Notes Compromise idea

I am writing this to get feedback from Logos 4 users on how they think this idea would integrate with the way they use Logos 4. I may add this idea to logos.uservoice.com depending on the feedback I get here.

It seems to me the main appeal of being able to have notes in Logos is the convenience of having them inside the program and the ability to search them. However, the notes features fall well short of note taking programs and word processors. Bob has said that he doesn't want to get into the Word processor business. Logos, even after a substantial investments, wouldn't be able to provide all the features of Word or OneNote etc. that users might want.

Instead of beefing up the Notes function exponentially only to deliver less functionality than programs already on our computers, why not index files saved by those programs?

My suggestion would be to index files of the programs that do note-taking or word processing well (e.g.: .doc, .docx, .one, .pdf, .odt). Windows already does this. I imagine telling the indexer which folders I wanted included in this user-document index.

This search could be placed alongside Basic, Bible, Morph, and Syntax. I doubt proximity searches (like WITHIN, BEFORE etc.) would be needed so it could be a simple index where the results could come back with the number of hits within the file and the date that file was last modified. The logic behind Refftagger could be applied to automatically tag Bible references so you could search these files for Bible references.

If Logos did this I think it would be the best of both worlds. We could search our notes and Logos wouldn't have to try to keep up with the latest in Word processing and note-taking. The current notes should be left in place, not only for legacy reasons but for the "annotation in the margins" that they are designed for. Not being a programmer I don't know how involved implementing this suggestion would be, but it seems like it would be easier than building an entire word processor within Logos (which users seem to be clamoring for loudly).

What do you think?

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Comments

MJ. Smith

This is something I had suggested as finishing building a knowledge base (in the General Knowledge Base sense of the term). I'm fairly sure that they have used the GKB in the past and with the use of favorites as a linkage mechanism and the "my Content" searches they have some of the fundamentals in place.

Robert Kostenbauder

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/99936#Comment_99936

I was thinking that I would use OneNote as my note taking facility. In fact with Win7 you can move L4 to one side of the screen and then open OneNote on the other side of your screen. Works great. Your idea is also great.

nikk

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/99936#Comment_99936

I agree, it would be much more productive.

Jonathan Sine

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/99944#Comment_99944

The only thing keeping me from using Onenote regularly is that with L4 you can hover over Bible references to see the verses.

William

What do you think?

I personally really like this idea. I think this would be of great benefit.

I am only thinking of one issue that would need to be considered. It just would need to be limited to documents that we (the user) is the original author. If we are able to search other documents....that would get off into copyright issues. I do not know about the ins and outs of copyright. I am just thinking it would have to be considered.

Fred Chapman

Kevin,

I would love to have my OneNote notebooks indexed and come up as links in the My Content section. If OneNote could somehow be integrated as an optional tool in L4 I would not care if L4 had a notes capability. I have switched back and forth between Onenote and Logos note feature since converting to Office 2007. The only reason I still come back to L4 notes is the convenience of being able to save created notes in study layouts and the fact that they are included in my searches.

I think your idea should be explored; but not being a programmer I have no idea what hurdles the development teams would have to overcome.

tom

What do you think?

This would be better than what we have. The problem that I have is that it will not place a icon in our Bibles/books stating that we have notes that relate to the text.

I do not believe Bob needs to have his team create a word processor. I do not see why they cannot simply embed an existing word processor. While I am not a fan of OpenOffice, they do create an open source word processor. I do not see why embedding this "free" program into Logos is such a problem.

Philip Gurgel

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/99997#Comment_99997

It would be nice if they included Evernote as well. I started using that lately, it's nice to have access to my notes wherever I can pop on to the Internet.

Graham Owen

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/99997#Comment_99997

The problem that I have is that it will not place a icon in our Bibles/books stating that we have notes that relate to the text.

But we could attach hyperlinks to the verses an icon could tell us that we had linked a document to that verse we could then link multiple document formats (Word, OneNote, XMind, etc.) to a single verse and would not be restricted to a single program and its facilities. The biggest issue with this that I see is the ability to quickly preview the content of the notes. The integrated notes can be viewed by hovering and I'm not sure how easily this functionality could be replicated if the notes are stored externally in a number of different programs.

One thing that I wonder about Notes is do people actually want (or need) a better Note taking facility or do they need better integration between the basic Note taking tools that we have and the various external Word Processing tools? Personally I am happy with the toolset that I have but my frustrations are generally caused by these tools not working together as I would like.

