NA28 Critical Apparatus does not always appear in Exegetical Guide even when it has relevant information

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Graham Criddle | Forum Activity | Posted: Mon, Oct 12 2015 3:47 AM

This was originally discussed in https://community.logos.com/forums/p/117418/771430.aspx#771430 and following.

Veli - who flagged the issue - posted the screenshot below - which shows the NA28 critical apparatus appears when running a Guide on John 3:1-15 but not John 3:1-5 even though there is an entry for verse 3.

I can't reproduce this on 6.6 SR1 or 6.7 beta 2 (I get results in either case)

Thoughts appreciated, Graham 

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Veli Voipio | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Oct 12 2015 8:59 AM

Thanks a lot Graham!

I've tried all sorts of things that have come into my mind, for example rebooting the computer, but nothing seems to help.

I can live with this problem, but if a another user is doing  precise research and does not know about this bug, he may skip the NA28 apparatus accidentally

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Veli Voipio | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Oct 13 2015 12:24 AM

I received the update to SR-2 for 6.6 this morning, but it did not help.

The NA28 apparatus shows up in the exegetical guide if I choose a section from the drop-down list, but:

If I use my own selection instead, like John 3:1, John 3:3 or John 3:1-5, then the NA28 apparatus does not show up. (In the case John 3:1 it actually should not, but in the other two cases it should.)

I guess that the drop-down list is based on the commentary sections in the user's library. And I assume that Graham has more commentaries than I. This explains the difference?

Graham, do you see John 3:1-5 in your drop.down list? Please, try a single verse or a selection that does not appear in the drop-down list, this would be an interesting test!

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Veli Voipio | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Oct 13 2015 3:34 AM

I tried to find more info from the net and my Logos5 manual. I guess now that the drop-down list is related to pericopes which are extracted from the Bibles in the user's library.

Thus looks like the NA28 Bible reference is related to the pericope, and not to the verse, while in all the others the Bible reference is related to the verse.

Could FL check this and fix this?

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Graham Criddle | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Oct 14 2015 12:46 AM

Veli Voipio:
Graham, do you see John 3:1-5 in your drop.down list? Please, try a single verse or a selection that does not appear in the drop-down list, this would be an interesting test!

No I don't

But, as above, I do get the NA28 apparatus when running a Guide against that range

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Veli Voipio | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Oct 14 2015 1:03 AM

Thanks a lot again, Graham!

Then I just have to live with this small problem what I have. I am happy having the NA28 apparatus in Logos anyway!

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Veli Voipio | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Oct 21 2015 11:47 AM

One thing I remember now, earlier if I chose on verse only in NT, it had NA in front of it, like NA John 3:5.

It still does similar thing in the OT, having for example BHS Genesis 28:11

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Tom Bastress | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Aug 13 2016 10:49 AM

Has there been any progress on this fix?

Thanks.

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Fr Devin Roza | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Aug 13 2016 1:20 PM

FWIW, I had this problem at one point. And I fixed it. Here is what I did:

I went to my Guides menu, and deleted all of my saved New Testament Exegetical Guides. I never save Guides on purpose, and wouldn't even notice if Faithlife removed that "feature", but Faithlife saves Guides for you all the time without you knowing it or asking for it! 

For whatever reason, once I removed the saved NT Exegetical Guides, the NA28 Apparatus appeared again!

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MJ. Smith | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Aug 13 2016 1:25 PM

Veli Voipio:
I've tried all sorts of things that have come into my mind, for example rebooting the computer, but nothing seems to help.

Did you try refreshing the Guide or the Section of the Guide?

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MJ. Smith | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Aug 13 2016 1:33 PM

Fr Devin Roza:
For whatever reason, once I removed the saved NT Exegetical Guides, the NA28 Apparatus appeared again!

Which tells me three things:

  1. There was probably a note at the top of the Guide telling you it had provided a saved guide
  2. That the used guide was created prior to the inclusion of NA28 apparatus
  3. That you did not refresh the guide or the section of the guide to include new information

I would prefer to make my Guides permanent documents but do not because there is no way to refresh the template i.e. bring up to the current template when sections are added. Said permanent Guide would correspond to the lectionary pericopes.

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Fr Devin Roza | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Aug 13 2016 1:49 PM

Yes, that's correct, MJ. My experience was that whenever the NA28 didn't appear, it was always because Verbum was pulling up the saved Exegetical Guide, even though I was running from a new, fresh guide, and not opening up the Guide Document.

I would prefer for Faithlife to never save my Guides as documents, and always create a fresh Guide (i.e., for it to work as a tool, like the Factbook). 

I have only run into this problem of Guides not pulling up newer resources with the NA28 Apparatus (I'm guessing due to a bug, or maybe the section being updated by code after the old Guide was run).

This experience certainly intensified my dislike of the Guide as a Document design, especially how the saved Guide opened without my having saved it explicitly or asked for a saved version.

I don't want to have to worry about my Guide being out of date every time I type in a passage into the Guide reference box and run a new Guide.... Here you can type in one passage, and have the NA28 appear, then another passage in the same Guide, and the NA28 disappears, as the old saved Guide pops up without you asking for it.

But, MJ, if I understand correctly you have found use for Guides as documents for Lectionary pericopes - how's that? What are you hoping to do?

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MJ. Smith | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Aug 13 2016 8:02 PM

Because I use Logos primarily for creating small group lectionary-based Bible studies, I find it useful to leave notes in a Guide with regards to things that catch my attention for the next time through or for marking resources as not worth looking at for this passage. I use refresh to keep the contents up to date but am annoyed that new sections must be added manually to each saved Guide ...

Orthodox Bishop Hilarion Alfeyev: "To be a theologian means to have experience of a personal encounter with God through prayer and worship."

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Tom Bastress | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Aug 14 2016 5:57 PM

I noticed the issue Friday when I was creating a new exegetical guide for Mark 1. I noticed that when I was on verse 1 the NA28 apparatus wasn't appearing, but when I moved to a different verse, the apparatus would appear. "How strange?" I thought, considering the textual variants involved with Mark 1:1.

Anyway, I tried it today, and the NA28 apparatus appeared on verse 1, but disappeared for verse 2.

Again, not sure what is causing this.  It would be great if the Logos folks could look into this.

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