My brain hurts, please help me decide.

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Posts 15
Frank Mickle | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Aug 26 2016 1:10 PM
I read this thread... trying to decide myself what to do??? If I have L6 and if I go with Logos Now, then why would I then want to turn around and purchase L7 Feature Set? Why rent it and buy it at the same time?
Posts 938
Bill Moore | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Aug 26 2016 1:21 PM

Frank Mickle:
I read this thread... trying to decide myself what to do??? If I have L6 and if I go with Logos Now, then why would I then want to turn around and purchase L7 Feature Set? Why rent it and buy it at the same time?

Frank, the only reason to buy the full feature set is if you stop subscribing to Logos Now. If you own the L7 feature set, you would not lose those capabilities. If you have only Logos Now and stop your membership, you revert back to the feature/data sets of Logos 6. I'm in the same boat. If you continue to be a Logos Now member, you keep the latest feature sets.

I'm going one way or the other: either Logos Now or purchasing the full feature set. Some do both to cover the "just in case" scenario.

Regardless, you keep your books no matter what.

Pastor, Cornerstone Baptist Church, Clinton, SC

Posts 15
Frank Mickle | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Aug 26 2016 1:35 PM

O.K. Thanks Bill.  This might be off topic of the original post....  but do you know if using Logos Now burns more data than buying the program?  I am in a rural area and data is metered.

Posts 13417
Mark Barnes | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Aug 26 2016 1:53 PM

Frank Mickle:
O.K. Thanks Bill.  This might be off topic of the original post....  but do you know if using Logos Now burns more data than buying the program?  I am in a rural area and data is metered.

There are a few additional features of Logos Now that require an internet connection — but they use relatively little data.

Logos Now also provides 2-3 preview resources each month, which will use some data to download. If one of those is a MobileEd course with lots of videos, that would be a lot of data, but the videos will only download if you watch them.

You might get a new dataset every couple of months. That will add a little.

So, expect more data usage using Logos Now, but not a whole lot more (unless you play MobileEd videos).

Posts 938
Bill Moore | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Aug 26 2016 1:53 PM

Frank Mickle:

O.K. Thanks Bill.  This might be off topic of the original post....  but do you know if using Logos Now burns more data than buying the program?  I am in a rural area and data is metered.

I don't know, Frank, but I do know that metered data is no fun. You may want to pose that question in the Logos Now forum.

Edit: Never mind the Now forum suggestion. Mark will pop in when least expected. Smile

Pastor, Cornerstone Baptist Church, Clinton, SC

Posts 15
Frank Mickle | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Aug 26 2016 2:01 PM

O.K. Thanks guys...  I'm assuming that Mark meant relatively "little" data?

Posts 13417
Mark Barnes | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Aug 26 2016 2:07 PM

Frank Mickle:

O.K. Thanks guys...  I'm assuming that Mark meant relatively "little" data?

I corrected the typo as you were posting - and added a bit more detail, too.

Posts 15
Frank Mickle | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Aug 26 2016 2:21 PM

Thanks again to both of you.  Mark your knowledge/info is awesome!  Thanks for the help!

Posts 1549
Rick Ausdahl | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Aug 26 2016 7:44 PM

Mark Barnes:

Donn Arms:

It is only 5% but this is what I see on the Logos Now page:

  • Always save at least 10% on Logos 7 Libraries
  • Always save at least 25% on Logos 7 Feature Sets
  • PLUS, Logos Now members save an additional 5% on top of our already great introductory discount
  • And always access every Logos 7 feature for no additional charge

I understand this to say that normally Logos Now members regularly get a 25% discount for now but they are giving an "additional 5%."

No, it's not saying that, as I explained earlier.

  1. Logos Now members regularly get a 25% discount.
  2. There's a "great introductory discount" for everyone of 10%
  3. Logos Now members save an additional 5% on top of the "great introductory discount", so save 15%.
  4. So non-members save 10%, whereas members save 25%+15% = 36.35%.

If you're price is $299 as a non-member, then the regular price would be $332.22.

If you were a Now member, you'd normally get a 25% discount on the regular price, which is $249.17. But at the moment you get an extra 15% (the normal 10% plus the additional 5%), which will bring your price down to $211.79. That's almost the same as 30% off your $299, but not quite.