I curently use Logos Notes and Clippings to capture ideas when I am studying, I use OneNote to capture information and ideas from non Logos sources and I use XMind to organise thoughts. In any of these I may add a Hyperlink to a source in one of the others. For presentation or publication the materials will them be exported to Word of PowerPoint where I will take the various ideas and produce a final output. It is at this point most of my personal frustrations exist because the primary way that the transfer is achieved is through copy and paste. For me better integration would enable Notes and Clippings from Logos to be sent to Word or PowerPoint in a number of different ways i.e. entire files, selected articles or selcted text.

When I first saw the Handout Feature in Beta I had hoped that this would provide a solution but unfortunately in its current form it does not. My ideal would be to capture my Logos generated content in a handout (or similar) document and publish to Word and/or PowerPoint using a Word/PowerPoint Template to determine style.

I do think that Bob and the Team at Logos need a clearer strategy in this area because it does look like they are in danger of ending up with multiple word processing/text publishing tools in a program that is NOT a word processor. I'm thinking here of Notes and Clippings, both of which I currently use plus Handouts, the Various Study Documents, The Sermon Addin (when it arrives) and the PBB Publishing facilities. Logos 4 supports significantly more user content and ways to generate that content than version 3 and to realistically support that content I think Logos will inevitably need to provide better internal editing tools, including a spell checker, or better integration with the external tools that they would prefer us to use.

DominicM

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/100028#Comment_100028

it sounds great guys, but am still holing out that Logos will come throught for us.

I suggest when PBB are reintroduced with the enhancement Bob hinted at, most of these points are muted, as there will be more case for using PBB instead of notes.

Stein Dahl

What do you think?

I had thought of something like this before also. The note feature in Logos 4 could be programmed to use an "outside" word processor - (i.e.; Word Pad, Word, OpenOffice, etc.) - in which to write and store your notes. These notes would have to be accessible from inside the program though for it to work the way I would want it to work.

For instance, if I add a note to John 3:16 and a note icon appears there in the text, I should still get at least part of my note in a pop-up when I hover my mouse over that note icon. When I click on the note icon to open my note file, it should open the word processor of my choice - but within the notes window - inside of Logos.

And any links I have made in my notes (to Bibles or other resources) should be active so that if I click a link in my notes, it would take me to that resource, or open that resource in it's own tab, or open that resource in a floating window.

I think it's possible. WORDsearch has something similar to this in the way they use and store user created documents. They are stored in a special folder that the program accesses through a window within the program. And any links that are stored in these documents will produce pop-ups and if you click them they will open the resource that the links point to.

If Logos did this at least they wouldn't have to create their own word processor. They would just have to write some code to make using an outside word processor a functional reality for the notes feature in L4.

Kevin Becker

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/99946#Comment_99946

I am only thinking of one issue that would need to be considered. It just would need to be limited to documents that we (the user) is the original author. If we are able to search other documents....that would get off into copyright issues. I do not know about the ins and outs of copyright. I am just thinking it would have to be considered.

Perhaps not. Windows already has an indexing service that enables searching inside documents. As far as I know it also indexes copyrighted works I have downloaded in .doc or .pdf. If there was a copyright issue I imagine MS would be defending itself in court right now. The thorniest issue might be whatever patents protect the way Windows indexes the contents of files on the hard drive.

This would be better than what we have. The
problem that I have is that it will not place a icon in our Bibles/books
stating that we have notes that relate to the text.

What go me thinking about this issue yesterday was the thought of making a note file for links to external documents. It would be a manual way of getting note icons to show up in my text. I could also past an excerpt from the file so I could get limited preview capabilities. However, the problem with this would be if I ever decided to rearrange my user files, I would end up breaking a lot of links.

it sounds great guys, but am still
holing out that Logos will come throught for us.

I suggest when PBB are reintroduced with the enhancement Bob hinted
at, most of these points are muted, as there will be more case for using
PBB instead of notes.

This is quite true. However, the number of people who will use the PBB will be limited if the pricing structure is similar to what it was in LDLS 3. Also, I doubt that PBB build books will be able to be edited on the fly. Every time I come back to a subject or passage I hope to be gleaning fresh insights and observations, it's easy to add to a Note file or Word Processing document, adding to a PBB will likely be much more time consuming.

