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This post has 156 Replies | 15 Followers

Posts 676
Kevin A Lewis | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, May 2 2018 1:44 AM

Hi Faithlife

Can we have some updates on the publication dates on the titles that are 'theoretically' published recently. i.e. yesterday or the day before.

Regards Kevin

Posts 676
Kevin A Lewis | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, May 3 2018 2:04 AM

Jake Mailhot:

Thanks all for your questions about the EEC.

We're working on a comprehensive update for the series, we should be able to share it soon.

The EEC website was recently retired and now EvangelicalExegeticalCommentary.com redirects to a landing page on LexhamPress.com. This landing page will be much easier to maintain.

'Easier' clearly doesn't mean it will be maintained - as we now have two past publication dates - with no titles delivered - and no revision to the publication dates.

This applies to the Logos store page for the series and the Lexham Press page.

Come on guys!

Shalom

Posts 221
André Kamphuis | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, May 3 2018 5:01 AM

Kevin A Lewis:
'Easier' clearly doesn't mean it will be maintained

Right. Despite all the good intentions expressed by Jake and others on the team, we are still as much in the dark about the EEC as we have been in the past few years.

I have decided to just lower my expectations and not get upset about Faithlife's ongoing struggle to seriously communicate with its customers who have paid upfront for an entire commentaries series that doesn't get delivered the way it was sold. It has been said enough, but it doesn't seem to make much difference in how they communicate... 

Posts 451
Nord Zootman | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, May 3 2018 7:12 AM

André Kamphuis:
I have decided to just lower my expectations and not get upset about Faithlife's ongoing struggle to seriously communicate with its customers who have paid upfront for an entire commentaries series that doesn't get delivered the way it was sold. It has been said enough, but it doesn't seem to make much difference in how they communicate.

Yes

Posts 72
LogosEmployee
Jake Mailhot | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, May 3 2018 11:34 AM

Here's what I just received from Derek:

  • Jeremiah: In Writing
  • Leviticus: In Writing
  • Galatians: In Writing
  • Daniel: In Review with Series Editors
  • Joshua: In Review with Series Editors
  • Ecclesiastes: In Writing
  • 1 & 2 Chronicles: In Review with Series Editors 

I'm not sure how far along the manuscripts are for those volumes still being written. For the volumes in review, the possibility of revisions could further delay them but they're closest to being published.

Posts 1791
Kenneth Neighoff | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, May 3 2018 1:19 PM

Thanks Jake for the update.

Posts 451
Nord Zootman | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, May 3 2018 2:44 PM

Thanks Jake

Posts 2951
Mattillo | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, May 3 2018 2:59 PM

Thank you Jake

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Jacob Hantla | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, May 3 2018 3:02 PM

Jake Mailhot:

Here's what I just received from Derek:

  • Jeremiah: In Writing
  • Leviticus: In Writing
  • Galatians: In Writing
  • Daniel: In Review with Series Editors
  • Joshua: In Review with Series Editors
  • Ecclesiastes: In Writing
  • 1 & 2 Chronicles: In Review with Series Editors 

I'm not sure how far along the manuscripts are for those volumes still being written. For the volumes in review, the possibility of revisions could further delay them but they're closest to being published.

Thanks, Jake for the update. I would way rather have a delay and a higher quality outcome. I've loved what we have gotten so far with EEC

Jacob Hantla
Pastor/Elder, Grace Bible Church
gbcaz.org

Posts 8758
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Bruce Dunning | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, May 3 2018 3:42 PM

Jacob Hantla:
I would way rather have a delay and a higher quality outcome.

I agree!

Using adventure and community to challenge young people to continually say "yes" to God

Posts 4823
doc | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, May 4 2018 4:07 AM

Bruce Dunning:

Jacob Hantla:
I would way rather have a delay and a higher quality outcome.

I agree!

Agreed.