I'm a little confused by these examples, because sales told me I won't save anything on the L7 features set or base packages by becoming a Logos Now member before making L7 purchases.  Here's my story.

I've purchased a few packages in the past as Logos has moved from Libronix through L6.  I've also made several resource purchases independent of packages.  My last package purchase was L6 Gold.  This week I ordered the L7 Standard Silver and the L7 P&C Bronze packages, which automatically provided me with the L7 Full Feature set.  But after the purchase, I started seriously thinking about Logos Now and began to wonder what my net cost would be if I were to return what I had purchased without a LN membership, then join LN and repurchase the L7 packages as a LN member.  In doing that, I thought I might save enough on the packages to cover a good portion of the $90 first-year LN membership.

I must completely misunderstand the savings that will be recognized by LN members, because I was told I wouldn't save anything up front by going that route, but that I would save on future purchases down the road.  For the record, I am not complaining.  I'm pleased with the packages I purchased as they provide me not only with some new resources that I feel will enhance my library, but the L7 Full Feature set as well.  Nevertheless, I am confused about how and when the savings benefit of being a LN member come into play.  Huh?

Posts 938
Bill Moore | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Aug 26 2016 7:55 PM

Rick Ausdahl:

I'm a little confused by these examples, because sales told me I won't save anything on the L7 features set or base packages by becoming a Logos Now member before making L7 purchases.  Here's my story.

I've purchased a few packages in the past as Logos has moved from Libronix through L6.  I've also made several resource purchases independent of packages.  My last package purchase was L6 Gold.  This week I ordered the L7 Standard Silver and the L7 P&C Bronze packages, which automatically provided me with the L7 Full Feature set.  But after the purchase, I started seriously thinking about Logos Now and began to wonder what my net cost would be if I were to return what I had purchased without a LN membership, then join LN and repurchase the L7 packages as a LN member.  In doing that, I thought I might save enough on the packages to cover a good portion of the $90 first-year LN membership.

I must completely misunderstand the savings that will be recognized by LN members, because I was told I wouldn't save anything up front by going that route, but that I would save on future purchases down the road.  For the record, I am not complaining.  I'm pleased with the packages I purchased as they provide me not only with some new resources that I feel will enhance my library, but the L7 Full Feature set as well.  Nevertheless, I am confused about how and when the savings benefit of being a LN member come into play.  Huh?

I don't think that's correct, Rick, if I understand what you're saying. I've run the scenarios for myself. If I purchase L7 Standard Gold, the price of the library by itself is less with Logos Now than is the library by itself in combination with the Full Feature Set.

What if you call Logos, perhaps talk with another sales person, and ask him or her to run the numbers both ways? You could return what you bought and start over with Logos Now.

Pastor, Cornerstone Baptist Church, Clinton, SC

Posts 1549
Rick Ausdahl | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Aug 26 2016 8:42 PM

Bill Moore:

I don't think that's correct, Rick, if I understand what you're saying. I've run the scenarios for myself. If I purchase L7 Standard Gold, the price of the library by itself is less with Logos Now than is the library by itself in combination with the Full Feature Set.

What if you call Logos, perhaps talk with another sales person, and ask him or her to run the numbers both ways? You could return what you bought and start over with Logos Now.

Hi, Bill!  Thanks for your reply.

The portion of your reply that I underlined and italicized may explain why the sales person told me I wouldn't save anything now.  I.e.  Even if I become a member of LN, I still want to own the Full Feature set, whereas your scenario (if I understand it correctly) assumes the Full Feature set will be obtained via either LN membership or via purchase of the Full Feature set, but not both.  But based on the following bullet points from one of Faithlife's LN web pages, I assumed being a LN member would save me 25% on the cost of the Full Feature set and save me an additional 5% on the two libraries, in which case, the savings on the Feature set and the libraries would have offset part of the first year LN membership cost.  I.e.  I was anticipating the savings on the Feature set and libraries would have reduced my true first year LN membership cost to about $40 after factoring in the savings on the Feature set and the libraries.  But... I guess that's not the case.

