Why Does The Pentecostal & Charismatic Package Not Go Past Silver
I see it only goes up to silver. Why is that?
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I think the problem is that P&C does not have a manager. I wish Logos/Faithlife would hire any time soon.
"No man is greater than his prayer life. The pastor who is not praying is playing; the people who are not praying are straying." Leonard Ravenhill
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Probably also because (I'm guessing) Logos does not yet have enough P&C resources to properly fill out a Gold or larger package.
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Sean said:
Probably also because (I'm guessing) Logos does not yet have enough P&C resources to properly fill out a Gold or larger package.
That could be the reason why we need P&C manager, to push many P&C books on prepub. Previous manager was collecting the data, but since he is gone, everything stopped [:'(]
"No man is greater than his prayer life. The pastor who is not praying is playing; the people who are not praying are straying." Leonard Ravenhill
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Wild Eagle said:
I think the problem is that P&C does not have a manager.
I do not think that is why because---
Baptist has Diamond and no product manager
SDA has a product manager and only a Silver package
Sean said:Probably also because (I'm guessing) Logos does not yet have enough P&C resources to properly fill out a Gold or larger package.
I think you are on to it.
Logos 7 Collectors Edition
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Super Tramp, that's my point. if we would have manager, he would push much more resources on prepub, and then we would have more resources on Logos. Baptist package is different, see how many resources they already have in Logos.
EDIT: see the post. https://community.logos.com/forums/t/71399.aspx as an example
"No man is greater than his prayer life. The pastor who is not praying is playing; the people who are not praying are straying." Leonard Ravenhill
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Sean said:
Probably also because (I'm guessing) Logos does not yet have enough P&C resources to properly fill out a Gold or larger package.
I was thinking this also, however, I looked on the site and seen that some of the other packages have less resources tagged to that particular denomination that P&C.
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It could be a lack of resources, but I also see that there is probably a lack of focus as to what really underlies the library of someone who comes from that perspective. Traditionally, there hasn't been a strong academic/seminary foundation for those in ministry. And frankly, there is very little difference in the sorts of resources used for Bible study. FWIW, I'm in a congregation that is AG, but you'd never guess it by most of what's in my library.
I have the Silver package on my wish list. Just haven't found a way to shoehorn it into my budget yet.
The mind of man is the mill of God, not to grind chaff, but wheat. Thomas Manton | Study hard, for the well is deep, and our brains are shallow. Richard Baxter
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It would be nice if I get a crossgrade package to upgrade to a Pent gold if there was one.
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mab said:
It could be a lack of resources, but I also see that there is probably a lack of focus as to what really underlies the library of someone who comes from that perspective. Traditionally, there hasn't been a strong academic/seminary foundation for those in ministry. And frankly, there is very little difference in the sorts of resources used for Bible study. FWIW, I'm in a congregation that is AG, but you'd never guess it by most of what's in my library.
I have the Silver package on my wish list. Just haven't found a way to shoehorn it into my budget yet.
I think the Pentecostal/Charismatic spread is an extremely broad one: there are large numbers of charismatics in many traditional denominations, as well as a lot of charismatic "new churches" that are by no means Pentecostal. Within Pentecostalism itself there is enormous diversity. As far as the Logos offerings are concerned, I didn't buy any of these packages as the names I expected to be in there weren't there, and a whole lot of names I didn't recognise were. For example, Gordon Fee is probably the finest Pentecostal Biblical Scholar of the last half-century, and I can't see anything by him (and certainly none of his commentaries) in the base packages. He's definitely Pentecostal - I've sat behind him in the Pentecostal church in Vancouver that he was part of over many years.
I'm not sure how Logos can resolve this, and whoever takes over as the Product Manager will need to be extremely broad-based to satisfy this market: there is, however, also a big opportunity here. Pentecostals and Charismatics are increasingly embracing theological study and looking for good scholarship: that is a comparatively recent development and one that does present companies like Logos with significant opportunities to satisfy that demand.
Running Logos 6 Platinum and Logos Now on Surface Pro 4, 8 GB RAM, 256GB SSD, i5
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James Hiddle said:
I see it only goes up to silver. Why is that?