Posts 1
NATHAN | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, May 10 2018 11:47 AM

Here's my beef... Every single one of these titles had a 2018 date attached to them 2-3 weeks ago.  AFTER the 30 day return policy expires for people who purchased during March Madness, the dates get removed and now they are "In Writing"--which according to Derek Brown is the first stage of the four stage process.  Do you understand how that looks to people?  Jeremiah should've never even had a 5/1/18 ship date if it was still in the first stage of production!  That was false information.  Plain and simple.  If 5/1/18 was ever a realistic date it should be further along in the production process than square one.  There was no update about this.  Please address this.

I love Lexham.  I think you do good work.  I understand you have a hard job.  I'm not a troll or your enemy.  But Lexham left concrete dates up during a HUGE sale indicating that these titles would be released soon (and in the cases of Jeremiah, Leviticus, and Amos almost immediately).  So people read the comments warning about problems with shipping and ignore them because Lexham seems to have fixed all the issues.  Now the dates are gone and Jeremiah which was supposed to ship 10 days ago is now back at the first stage of the process.  Same with Leviticus.  These were factors to people in the buying process.  Customer purchases.  31 days later: ALL dates get removed and every single commentary that was slated to ship soon is now back at the first stage of the production process (less Amos is allegedly coming 5/18/18) with no communcation about it from anyone.

I'm not mad.  I just want Lexham to get it together and avoid even the appearance of being dishonest.  I understand things happen.  But everything else on Logos has a reliable ship date.  Take for example Michael Heiser's book on Angels.  It ships 3Q 2018.  Now while no man knows the day or the hour I have confidence that it will ship sometime between July 1st and September 30th.  That's reasonable.

These are issues that I would appreciate Brannon and Derek addressing in the next update: 1) May release dates of Jeremiah and Leviticus being removed in favor of square one in the production process and 2) why were the concrete dates removed AFTER the 30 day refund period.  Not saying I want my money back... I just want them to address it because it looks shady.  It did not go unnoticed. "Set thine house in order."

Repsectfully,

Nathan

Posts 221
André Kamphuis | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, May 10 2018 1:23 PM

Jake Mailhot:

As part of our desire to share more about the progress of forthcoming EEC volumes, I want to give you a behind the scenes update for a few volumes. But first it may be helpful to give you a brief overview of the major stages of production that each of the EEC volumes goes through before it is shipped off to you. The four major stages of production:

1. In Writing: the author is researching and writing the commentary.
2. General Editing: an initial draft of the manuscript has been completed and sent to the general editors of the EEC. During this stage the general editors work closely with the authors to provide substantive feedback to help improve the commentary.
3. Manuscript Editing: after the general editors are satisfied with revisions from the author, the manuscript is handed off to the Lexham Press editorial team. They will clean up the manuscript and prepare it for publication.
4. Printing: once editorial for a manuscript is complete, we send it off to be built as a Logos edition and/or to the printer for print publication.

Wait… now all dates have been removed, and replaced by very insightful labels that show if a volume is in writing, or in review, or has a publication date.

The bad news is this: If you are waiting for a particular volume, your chances are slim to get it anytime soon. Galatians is the only commentary for the NT writing has started on, so that one might be out in 3-4 years from now, but for the rest the overall picture is really concerning….

Out of the 37 volumes that still need to be published, only 1 has a publication date, 3 are in review, and 4 are in writing. All the others, 29 commentaries in total, are not even in writing!

(Faithlife, please tell me I misunderstood the labels and a lot of researching and writing is happening on all these 29 volumes!)

 

Publication date (1): Amos & Jonah & Micah

In review (3): Joshua, 1&2 Chronicles, Daniel

In writing (4): Leviticus, Ecclesiastes, Jeremiah, Galatians

Not started yet (29): Genesis, Numbers, Deuteronomy, Judges/Ruth, 1&2 Kings, Job, Psalms, Proverbs, Isaiah, Ezekiel, Hosea/Joel/Obadiah, Nahum/Habakkuk/Zephaniah, Haggai/Zechariah/Malachi, Matthew, Mark, Luke, John, Acts, Romans, 1 Corinthians, 2 Corinthians, Colossians, 1&2 Thessalonians, 1&2 Timothy/Titus, Hebrews, James, 1 Peter, 2 Peter, Revelation.

Knowing that writing and publishing an academic commentary can take many years…  is this just the announcement of the death of the EEC as a series? (serious question!)