I had thought of something like this before
also. The note feature in Logos 4 could be programmed to use an "outside"
word processor - (i.e.; Word Pad, Word, OpenOffice, etc.) - in which to
write and store your notes. These notes would have to be accessible from
inside the program though for it to work the way I would want
it to work.

This seems to be a popular idea. I have my reservations about it. If Logos were to implement it, they would have to chase after any changes that are made to that word processor. Logos would then be in a similar situation as they were with IE and LDLS. Perhaps if Logos were to cannibalize code from an open-source project they could control these issues, but I don't know.

Thanks for all the interaction thus far. Hopefully all this discussion will help Logos as they work on improving the program.

Ken F Hill

If such a scheme were implemented, I hope it goes beyond OneNote to include other outliner/organizers (eg, KeyNote, TreePad, NoteTab) and formats (eg, RTF).

I'm not sure a fancy internal word processor is needed. Freebie e-sword has capable notes abilities. Even if it were no better than the post editor in this forum it would be adequate for me -- if it had good export capabilities. If I had to do any kind of fancy formatting, I would just export to a page layout or word processing program.

DominicM

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/100052#Comment_100052

it sounds great guys, but am still holing out that Logos will come throught for us.

I suggest when PBB are reintroduced with the enhancement Bob hinted at, most of these points are muted, as there will be more case for using PBB instead of notes.

This is quite true. However, the number of people who will use the PBB will be limited if the pricing structure is similar to what it was in LDLS 3. Also, I doubt that PBB build books will be able to be edited on the fly. Every time I come back to a subject or passage I hope to be gleaning fresh insights and observations, it's easy to add to a Note file or Word Processing document, adding to a PBB will likely be much more time consuming.

we'll have to wait and see i guess.. as for pricing yes, I would hope personal PBB might be free like several (unnamed) competitors, and there being a fee for the professional one, but its ok to dream isnt it...

Vivian Matheson

Oh my gosh! That would be wonderful! It would make "note taking" and "note finding" so much easier! Do it! Please!

Vivian Matheson

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/100087#Comment_100087

I obviously don't know how to get my reply to go directly to one post and not just be tagged on to the end of the whole long lists of replies. What I just wrote makes no sense if it is not associated with Dominic's latest post of this morning, March 5. Somebody advise me, please

Vivian Matheson

Oh Good grief! It wasn't Dominic's post I was referring to - it was Kevin Beckers! Sorry guys...

Vivian Matheson

Ken F Hill

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/100089#Comment_100089

I obviously don't know how to get my reply to go directly to one post

When you reply, start by pressing the "reply" button. In the post editor, highlight text you want to quote in your reply, then press the "quote" button (see below). The person's name and the quoted text will appear above your comment.

William

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/100052#Comment_100052

Kevin,

Maybe, I was adding something to your original thought that would not be involved in this note thread. If we were to write notes about a particular document and we wanted to use it in a document we would need to cite the resource. I think I am talking outside of your indexing idea....

Edward hyndman

It seems to me the main appeal of being able to have notes in Logos is the convenience of having them inside the program and the ability to search them.

Certainly the appeal is to have notes which are part of the Logos program. Notes you can search, notes linked to verses and articles and therefore listed and organised by thier links. It seems to me the real power of notes in Logos has nothing to do with word-processing in terms of formatting, publishing or even grammar and spell checking. As long as you can cut/paste into Word, Publisher, One Note.... then there is no need to "keep up" with or become a word processing program. L3 already had everything needed. In L3 I can keep note files for different purposes. I can attach them to verses and other items so that opening the note file or the chapter gives me access to an organised set of notes, the notes can be as long as needed, include links and other quotes etc. It is a really integrated way to study and prepare. Parts I want to copy to Word or elsewhere can be copied.

If we create notes in an indexed Onenote file, (I do use Onenote) we will be dependant on the future of Onenote and so will our data. Also, would the Onenote information really integrate in both directions with the Logos files, and would the growing Onenote files be organised appropriately when you clicked a link in logos? (As an example, in Logos I can hover on the note icon on John 1.1 and the pop-up shows the note, then click on the icon and the relevant notefile opens with the whole list of notes throughout John's gospel. Likewise if I am in the note on John 1.5 and click the note title on the list, the bible text opens.)

The other thing ofcourse is this; "To make use of notes in Logos, please ensure you already own Onenote from Microsoft.."