As others have suggested, it is a combination of the lack of the key books (and quantity of books) that would make a P&C Gold worth its name, and the lack of a product manager to oversee P&C products and marketing. We'd love to have up to Portfolio in all of our denominational tracks--indeed, it's a goal we are all working toward (even those of us who aren't Pentecostal and Charismatic are helping out with P&C marketing)--so, with enough time and customer interest, we'll get there (soon I hope). [:)]
James Hiddle said:It would be nice if I get a crossgrade package to upgrade to a Pent gold if there was one.
If you have Pentecostal Silver, you can crossgrade to the Feature Crossgrade with your dynamic price and be caught up with the features and datasets of Gold (and then some). If you go to the Extended Crossgrade, you'll get some of the additional resources that come in Gold packages (like the DIY Bible Study and the Not-Your-Average Bible Study and the Logos Hymnal). However, if you're looking for more Pentecostal and Charismatic-specific books, the best place to go is Pre-Pub and filter by the P&C denomination (or to Community Pricing and find the authors and works that would be of particular interest to your study). Getting more resources shipped through Pre-Pub and Community Pricing helps us to deliver more of this content via base packages.
Also, if you know anyone who is interested in working for Faithlife to promote and propagate Pentecostal & Charismatic books and theology, make sure to tell them to apply! https://www.logos.com/about/careers
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Brandon Rappuhn said:James Hiddle said:
I see it only goes up to silver. Why is that?
As others have suggested, it is a combination of the lack of the key books (and quantity of books) that would make a P&C Gold worth its name, and the lack of a product manager to oversee P&C products and marketing. We'd love to have up to Portfolio in all of our denominational tracks--indeed, it's a goal we are all working toward (even those of us who aren't Pentecostal and Charismatic are helping out with P&C marketing)--so, with enough time and customer interest, we'll get there (soon I hope).
James Hiddle said:It would be nice if I get a crossgrade package to upgrade to a Pent gold if there was one.
If you have Pentecostal Silver, you can crossgrade to the Feature Crossgrade with your dynamic price and be caught up with the features and datasets of Gold (and then some). If you go to the Extended Crossgrade, you'll get some of the additional resources that come in Gold packages (like the DIY Bible Study and the Not-Your-Average Bible Study and the Logos Hymnal). However, if you're looking for more Pentecostal and Charismatic-specific books, the best place to go is Pre-Pub and filter by the P&C denomination (or to Community Pricing and find the authors and works that would be of particular interest to your study). Getting more resources shipped through Pre-Pub and Community Pricing helps us to deliver more of this content via base packages.
Also, if you know anyone who is interested in working for Faithlife to promote and propagate Pentecostal & Charismatic books and theology, make sure to tell them to apply! https://www.logos.com/about/careers
Thanks for the P&C link. Appreciate it and God bless you for the advice.
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There is a need for more Classical Pentecostal works.
As stated in many posts, the former "Full Life Study Bible" that is now labeled the "Fire Bible". It is in the other two competitors but NOT in Logos.
One wonders why????? when Jimmy Swaggart and the LDS are represented.
The Life in the Spirit Bible Commentary is not in Logos.
The Complete Biblical Library is NOT in Logos, but apparently locked up in a competitor.
Enrichment journal past issues, Pneuma, and the Assemblies of God Heritage could also be added.
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Dan Langston said:
There is a need for more Classical Pentecostal works.
As stated in many posts, the former "Full Life Study Bible" that is now labeled the "Fire Bible". It is in the other two competitors but NOT in Logos.
One wonders why????? when Jimmy Swaggart and the LDS are represented.
The Life in the Spirit Bible Commentary is not in Logos.
The Complete Biblical Library is NOT in Logos, but apparently locked up in a competitor.
Enrichment journal past issues, Pneuma, and the Assemblies of God Heritage could also be added.
Thank you, Dan!!! Someone at Logos, please use Dan's suggestions as a guideline for the next set of resources you go after for those of us that are Pentecostal. If you contact the Assemblies of God you should be able to secure almost every one of these. And they are K-E-Y Pentecostal resources, not just outliers.
Please. Please. Pretty Please. Look into adding the resources he mentioned. Especially the "Fire Bible" (formerly "Full Life Study Bible") and the very academic and well done "Life in the Spirit NT Commentary."
