Retiring the Send-to-Kindle Feature on 3/31

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Posts 80
EX | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Mar 9 2016 7:02 AM

Stephen Steele:

Mark Barnes:

This is terrible news. I rely on that feature, and it keeps my buying Logos books instead of Kindle books.

Agreed.

It's also deeply upsetting that even though this feature hasn't been available for any new resources for the last 6 months, some Faithlife employees have publicly denied that it affected all products, and continued to promote a feature which was broken. (I'm not saying they knew they were giving out misinformation, but unintentionally or not that's what happened - and it shouldn't have been allowed to). See for example, Mark Ward's reply to my comment in January at the very bottom of this Logos Talk post - where he was confident enough to contradict a forum post by another Faithlife employee.

This lack of transparency conveniently resulted in 6 months extra sales for Logos 6 base packages and resources based on a key feature (many have stated elsewhere that this was the primary reason they upgraded) which didn't work as advertised.

In the last 6 months I personally have bought many books in Logos format rather than kindle format because Faithlife staff told us that the send-to-kindle engine was being updated.

I echo your frustration. Send-to-Kindle is an important feature for me as well.

(delete)

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Floyd Johnson | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Mar 9 2016 7:13 AM

See this article for a partial explanation:

http://goodereader.com/blog/e-book-news/amazon-disables-send-to-kindle-on-rival-bookstores 

Blessings,
Floyd

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Mark Barnes | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Mar 9 2016 7:36 AM

Floyd Johnson:

That puts a different complexion on things...

There's an even more detailed explanation here: http://the-digital-reader.com/2015/06/15/baen-books-reveals-amazons-byzantine-policies-on-kindle-email-delivery/ 

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JT (alabama24) | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Mar 9 2016 7:50 AM

Mark Barnes:

Floyd Johnson:

That puts a different complexion on things...

There's an even more detailed explanation here: http://the-digital-reader.com/2015/06/15/baen-books-reveals-amazons-byzantine-policies-on-kindle-email-delivery/ 

The solution would be to send us the documents via email directly... Except that would be potentially wrought with fraud... So no good either. Tongue Tied

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Posts 1059
William Gabriel | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Mar 9 2016 8:07 AM

alabama24:

The solution would be to send us the documents via email directly... Except that would be potentially wrought with fraud... So no good either. Tongue Tied

That's not materially different than how it works now. They send the file directly to Amazon, but then through the Amazon Cloud Drive, you can get access to the .mobi and download it any time. I just tested it with the most recent book I sent to Kindle from Logos, and I was able to download and open the .mobi in Calibre just fine.

It does have the disclaimer at the top of the book: "For the personal use of William Gabriel (<logos email address>) only. Not for redistribution."

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Floyd Johnson | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Mar 9 2016 8:55 AM

Mark Barnes:

That puts a different complexion on things...

There's an even more detailed explanation here: http://the-digital-reader.com/2015/06/15/baen-books-reveals-amazons-byzantine-policies-on-kindle-email-delivery/ 

Thanks, Mark. That was the article I originally saw a few weeks ago, but could not find it; so I posted the one I did. It would be helpful if LOGOS could create a MOBI or ePub file for us to upload.

Blessings,
Floyd

Pastor-Patrick.blogspot.com

Posts 2738
Kevin A. Purcell | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Mar 9 2016 9:05 AM

I'm guessing publishers are also not happy about this feature. That's why they probably don't offer a send to PDF as an alternative. I'd actually prefer that because then I could use it on an iPad with Apple Books or Good Reader.

I have read a few books on Kindle this way so I am also disappointed.

Posts 1059
William Gabriel | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Mar 9 2016 9:17 AM

Kevin A. Purcell:

I'm guessing publishers are also not happy about this feature. That's why they probably don't offer a send to PDF as an alternative. I'd actually prefer that because then I could use it on an iPad with Apple Books or Good Reader.

I have read a few books on Kindle this way so I am also disappointed.

Since Logos was so vague in the initial statement, I wonder if this is the biggest reason for change. The 100 page export limit is already relatively generous compared to what other ebook distributors allow, like Kindle. Amazon blocks copy/paste after about 1 chapter of a book (when I tried it last). So I have to imagine that language exists in the contracts with the publishers that allow for the more liberal 100 page limit.

I can imagine some of them arguing that the Send-to-Kindle feature violates that part of the language of the contract. I doubt all the publishers care, but it only takes one putting up a fight to take the whole thing down I imagine.

Posts 23
Curtis M | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Mar 9 2016 9:41 AM

I too am sad to lose this feature as I do a lot of reading on my Kindle (I much prefer e-ink to a screen for extended periods of reading). As as been said by others, this will affect what I buy from Logos. Before send-to-kindle, I only bought reference works on Logos (commentaries, grammars, lexicons, ect.), but bought special interest books, monographs, ect elsewhere because I would have to be hard put to actually want to read a book within the Faithlife ecosystem. I am sad to have to return to my previous habits because I would much rather give my money to Faithlife then "the others". 

I would second the motion to develop an e-pub export system as an alternative. There are plenty of inexpensive alternatives to Kindle that will handle e-pub.

