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Pastor Michael Huffman | Forum Activity | Posted: Wed, Apr 8 2015 1:14 PM

It is interesting to me that when I perform a search on the Granville Sharp construction, that Titus 2:13 is not listed. I was always taught in all 4 years of Greek that I had that Titus 2:13 is an example of the Granville Sharpe Construction. Is that a mistake or is it based on a less than conservative grammatical view?

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MJ. Smith | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Apr 8 2015 1:26 PM

It is identified as Granville Sharpe in

Cairns, Alan. Dictionary of Theological Terms. Belfast; Greenville, SC: Ambassador Emerald International, 2002.

According to a Greek grammatical rule (called the "Granville Sharpe Rule"—see Dana and Mantey, A Manual Grammar of the Greek New Testament, 146–53)

Orthodox Bishop Hilarion Alfeyev: "To be a theologian means to have experience of a personal encounter with God through prayer and worship."

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Pastor Michael Huffman | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Apr 8 2015 1:53 PM

MJ. Smith:

It is identified as Granville Sharpe in

Cairns, Alan. Dictionary of Theological Terms. Belfast; Greenville, SC: Ambassador Emerald International, 2002.

According to a Greek grammatical rule (called the "Granville Sharpe Rule"—see Dana and Mantey, A Manual Grammar of the Greek New Testament, 146–53)

So this is a mistake in the tool, in your thoughts?

Pastor Michael Huffman, Th.A Th.B Th.M

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John Kight | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Apr 8 2015 2:00 PM

I'm sure that Rick will comment on this eventually, but I would assume that this is an oversight as Titus 2:13 is a classic Christological example of the Granville Sharp Rule.

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MJ. Smith | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Apr 8 2015 2:07 PM

Actually the documentation answers the question as it states precisely what data sources were used for coding.  Too bad I can't find the documentationCrying

Orthodox Bishop Hilarion Alfeyev: "To be a theologian means to have experience of a personal encounter with God through prayer and worship."

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Don Awalt | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Apr 8 2015 2:11 PM

Titus 2:13 is a Granville Sharp construction if you join the Faithlife Group "Logos Syntax Searching", you will find a Syntax Search "complete Granville Sharp Modified" which I constructed from a blog post years ago, and it correctly finds it.

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Rick Brannan (Faithlife) | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Apr 8 2015 2:44 PM

Pastor Michael Huffman:

MJ. Smith:

It is identified as Granville Sharpe in

Cairns, Alan. Dictionary of Theological Terms. Belfast; Greenville, SC: Ambassador Emerald International, 2002.

According to a Greek grammatical rule (called the "Granville Sharpe Rule"—see Dana and Mantey, A Manual Grammar of the Greek New Testament, 146–53)

So this is a mistake in the tool, in your thoughts?

The list of annotated Granville Sharp constructions is taken from Dan Wallace's article "Sharp Redevivus?", available online here: https://bible.org/article/sharp-redivivus-reexamination-granville-sharp-rule . You can see the list on pp. 27–31 in the word doc version ("additional media") of that paper.

Wallace has a special section near the end of this paper discussing Titus 2.13 and 2 Peter 1.1 in particular.

It appears that because these two instances were excerpted from the generic list and discussed separately, they were not annotated along the way. We'll review and add the instances to the dataset.

Thanks for your report!

Rick Brannan
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Rick Brannan (Faithlife) | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Apr 8 2015 3:29 PM

Rick Brannan (Faithlife):
It appears that because these two instances were excerpted from the generic list and discussed separately, they were not annotated along the way. We'll review and add the instances to the dataset.

I've verified that we've added the annotations internally. An update should be included when the next batch of resource updates are delivered.

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Rick Brannan (Faithlife) | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Apr 8 2015 3:31 PM

MJ. Smith:

Actually the documentation answers the question as it states precisely what data sources were used for coding.  Too bad I can't find the documentationCrying

There was an issue with the documentation resource. We could've released it, but it would break users on mobile platforms. Hopefully the mobile teams will add the necessary support (to view the resource, not the annotation dataset) soon (but I really have no idea when).

Rick Brannan
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Tim Bray | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Apr 17 2015 2:57 PM

May sound like a dumb question but where do I find the Grammatical Construction Tool? Tongue Tied

 

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MJ. Smith | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Apr 17 2015 3:04 PM

Its part of the Search and in the current beta part of the grammar section of the bws EG

Orthodox Bishop Hilarion Alfeyev: "To be a theologian means to have experience of a personal encounter with God through prayer and worship."

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Mark Barnes | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Apr 17 2015 3:05 PM

Tim Bray:

May sound like a dumb question but where do I find the Grammatical Construction Tool? Tongue Tied

It's not a tool, but a dataset that you can access through search or the context menu. You'll only have access to it if you're a Logos Now subscriber.

You can read the documentation here: logosres:cidbdocgkgram

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Mark Barnes | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Apr 17 2015 3:07 PM

MJ. Smith:
Its part of the Search and in the current beta part of the grammar section of the bws

It's the Exegetical Guide, not the BWS:

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Rick Brannan (Faithlife) | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Apr 17 2015 3:10 PM

Also, I believe that we published an update to the Greek Grammatical Constructions documentation resource. So if you've got it (and if you have Logos Now subscription, you should have a license for it) you should be able to find it in your Library. This will explain a little about the dataset and give some examples.

(MJ, the version I presently see is from 04/08. Does that match what you have?)

Rick Brannan
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Mark Barnes | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Apr 17 2015 3:13 PM

Rick Brannan (Faithlife):
Also, I believe that we published an update to the Greek Grammatical Constructions documentation resource.

Rick, it would help if the search examples in the documentation were linked to a search.

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MJ. Smith | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Apr 17 2015 3:18 PM

Yes mine is also 4/8

Orthodox Bishop Hilarion Alfeyev: "To be a theologian means to have experience of a personal encounter with God through prayer and worship."

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Rick Brannan (Faithlife) | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Apr 17 2015 3:29 PM

Mark Barnes:
Rick, it would help if the search examples in the documentation were linked to a search.

Thanks for the suggestion, Mark. I'll see what we can do.

Rick Brannan
Data Wrangler, Faithlife
My books in print

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Rick Brannan (Faithlife) | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Apr 17 2015 3:30 PM

MJ. Smith:

Yes mine is also 4/8

Thanks for confirming, MJ. Appreciate it.

Rick Brannan
Data Wrangler, Faithlife
My books in print

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Tim Bray | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Apr 17 2015 3:35 PM

Ahh there you go...don't have the section...have to find out where to get it :-)

 

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Mark Barnes | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Apr 17 2015 3:39 PM

Tim Bray:
Ahh there you go...don't have the section...have to find out where to get it :-)

https://www.logos.com/now and https://www.logos.com/features#LogosNow 

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