Paul Davey

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/100591#Comment_100591

One problem with using external files is that it does not get synchronised - so when you go to another computer, your notes are not there.

Kevin Becker

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/100591#Comment_100591

The other thing ofcourse is this; "To make use of notes in Logos, please ensure you already own Onenote from Microsoft.."

My suggestion was not to tie external indexing to OneNote specifically. It was only one of the examples I used in a list that I didn't want to be taken exhaustively. I included other file formats that will likely be around for many years (.doc/x, .pdf) so the worries about the inability to continue to use that data at some point should be greatly reduced.

One problem with using external files
is that it does not get synchronised - so when you go to another
computer, your notes are not there.

That is a good observation. However, there are third party solutions (Live Mesh) that can be used to synchronize files across multiple computers and with the increasing reliance on cloud based computing I think we will see many other similar solutions.

Jim VanSchoonhoven

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/101025#Comment_101025

Honestly, I do not like this idea, I don't want to depend on two programs for my notes when the solution is simple, just fix the problem and bring Logos up to the level that many other programs already are at.

If you look at other paid for bible programs this is not a problem in most of them, and neither is it in some free bible study programs. It is a fact that there are free programs out there that have many features in their note taking abilites that Logos does not! Some of them allow for links, printing, rearrangement, they are searchable and much more. In fact you can write whole books in the note area in some free programs and even add your notes to searchable collections.

As the leader, in the bible study programs, I have to admit, that Logos lags behind in this area, and they need to bring their program up to the standards set by others in the field. Instead, Logos 4 has been a step back!

Not everyone understands the importance of this feature to increasing their level of bible study, but once a person does, a good note taking system is not an option, it is one of the keys to a good overall program, just like searching is! Do we really want to have to do the same research over and over, or do we want to have away to arrange it so we can build on the information we already have? And do we want this information to be easily found and in a format that we can share with others when ever the need might arise?

I believe Logos will make the changes that are needed, and I don't believe it will be that hard for them to make the changes, in the past I think, they just were not aware of the many ways this feature could improve the over all bible study experience, Bob only seen it from his point of view. I think these forums have helped him see things from other points of view. We will see soon!

In Christ,

Jim

Stein Dahl

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/101230#Comment_101230

I don't want to depend on two programs for my notes when the solution is simple, just fix the problem and bring Logos up to the level that many other programs already are at.

If you look at other paid for bible programs this is not a problem in most of them, and neither is it in some free bible study programs. It is a fact that there are free programs out there that have many features in their note taking abilites that Logos does not! Some of them allow for links, printing, rearrangement, they are searchable and much more. In fact you can write whole books in the note area in some free programs and even add your notes to searchable collections.

As the leader, in the bible study programs, I have to admit, that Logos lags behind in this area, and they need to bring their program up to the standards set by others in the field. Instead, Logos 4 has been a step back!

I have to agree with you on the points you made here.

While I would accept Logos linking it's note taking to a simple outside (already existing) word processor like Word Pad in Windows, I would much prefer my notes to be inside of Logos. I also agree that Logos should provide at least the functionality that the Notes feature had in L3.

This is an actual need. It is the only really logical way to collect Biblical research on a particular passage or topic. And it's, by far, the most useful way.

I don't understand how Logos got the idea that this was not an important feature, and that users were not utilizing it. Maybe they were collecting data from users who had not turned off reporting of statistics in their L3 options. I am one of those who turned off reporting of statistics data a long time ago.

Could it be that Logos' information on how users were using L3 is faulty? What if most people turned off reporting of statistics? What if a user was not connected to the internet? I suspect that scenario's like this were really the case.

So, I for one, would really love to have at least the same ability in L4 as in L3. And it would be nice to have improved features also, but I'd settle for what we had in Notes in L3.

MJ. Smith

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/101308#Comment_101308

It is the only really logical way to collect Biblical research on a particular passage or topic. And it's, by far, the most useful way.

I agree to you. My one exception is that I am willing to have many graphics or complex layouts to be created elsewhere and moved with a copy and paste into notes. Lists, tables, indenting, fonts etc. need to be available in notes themselves.

tom

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/101308#Comment_101308

So, I for one, would really love to have at least the same ability in L4 as in L3. And it would be nice to have improved features also, but I'd settle for what we had in Notes in L3.

We use to say that L3 needs to be improved, and now we are saying that we wished that notes have the same functionality that they did in L3.