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Gary Osborne said:
Thank you, Dan!!! Someone at Logos, please use Dan's suggestions as a guideline for the next set of resources you go after for those of us that are Pentecostal. If you contact the Assemblies of God you should be able to secure almost every one of these. And they are K-E-Y Pentecostal resources, not just outliers.
I'm Sure The Church of God (Cleveland, Tenn) Will be Glad to help in getting you Pentecostal resources as well. We have many great authors and the second largest Christian College (Lee University) in the Nation, Not to mention the Theological Seminary as well. There is a lot of Great Authors in our Mist.
Christianity has not been tried and found wanting; it's been found difficult and not tried.
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This may be bad info, but I'm under the impression that Logos and AG Global University has some kind of agreement to supply Berean course material to Global University Remote students. If that is the case there are many excellent P&C books used in the course that could be offered by Faithlife.
I totally agree the "Fire Bible" needs to be offered soon. The original Full Life Study Bible was a Zondervan work so I would think Faithlife would have access to it.
Also I would think Gospel Publishing House (AG) and Pathway Publishing (COG Clev.) would be open to have their books and authors represented on Faithlife.
Also unless I very wrong or the program is designed to only show books in the packages which I do not have I don't see many of the P&C books in any of the packages that Logos does have and offers. IMHO I think the P&C collection needs to be rethought.
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Ed Blough said:
AG Global University has some kind of agreement to supply Berean course material
Berean School of the Bible Digital Courses (27 courses)
If I remember correctly Full Life Study Bible was included in the Libronix resource Lifeworks of Jack Hayford.
Logos 7 Collectors Edition
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Super.Tramp said:
If I remember correctly Full Life Study Bible was included in the Libronix resource Lifeworks of Jack Hayford.
That's a different study bible entirely. It's called the Spirit-Filled Life Study Bible. And yes, it's by Hayford. The one we are referring to is completely different (and far superior to that light-weight "study" Bible offered by Nelson).
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We should be able to express an opinion without negative comments such as light weight "study" bible. I for one have been very blessed for many years by the Spirit Filled Life Study Bible and am glad I have both the print and Logos version.
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No offense was intended. I've got that bible as well and it is nice. But it's not nearly as thick and in depth as the "Full Life"/"Fire Bible". It's just not. That's all I meant.
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I am not familiar with the other resource and I look forward to checking it out. The above clause just seemed prejorative to me but I accept that was not your intent. It is so easy to be misinterpreted in this type of medium and it is one reason that I use an old fashion phone more than email whenever possible. Peace!
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I think one factor may be how young the movement actually is. Most denominations are a few centuries old and have a wealth of work to match their age. Plus they were formal movements from the start. Pentecostals are really the only denomination that is technically not Protestant. They were not born out of protest. So theologically they are all over the place from Trinitarian to oneness. there are also many distinctions in other areas within the movement so it's really hard to universally define the charismatic movement.
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the P&C movement can't really be divorced from its protestant roots though.
Further, I think most Pentecostals would "protest" to the treatment of the sign gifts of most cessationist churches.L2 lvl4 (...) WORDsearch, all the way through L10,
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I'm a pentecostal by expression and conviction, but reformed in most of my theology. There isn't a lot from popular pentecostals that I would want in Logos, maybe a few in Vryso. However, I am very glad that someone like Gordon Fee is well represented as is Jack Hayford.
To be honest, why would I would a Joel Osteen book when I can have John Piper or Tim Keller? Just my $0.02
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I guess I don't understand. I go through the P&C book list and I don't see books by Stanley Horton, Jack Hayford and others that I know Logos has published in the past. The Life in the Spirit Study Bible isn't included again something Logos has published in the past. Why is that?
I also agree that Logos must be very selective when deciding on who to include there is a ton junk claiming P&C basis written yearly.
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What?????Damon Davis said:I think one factor may be how young the movement actually is. Most denominations are a few centuries old and have a wealth of work to match their age. Plus they were formal movements from the start. Pentecostals are really the only denomination that is technically not Protestant. They were not born out of protest. So theologically they are all over the place from Trinitarian to oneness. there are also many distinctions in other areas within the movement so it's really hard to universally define the charismatic movement.
Pentecostalism was born out of the Holiness movement that was a part of nearly every denomination at the time. It is as Protestant as the Baptist, Lutheran, Methodist, Presbyterian churches it was born in.
