially talking about here?

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LogosEmployee

BKMitchell:

Eli Evans:
As of 5.2 you can use [match accents] to force accent-sensitive matching

That's, great but, will this also allow for accent-sensitive search with wild cards? In other words can I search for accents and accent combinations without specifying the word/words?

No, this is not currently possible.

Posts 8
LogosEmployee
Russ Hawkins | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Nov 5 2014 10:54 AM

The amount of screen space is going to vary depending on the ratio of the nesting levels to the number of words, but in general, it would appear that the horizontal space requirements will not be, on average, greatly increased.

Below are a few screenshots for comparison, with the app sized at 1024 x 768:

Future version, showing both Gen 1:1 and Gen 1:2

Currently shipping version with Gen 1:1

Currently shipping version with Gen 1:2

Thanks!

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Anthony H | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Nov 5 2014 11:05 AM

Thanks  Yes

Russ Hawkins:

The amount of screen space is going to vary depending on the ratio of the nesting levels to the number of words, but in general, it would appear that the horizontal space requirements will not be, on average, greatly increased.

Below are a few screenshots for comparison, with the app sized at 1024 x 768:

Future version, showing both Gen 1:1 and Gen 1:2

Currently shipping version with Gen 1:1

Currently shipping version with Gen 1:2

Thanks!

Posts 468
BKMitchell | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Nov 5 2014 4:31 PM

Bradley Grainger (Faithlife):

BKMitchell:

Eli Evans:
As of 5.2 you can use [match accents] to force accent-sensitive matching

That's, great but, will this also allow for accent-sensitive search with wild cards? In other words can I search for accents and accent combinations without specifying the word/words?

No, this is not currently possible.

Thanks for the replySmile

חַפְּשׂוּ בַּתּוֹרָה הֵיטֵב וְאַל תִּסְתַּמְּכוּ עַל דְּבָרַי

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Martin Grainger Dean | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Jan 15 2015 2:24 PM
Russ Hawkins:
We greatly appreciate everyone's comments, and based upon a number of bug reports and critical (in the best way) feedback, we have decided to go back to the drawing board for this interactive. Here's a glimpse into the future...
When this "future" will be available? Martin.
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Russ Hawkins | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Jan 19 2015 10:31 AM

Martin Grainger Dean:
When this "future" will be available? Martin.

Very soon, and thanks for asking!

We are excited about getting this new-and-improved version in everyone's hands; just adding some finishing touches at the moment.

Below is a screenshot of the latest iteration, which demonstrates an improvement in the way that we visualize both branches of text divided by a disjunctive mark:

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