I will start using L4 when we have the same functionality that we had in L3 (for me - that will be having our TOC back), but I will not be happy. Notes simply need to be improved over L3. We need to be able to have tables, list, and to be able to embed graphics, sound files, and videos.

Jim VanSchoonhoven

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/101314#Comment_101314

At least for myself, I want to put the blame of the importance of the whole note taking idea on Logos Camp 1 and 2. Before I bought those DVD's I thought about note taking the way that Bob P. has mentioned several times.

It was only through hearing and pondering about the things mentioned in those camps that I started to quickly out grow my old way of thinking about notes. From those camps I started to see how note taking could actually make electronic bible study easier and more effective than ever before, by allowing me to be in charge of finding, rearranging and storing research in a way that would make it more useful to me forever! Bible study is not just about searching for and finding information it is also about making that information so that it is the most helpful to me and so that I can find it and use it whenever I need to quickly.

For the first time I understood I did not have to recreate my research time after time, I could collect it all in notes and tie those notes to either topics or verses, and I could share those notes with others in a blink of an eye, no longer do I have to run from resource to resource to share ideas with others I can have it all in a note file.

Because of the current state of note taking in Logos 4 I have resorted to keeping my notes in either Libronix 3 or believe it or not in a free bible software that allows me more freedom to save my notes in ways that are more helpful to me and those I want to share things with. I don't like this, but this is what I have found to be the best work around for me, until things get better with Logos 4!

In Christ,

Jim

David Paul

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/101340#Comment_101340

I've written on this before in other threads, but since it is a HUGE ISSUE, I don't mind doing it again.

Notes isn't just important, it is AS IMPORTANT as the whiz-bang search capabilities that Logos has. In fact, I don't use L4 and its better searching function at all (less than 1%) because of its anemic notes functionality and a number of other issues. Occasional searching and what-not, but that's it. As I've said, I actually resent L4 because it has effectively scuttled the continued development of L3's notes functionality. Some posters in this thread have said that L3 was good enough...no, it had much room for improvement...but it is light years ahead of L4, which is going back to the caveman era, IMO.

I suspect that most Logos users use Notes for taking notes. Excuse me, but that is a tad bit pedestrian. I use Notes for PRESENTATION. It frankly boggles me that both Logos users and the company itself don't comprehend what Logos's 3rd platform is...or rather ought to be. *P*R*E*S*E*N*T*A*T*I*O*N*

When I am doing a Bible study and I hover over a note and a pop-up show how the first sentence of B'reishiytth (Genesis) in Hebrew contains an embryo of the work of Messiah, that blows people away. They immediately begin asking me, "What software is this?"

My point? First, I couldn't do that in L4...because some L3-using nimnods complained about the pop-up windows being too big to see what is underneath them, so Bob fixed the "non-problem" by making notes in L4 2 in. sq. max. That's like putting square tires on a vehicle to keep it from rolling downhill when parked on an incline. It "solves the problem" but eradicates nearly all functionality of the vehicle. The way to solve the non-problem of big pop-ups is to MOVE THE CURSOR OFF OF THE NOTE ICONS. Second point is that Logos is an incredible program with tons of power, even more so in L4 than L3...but who knows this?

NO ONE...except for the insular few who use the program. At Camp Logos, Morris Proctor's favorite word when displaying L4's power is "amazing". Yeah, I suppose. But how many non-users are aware of this? It is a toss up between being either "criminal" or a "sin" that we have a program that has so much "WOW-factor" built into it, and then we take the fruit of our labor and transport it into the paltry likes of PowerPoint.

Logos should be designed so that presentation is one of the main components of its capabilities: Search, Notes, & Presentation are the three legs of what I do, and I ought to be able to use Logos to accomplish all of those tasks. I don't need or want Logos to be PowerPoint. I just want to take killer notes that I can attach to my bible and then have the pop-ups present in an effective way to help me make my points during my bible study presentations. That's how I use L3, though I have to fight the program to accomplish my intentions...still I can make do. L4? Not so much...or rather, not at all.

One factor that I was hoping would be included in L3 at some point is the ability to "pin" my notes so that the don't disappear when I move the cursor off of the note icon. Some of my notes are lengthy, running 15-20 pages or more. With the note "pinned" I could then scroll through the note and point at elements with the cursor. At present, I can't use the cursor once a note pops up because the pop-up disappears as soon as I move the cursor off the icon. This "pin" feature is already part of many Logos resources...lengthy footnotes and such use this feature...but the end user can't make use of it when creating personal notes. Why?