So I'm not sure what your were trying to say.
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Ed Blough said:
I go through the P&C book list and I don't see books by Stanley Horton, Jack Hayford and others that I know Logos has published in the past. The Life in the Spirit Study Bible isn't included again something Logos has published in the past. Why is that?
The base packages give a nominal 90% discount on titles, which means Logos can't pay the usual royalties per individual title (the idea is that we buy a bundle of several times the bookcount we would otherwise, so it averages out). For Logos to include works into a BP they need to get a new agreeement with the publisher.
Some things that run on Logos and were sold in the past were actually published by third parties (such as Thomas Nelson, now belonging to Zondervan). Some of those treated Logos resources like paper books: produce a large quantity (CD-ROMs), sell it ever cheaper over time, scrap the rest and forget about it. They may even have had the rights only for the one-batch run, or for a certain time, or whatever. Or they are not/no longer interested to work with Logos, maybe trying own "revenue streams". Or they may not want their products "diluted" by appearing in a BP at all, or alongside those of a competitor in financial ot theological sense. All of these and more reasons may lead to the fact that a publisher doesn't allow their works into a BP - or only at conditions Logos is not willing to accept. We all are poorer through this (gee, we even have Lutheran BPs without Luther's works in them!).
Ed Blough said:Logos must be very selective when deciding on who to include there is a ton junk claiming P&C basis written yearly.
Logos will try to balance that BPs of the same "level" have roughly the same number of resources, total price, and appeal to customers. They won't be overly selective, I think - especiall since the older traditions have lots of public domain books that will somewhat "beef up" the $ and resource count, which I don't really see in the P&C. But Logos will need to include works of value to sell the higher level packages.
Have joy in the Lord!
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The Pents are a part of the Protestant movement. I don't know why anyone would say otherwise just research it online.
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NB.Mick said:Ed Blough said:
I go through the P&C book list and I don't see books by Stanley Horton, Jack Hayford and others that I know Logos has published in the past. The Life in the Spirit Study Bible isn't included again something Logos has published in the past. Why is that?
The base packages give a nominal 90% discount on titles, which means Logos can't pay the usual royalties per individual title (the idea is that we buy a bundle of several times the bookcount we would otherwise, so it averages out). For Logos to include works into a BP they need to get a new agreeement with the publisher.
Some things that run on Logos and were sold in the past were actually published by third parties (such as Thomas Nelson, now belonging to Zondervan). Some of those treated Logos resources like paper books: produce a large quantity (CD-ROMs), sell it ever cheaper over time, scrap the rest and forget about it. They may even have had the rights only for the one-batch run, or for a certain time, or whatever. Or they are not/no longer interested to work with Logos, maybe trying own "revenue streams". Or they may not want their products "diluted" by appearing in a BP at all, or alongside those of a competitor in financial ot theological sense. All of these and more reasons may lead to the fact that a publisher doesn't allow their works into a BP - or only at conditions Logos is not willing to accept. We all are poorer through this (gee, we even have Lutheran BPs without Luther's works in them!).
Ed Blough said:Logos must be very selective when deciding on who to include there is a ton junk claiming P&C basis written yearly.
Logos will try to balance that BPs of the same "level" have roughly the same number of resources, total price, and appeal to customers. They won't be overly selective, I think - especiall since the older traditions have lots of public domain books that will somewhat "beef up" the $ and resource count, which I don't really see in the P&C. But Logos will need to include works of value to sell the higher level packages.
Okay that all makes sense. I see I had an incorrect definition of a P&C package, I defined it as one that would be a package that contained everything P&C oriented that Logos publishes.
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Silver is as smart as we get, man. We're focused on getting more of the Spirit. We don't need no hypercalifragilisticananalydosis.
Just joking. Greetings from a Mennonite Bapticostal. If I ever break past silver I'll let you know. [:)]
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Kendall Sholtess said:
Silver is as smart as we get, man. We're focused on getting more of the Spirit. We don't need no hypercalifragilisticananalydosis.
Just joking. Greetings from a Mennonite Bapticostal. If I ever break past silver I'll let you know.
Wow never heard of a Mennonite Bapticostal. Is that the same as an Amish PenteCatholic j/k [:)]
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