Posts 633
Stephen Steele | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Mar 9 2016 11:02 AM

Floyd Johnson:

It would be helpful if LOGOS could create a MOBI or ePub file for us to upload.

Yes

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Bruce Dunning | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Mar 9 2016 3:19 PM

I'm not sure how I missed this thread but it somehow escaped my attention. This is sad sad sad news!!!!

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Posts 3941
abondservant | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Mar 9 2016 5:35 PM

Phil Gons (Faithlife):

Due to a combination of technical, legal, and permission issues outside our control, we're going to retire the send-to-Kindle feature on 3/31. You'll be able to use the service through the end of the month. After that point, it will no longer work. We apologize for the inconvenience this may cause you.

Update: Books already sent to Kindle will not be affected by this change. You will be able to continue to enjoy them on your Kindle after 3/31.



Thank you for letting us know in advance. Even though this doesn't directly affect me, it makes me feel like my complaints have been heard.


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Posts 2337
mab | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Mar 9 2016 7:13 PM

Amazon seems to think they run the universe. Kindle is their platform so they can play bully.  I am completely content using Kindle as an app mostly on tablet and mostly for free books. 

I think Logos is great on tablet. We'll survive.

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Posts 633
Stephen Steele | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Mar 10 2016 2:37 AM

While there may be licensing & permission issues outside Faithlife's control with sending copyrighted content to kindle - the same wouldn't be the case for public domain works.

Therefore there would be nothing stopping Logos having an 'export to kindle format' feature for public domain works, classic commentaries etc.

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Mark Barnes | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Mar 10 2016 2:50 AM

Stephen Steele:
While there may be licensing & permission issues outside Faithlife's control with sending copyrighted content to kindle - the same wouldn't be the case for public domain works.

The link above said that Amazon has been stopping third-parties sending lots of "Send to Kindle" requests on behalf of customers, so it's likely that this couldn't be an automated process.

Export would still be a possibility, but that does widen the piracy door.

Posts 1
Corcimaru Serghei | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Mar 10 2016 10:16 AM

Terrible news! Without this feature I will definitely buy less books from Logos... If possible, please, try to fix all the problems and bring this feature back!

Posts 633
Stephen Steele | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Mar 10 2016 12:38 PM

Mark Barnes:

Export would still be a possibility, but that does widen the piracy door.

Maybe - depending on how big a problem piracy of public domain Christian books is.

But I'm sure that like me others already begrudge buying public domain works in Logos. And if they can't be sent to kindle and can only be read on a tablet, I'd rather read the original book on archive.org or Google books and save money in the process.

Posts 410
Mark Nolette | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Mar 10 2016 2:14 PM

I played a little with Send-To-Kindle. But, since I use an Android e-Ink device as well as an iPad, it wasn't a big deal for me.  I can see how it is a big deal for others, though.  

A caveat for anyone in the market for an Android E-Ink e-reader: some of these devices don't have the hardware acceleration settings that the current FL Android apps need, while others do. Three that I know work with current FL apps are the Boyue T62+, the Onyx Boox C67ML Carta, and the Icarus Illumina XL. The first two are 6 inch devices with a decent 212 dpi resolution. The latter is an 8 inch device with a slightly lower resolution (160 dpi). 

The Boyue is my preferred reading device (though my discovery of the Bookmaster iPad app may make me use my iPad more often for reading). It works well with FL apps and has good battery life. The Onyx also works well, but has less battery life. The Icarus is larger, but with less screen resolution.  

I would love to see FL implement a change in their Android apps to allow pages to be turned by E-Ink devices with physical page turn buttons. I'd also like to see a color scheme (high contrast) implemented as an option which would improve visibility of all app features on E-Ink devices. 

That said, FL apps work well on my Boyue.  In fact, my main reason for buying an Android E-Ink device was to run the Verbum app on it!  

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NB.Mick | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Mar 10 2016 2:44 PM

Mark Barnes:

Stephen Steele:
While there may be licensing & permission issues outside Faithlife's control with sending copyrighted content to kindle - the same wouldn't be the case for public domain works.

The link above said that Amazon has been stopping third-parties sending lots of "Send to Kindle" requests on behalf of customers, so it's likely that this couldn't be an automated process.

Export would still be a possibility, but that does widen the piracy door.

The links above both stated that Amazon stopped those third-parties technically by imposing limits per sender's adress and basing this on a contract clause that permits charging for the services. This has nothing to do with piracy at all - it has to do with the aspect that Amazon doesn't like other companies that sell electronic content (i.e. competitors) allow their customers to use the Amazon kindle platform for legal, paid products.

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JT (alabama24) | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Mar 10 2016 3:12 PM

NB.Mick:
This has nothing to do with piracy at all

I think the "piracy" issue Mark referenced is on FL's side. The way that "send to kindle" currently works, users had to give a SINGLE kindle email address, where the files would be sent. It would be easier to commit piracy if the files were sent directly to one's personal email address, where the user could "sell" the resource to whomever.

I do understand that the user could have done something similar before, but the current system makes it a little harder... especially for the novice user. Those who REALLY want to break the law can find ways to do so. A bigger issue may be all the little law breakers (perhaps unintentionally) who say to their buddy: "Hey, I have that book. Want me to send it to you?"

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