Another problem with notes as in L3 is that I can't use the MS snipping tool to show you examples of my notes, again because of the fact that I can't pin them to the page. As soon as I try to capture the screen, the note goes away. This is a significant short-coming. I could list many others.

Like others, I turned off the "reporting" feature of L3 precisely because my notes were so important to me. I am composing a book and it is almost entirely being structured in my L3 notes. I suspect that others whose notes are very critical to what they do did just as I and others have reported doing. Even if I had known that Logos was gauging usage and making critical decisions that would negatively impact the future usage of the Notes feature, I still wouldn't have shared my notes...not wholesale in that fashion.

Some, but very few of my notes are of the "jotted thought" variety. Most are created to be seen, shown...presented. I make presentations with Logos as my platform, not the scrawn of PowerPoint. Notes should be powerful enough to effectively present from WITHIN the Logos program...without users having to make the extraneous step (and "step-down") of porting into PowerPoint.

MJ. Smith

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/101379#Comment_101379

Even if I had known that Logos was gauging usage and making critical decisions that would negatively impact the future usage of the Notes feature, I still wouldn't have shared my notes...not wholesale in that fashion.

I'm not certain but I believe this is a misrepresentation of what allowing Logos 3 to capture information did.

Kevin Becker

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/101340#Comment_101340

Jim, Stein, David,

I sympathize with desire to have the notes features of Logos be robust enough to be the repository for the fruits of my studies. I don't currently share that desire for a number of reasons, let me try to explain.

When I started using Logos as an undergrad I had the Scholar's library. The library contents were great for my Greek and Hebrew courses but when it came to Theology and Bible courses it didn't have enough information (nor I the money to buy the best resources) to fuel research for the papers I had to write. So when I was in the brick-and-mortar library all my notes were by hand or inputted into Word, because I would ultimately write the paper in Word. I ended up taking notes on what resources I had in Logos outside of Logos (or copied and pasted them out of Logos as soon as I was done) because the end result of my studies required me to use another program.

Nowadays notes are still an intermediate step for me, a repository from which to draw and structure a teaching/preaching outline. I find it very easy to go from OneNote to Word to accomplish this. So yes, Logos 3's note feature wasn't very robust, yes Logos 4 is, in many ways but not all, a step backward in this area. I am used to using Logos for what it does well, research and searching and another program for Notes. Logos would have to astronomically improved the notes feature to convince me to change my system (I would accept PBB as part of this solution as DominicM is holding out for).

I truly hope that Logos can improve notes to meet your needs. But regardless of what Logos does or doesn't do with notes, I think it would be fantastic if Logos could extend the power of its search engine beyond its confines to other files on my hard-drive.

MJ. Smith

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/101587#Comment_101587

I find it very easy to go from OneNote

I believe this is the intermediate step that several users resent because it requires that one give up the automatic indexing and searching that Logos provides for in the notes. It feels a bit like having auto-pilot on a car but not being able to use it. I am not opposed to having to use other software packages with Logos; I do for tree diagrams, argument mapping, etc. But I do expect to be able to copy the diagrams into Logos so that the appear whenever I research the relevant passage.

Perhaps, when we see the revised PBB's they may be the "notes" that many of us are seeking. But given the resource library structures as we have seen them thus far, I doubt that is the direction Logos is heading.

Juanita

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/101766#Comment_101766

As greatly I would love to use Logos notes in any of their versions, I can't let myself because there is NO guarantee that my notes would convert to the next major upgrade. What would help immensely is for an export to rtf. feature and maybe that is there or "in the works" so that I would not lose my work and have some kind of "escape pod' that is in Air Force One.

MJ. Smith

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/101781#Comment_101781

because there is NO guarantee that my notes would convert to the next major upgrade

Given how they are stored, I believe this to be an unfounded concern.

Juanita

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/101783#Comment_101783

Begs the question, MJ, are they stored in a format that anyone can access? I would love for you to elaborate so that my concern would disappear.[:D]

MJ. Smith

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/101785#Comment_101785

Begs the question, MJ, are they stored in a format that anyone can access?

I believe so. I believe that they are in an XML database.