From the LN Web site:

  • Always save at least 10% on Logos 7 Libraries
  • Always save at least 25% on Logos 7 Feature Sets
  • PLUS, Logos Now members save an additional 5% on top of our already great introductory discount
Posts 938
Bill Moore | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Aug 26 2016 9:02 PM

Rick Ausdahl:

Bill Moore:

I don't think that's correct, Rick, if I understand what you're saying. I've run the scenarios for myself. If I purchase L7 Standard Gold, the price of the library by itself is less with Logos Now than is the library by itself in combination with the Full Feature Set.

What if you call Logos, perhaps talk with another sales person, and ask him or her to run the numbers both ways? You could return what you bought and start over with Logos Now.

Hi, Bill!  Thanks for your reply.

The portion of your reply that I underlined and italicized may explain why the sales person told me I wouldn't save anything now.  I.e.  Even if I become a member of LN, I still want to own the Full Feature set, whereas your scenario (if I understand it correctly) assumes the Full Feature set will be obtained via either LN membership or via purchase of the Full Feature set, but not both.  But based on the following bullet points from one of Faithlife's LN web pages, I assumed being a LN member would save me 25% on the cost of the Full Feature set and save me an additional 5% on the two libraries, in which case, the savings on the Feature set and the libraries would have offset part of the first year LN membership cost.  I.e.  I was anticipating the savings on the Feature set and libraries would have reduced my true first year LN membership cost to about $40 after factoring in the savings on the Feature set and the libraries.  But... I guess that's not the case.

From the LN Web site:

  • Always save at least 10% on Logos 7 Libraries
  • Always save at least 25% on Logos 7 Feature Sets
  • PLUS, Logos Now members save an additional 5% on top of our already great introductory discount

Unless we're just talking past each other, Rick (and it's entirely possible that I am not rightly understanding what you're saying), I still think you would save by joining LN and then purchasing your libraries and the Full Feature Set, if indeed you want the FFS.

Have you seen Phil's Logos 7 Price and Discount Calculator? I plugged in the numbers pertaining to my situation:

Library + Feature Set

  • With Logos Now: $438.39
  • Without Logos Now: $464.18

It's not a great savings with what I'm buying, but if I wanted to buy Logos Now and then the Standard Gold plus the Feature Set, I would save $25.79, effectively reducing the cost of Logos Now to $64.20.

Pastor, Cornerstone Baptist Church, Clinton, SC

Posts 1549
Rick Ausdahl | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Aug 26 2016 9:08 PM

Bill Moore:

Rick Ausdahl:

Bill Moore:

I don't think that's correct, Rick, if I understand what you're saying. I've run the scenarios for myself. If I purchase L7 Standard Gold, the price of the library by itself is less with Logos Now than is the library by itself in combination with the Full Feature Set.

What if you call Logos, perhaps talk with another sales person, and ask him or her to run the numbers both ways? You could return what you bought and start over with Logos Now.

Hi, Bill!  Thanks for your reply.

The portion of your reply that I underlined and italicized may explain why the sales person told me I wouldn't save anything now.  I.e.  Even if I become a member of LN, I still want to own the Full Feature set, whereas your scenario (if I understand it correctly) assumes the Full Feature set will be obtained via either LN membership or via purchase of the Full Feature set, but not both.  But based on the following bullet points from one of Faithlife's LN web pages, I assumed being a LN member would save me 25% on the cost of the Full Feature set and save me an additional 5% on the two libraries, in which case, the savings on the Feature set and the libraries would have offset part of the first year LN membership cost.  I.e.  I was anticipating the savings on the Feature set and libraries would have reduced my true first year LN membership cost to about $40 after factoring in the savings on the Feature set and the libraries.  But... I guess that's not the case.

From the LN Web site:

  • Always save at least 10% on Logos 7 Libraries
  • Always save at least 25% on Logos 7 Feature Sets
  • PLUS, Logos Now members save an additional 5% on top of our already great introductory discount

Unless we're just talking past each other, Rick (and it's entirely possible that I am not rightly understanding what you're saying), I still think you would save by joining LN and then purchasing your libraries and the Full Feature Set, if indeed you want the FFS.