Juanita

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/101806#Comment_101806

Nah, I think rtf is much more accessible and is formatted for literature. In all fairness to you, MJ, I am trying to win my friends over to Logos but they are not as computer literate as you and you are very much so, but they love to study the Bible. So far, they are overwhelmed by the technical stuff e.g. indexing and notes would give them nightmares but being able to export them to doc or rtf makes sense to them.

MJ. Smith

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/101809#Comment_101809

export them to doc or rtf

XML is a universal format. The Open Office products use XML illustrating how easily XML is exported to other formats. Logos has built in the ability to export to several standard Microsoft formats, so your position confuses me.

Juanita

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/101818#Comment_101818

Would you like to meet my friends? [:D] I don't think you would be confused, then. MJ, not everybody that has MS Word has MS Office. And they don't know the Open Office format. Please allow any of your confusion to be dispelled by what you do know that they don't.

Rick Harrell

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/101230#Comment_101230

Honestly, I do not like this idea, I don't want to depend on two programs for my notes when the solution is simple, just fix the problem and bring Logos up to the level that many other programs already are at.

If you look at other paid for bible programs this is not a problem in most of them, and neither is it in some free bible study programs. It is a fact that there are free programs out there that have many features in their note taking abilites that Logos does not! Some of them allow for links, printing, rearrangement, they are searchable and much more. In fact you can write whole books in the note area in some free programs and even add your notes to searchable collections.

Yup

MJ. Smith

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/101820#Comment_101820

Would you like to meet my friends?

I've spent many years getting clients comfortable that touching a keyboard won't break the system or making them understand that the system doesn't work when the power is out.[:)] But my primary thrust was intended to respond to your concern about the safety of your notes. And you seem to know the computer basics sufficiently to recognize how "computer illiterate" people (like Mother but not Dad) are. And yes, I do know that being introduced to computer programming 44 years ago gives me both advantages and disadvantages with current technology.

Juanita

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/101818#Comment_101818

export them to doc or rtf

XML is a universal format. The Open Office products use XML illustrating how easily XML is exported to other formats. Logos has built in the ability to export to several standard Microsoft formats, so your position confuses me.

MJ,

The notes are .lbxnot and I don't see any way to export them or save them as .xml. But if you say so, great news. Thanks so much.

TCBlack

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/102008#Comment_102008

The notes are .lbxnot and I don't see any way to export them or save them as .xml.

the lbxnot files are actually xml already. open them in a text editor to view the XML structure.

MJ. Smith

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/102008#Comment_102008

The notes are .lbxnot and I don't see any way to export them or save them as .xml

Ah, now I see why I was confused but your response. I see why the libronix extension hid the xml format from you. Amazing what perseverance in communication achieves.[:)]

Ron

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/101379#Comment_101379

When I am doing a Bible study and I hover over a note and a pop-up show how the first sentence of B'reishiytth (Genesis) in Hebrew contains an embryo of the work of Messiah, that blows people away. They immediately begin asking me, "What software is this?"

David, I was wondering if you would mind elaborating on what you are talking about here?

Thanks!

David Paul

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/102608#Comment_102608

Ron,

Sorry my response is so sloooow. I haven't been on the forum much lately...working on a book about this and other topics. Email me at mindfruit@live.com and I will give you a brief explanation.

Kent Maitland

Great idea. Logos meets evernote. Personally, I never quite figured out why everyone wants a full word processor built in to Logos. Verse tags are nice, but I doubt they would ever be a reason for me to switch from Word. It would however, be great to search what documents I've made already, as well as pdf. Perhaps this idea will be better received by the Logos developers than the processor idea.

Frank Fenby

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/127936#Comment_127936

It would however, be great to search what documents I've made already

Based on Bob's comment here, http://community.logos.com/forums/p/16257/124397.aspx#124397, I think what you want will be in PBB (Personal Book Builder).

JimTowler

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/101818#Comment_101818

Logos has built in the ability to export to several standard Microsoft formats, so your position confuses me.

MJ,

Where is this Export in Logos4?

I want to be able to export/save my user-content, rather than trust it to the Logos servers, and not actually have my own copy anywhere.

MJ. Smith

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/128240#Comment_128240

Where is this Export in Logos4?

You had me lost here - trying to remember the context of my original statement. Go into Help and do a search on "export" - I suspect more is coming. I also think of the CBV as an "export" function.

ton verdam

I think its a great idea.... I already use google index to find text fast, but this would narrow narrow the search. i like the hyperlinking of bible texts also..