Have you seen Phil's Logos 7 Price and Discount Calculator? I plugged in the numbers pertaining to my situation:

Library + Feature Set

  • With Logos Now: $438.39
  • Without Logos Now: $464.18

It's not a great savings with what I'm buying, but if I wanted to buy Logos Now and then the Standard Gold plus the Feature Set, I would save $25.79, effectively reducing the cost of Logos Now to $64.20.

I don't think we're talking past each other.  In fact, what you just described seems to be exactly the type of scenario I'm facing.  I haven't seen the price and Discount Calculator, but I'll check it out.

Thanks!!!

Posts 938
Bill Moore | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Aug 26 2016 9:10 PM

You're most welcome, Rick. Please let us know how it turns out.

Pastor, Cornerstone Baptist Church, Clinton, SC

Posts 1549
Rick Ausdahl | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Aug 27 2016 7:12 AM

Bill Moore:

You're most welcome, Rick. Please let us know how it turns out.

Well, the process I had to follow was a bit convoluted since I've already made my purchase, but... prior to using the Price and Discount Calculator, I had guesstimated my net out-of-pocket cost for becoming a LN member would be about $45-$50 after factoring in the additional savings I thought it would give me on the Standard Silver and Pentecostal/Charismatic Bronze packages, which also automatically included the L7 Full Feature set.  Now after using the Price and Discount Calculator (but just for the Standard Silver package since the calculator is only set up to evaluate one package at a time), it looks like my net-out-of-pocket for becoming a LN member would be $44.75 after factoring in the package savings.  So if I'm using and interpreting the spreadsheet correctly, my original guesstimate was pretty close.

Here's a picture of the calculator spreadsheet for just the Standard Silver package.  After that is an explanation of how I calculated my package discounts, since I've already purchased the packages and the web site now shows me as already owning them (i.e. it no longer shows me what my discounts would be as it did prior to making my purchases.)

Since I have already purchased the packages, here's how I arrived at the discount values required by the spreadsheet.

  1. I signed out of Faithlife so the web site would not see what I already own.
  2. With the current 25% off special Faithlife is running, it showed a total cost of $899.99 for the Silver package ($495.00 for the library and $404.99 for the Full Feature set.)
  3. I subtracted the $343.70 I paid for the library to get the package discount amount that I plugged into the spreadsheet.
  4. I subtracted the $131.50 I paid for the feature set, to get the feature set discount amount that I plugged into the spreadsheet.
  5. I interpret the last cell value of -$44.75 to reflect what my net-out-of-pocket expense would be for the first year of LN membership.  I.e. a savings of -$44.75 means my first year of LN membership would cost me $44.75 (less any additional savings for the P&C Bronze package.)

Does that make sense?  Did I go about it right?

Posts 26588
Forum MVP
Dave Hooton | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Aug 27 2016 5:23 PM

Rick Ausdahl:
Does that make sense?  Did I go about it right?

No, because the "price after discounts" isn't the price you paid at 3. and 4.

Roughly for Library - actual discount would be $162

For FFS, start with $539.99 (the price for guests discounted by 10%)  and use  $393 as your discount.

Also change 'No' to 'Yes' as a LN member (else the calculator gives weird figures for Library).

For reverse engineering this seems consistent with my actual discounts and quoted prices on Silver.

Dave
===

Windows 10 & Android 8

Posts 938
Bill Moore | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Aug 27 2016 5:37 PM

Hi Rick. Sorry to be so late getting back. We're removing the popcorn ceiling in our house (one more Saturday to go!) and I just got cleaned up.

It's hard to know exactly how the discounts would have worked out for you from the beginning. Since you had owned L6 Gold, your dynamic pricing would have been different than how things worked out when you signed out of Logos and then used the figures for a new customer.

The only way to know for sure is to find a Logos employee who is customer service oriented enough to run the numbers for you. If nothing else, you could return the packages you bought and start over. Then you could use the Price and Discount Calculator and get a better idea, at least on one package.

I realize I've given no solid answer, but I don't want to lead you astray. The only thing I'm fairly sure about is that purchasing LN first will produce some savings, whether it's $15 or $40 or anything in between. Buying smaller packages such as we are doing will result in an obviously smaller monetary discount, but small discounts are relatively larger when the budget is small. Smile

Maybe one of our knowledgeable MVPs can give better direction.

Edit: I see that as I was thinking this through and composing a reply, Dave posted. We received the MVP help before we asked. Smile

Pastor, Cornerstone Baptist Church, Clinton, SC

Posts 1549
Rick Ausdahl | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Aug 27 2016 6:36 PM

Dave Hooton:

Rick Ausdahl:
Does that make sense?  Did I go about it right?

No, because the "price after discounts" isn't the price you paid at 3. and 4.

Roughly for Library - actual discount would be $162

For FFS, start with $539.99 (the price for guests discounted by 10%)  and use  $393 as your discount.

Also change 'No' to 'Yes' as a LN member (else the calculator gives weird figures for Library).

For reverse engineering this seems consistent with my actual discounts and quoted prices on Silver.

Dave, thanks for your reply.

Just to clarify though, the amounts I entered for 3. and 4. are not the amounts I "paid".  I understood the spreadsheet to be asking for my discount amount, not the price I paid, and that my discount would be calculated as follows:

The Full Price - What I paid = Discount asked for in lines 3. and 4.

Are you saying that lines 3. and 4. should actually be the price I paid, not the discount I calculated?

I guess I don't want anyone to spend much more time responding to this, because the actual savings I'll experience (if any) are not likely to be enough to warrant the time it will take for forum members to straighten me out.  Tongue Tied 

Posts 1549
Rick Ausdahl | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Aug 27 2016 6:43 PM

Bill Moore:

Hi Rick. Sorry to be so late getting back. We're removing the popcorn ceiling in our house (one more Saturday to go!) and I just got cleaned up.

It's hard to know exactly how the discounts would have worked out for you from the beginning. Since you had owned L6 Gold, your dynamic pricing would have been different than how things worked out when you signed out of Logos and then used the figures for a new customer.

The only way to know for sure is to find a Logos employee who is customer service oriented enough to run the numbers for you. If nothing else, you could return the packages you bought and start over. Then you could use the Price and Discount Calculator and get a better idea, at least on one package.

I realize I've given no solid answer, but I don't want to lead you astray. The only thing I'm fairly sure about is that purchasing LN first will produce some savings, whether it's $15 or $40 or anything in between. Buying smaller packages such as we are doing will result in an obviously smaller monetary discount, but small discounts are relatively larger when the budget is small. Smile

Maybe one of our knowledgeable MVPs can give better direction.

Edit: I see that as I was thinking this through and composing a reply, Dave posted. We received the MVP help before we asked. Smile

Bill, thanks again for chipping in.  I trust the popcorn-removal project went well.  Smile

I know it's probably more fun trying to straighten me out than to remove popcorn from the ceiling, but even more fun to actually be using Logos.  So as I mentioned to Dave, don't spend any more of your valuable time on this.  The sun will rise every day this week whether or not I spent a little more than I could/should have, so I'm ready/willing to let my question go unanswered.  Thanks again for your help!!!

Posts 938
Bill Moore | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Aug 27 2016 6:51 PM

Rick Ausdahl:

Bill, thanks again for chipping in.  I trust the popcorn-removal project went well.  Smile

I know it's probably more fun trying to straighten me out than to remove popcorn from the ceiling, but even more fun to be actually be using Logos.  So as I mentioned to Dave, don't spend any more of your valuable time on this.  The sun will rise every day this week whether or not I spent a little more than I could/should have, so I'm ready/willing to let my question go unanswered.  Thanks again for your help!!!

I've enjoyed interacting with you, Rick. It's certainly not a waste of my time. And I agree about the priority of actually using Logos than talking about it! Besides, there have been so many snarky comments in threads lately, unfortunately all too common with the release of a major update. I appreciate your kind spirit.

And, thanks, the popcorn ceiling removal is going well. A man in our church who is 6'10" and has done this is an unbelievable help, plus the project makes my wife happy. Her happiness is enough for me!

Pastor, Cornerstone Baptist Church, Clinton, SC

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