Faithlife sold this whole series with literally this advertisement: ““The entire 44-volume set will be available in 2019—an unprecedented publication timetable for a commentary of this magnitude.”  Many people pre-paid for the entire series. Right now, 2018, no work has started on the great majority of commentaries.

Customers don’t complain about the published volumes (they’re quite good!), they understand delays in writer’s schedules. But is this not beyond acceptable?

 

Posts 209
Jim Erwin | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, May 10 2018 1:57 PM

This is not just a Lexham Press issue. This is system-wide with Logos. I have a Lexham Bible Guide for Ruth (Logos Edition) that has been under contract since April 7, 2017. I realize that this can happen with Pre-Pubs. But the fact remains that Logos advertises to get customers onboard and then they delay production for various reasons. 

Frankly, the EEC rollout has been upsetting. If I had committed to purchasing the entire set upfront without the set complete, I would have been seriously disappointed.

This happened with the Teach the Text Commentary set by Baker Publishing. But that was because the publishing company ended the series incomplete. That probably can't be helped. But Faithlife should provide complete series when possible. 

I have decided to buy only what I need when I need it, and then get a great deal when it comes along. If you are needing a product, and they advertise that it will soon be available, you should not have to get your hopes up. But I have to work under the assumption that things will be delayed. 

Faithlife has great products and I will keep purchasing them. But I won't commit to products that look like they have a long-term production.  

http://www.patheos.com/blogs/jimerwin/ - a postmodern pastor in a digital world

Posts 72
LogosEmployee
Jake Mailhot | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, May 10 2018 2:24 PM

André,

When we updated the product page with the new publication status updates, we removed all of the estimated release dates (as we said we would). For the volumes that we don't have any concrete update for (as provided by Derek), we did not include a publication status at all. This does not mean that they are not currently being worked on. I can assure you that there are more than just four volumes currently in the writing stage. When I have more concrete details for these volumes, I will update the product page and post here on this forum thread. But I'm hesitant to assume anything until I have those details in hand from Derek.

Posts 221
André Kamphuis | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, May 10 2018 10:33 PM

Jake Mailhot:
This does not mean that they are not currently being worked on. I can assure you that there are more than just four volumes currently in the writing stage.

Glad to hear this, Jake. Looking forward to a more comprehensive update. 

I recall you said in march:

Jake Mailhot:
As for a comprehensive update, I'm working on collecting those details--many of them have been difficult to track down. I should have more to share later this week or early next week. Thanks.
 

I assumed that the latest update to the product page was the comprehensive update. Good to hear you're still getting ready to get the accurate information out for the whole series (not just for a couple volumes). It's much needed. Removing inaccurate information without providing accurate information isn't all that helpful at this point. 

Posts 5221
Dan Francis | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, May 11 2018 9:35 AM

André Kamphuis:
Faithlife sold this whole series with literally this advertisement: ““The entire 44-volume set will be available in 2019—an unprecedented publication timetable for a commentary of this magnitude.”  Many people pre-paid for the entire series. Right now, 2018, no work has started on the great majority of commentaries.

IT  is truly sad that by now the majority of the volumes are not out but I believe it was a naivety of the complexities of publishing and not a willful deception. We have been made aware in the last couple of years that it will move beyond that date. It is truly sad though that we don't have a more tentative date... Although I realize if they said "Going well all volumes should be released by fall 2024", come January 2025 with 10 volumes yet to be released you would have people upset again, so I can see why no new set completion date is out there, but it is a sad thing to see 2019 turn into a nebulous completion that feels we may never reach.

-dan

Posts 9852
Denise | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, May 11 2018 10:14 AM

Dan Francis:

IT  is truly sad that by now the majority of the volumes are not out but I believe it was a naivety of the complexities of publishing and not a willful deception. 

I don't have a dog in this hunt. But if memory serves, Logos wanted folks to sign up for the whole thing, with the promise of shizam! That sounds not accidental or naive.

- Wasn't the project already iffy, when they came to Logos? And credit due, Bob could have simply shrugged.

- An academic commentary limited to a high-end software platform was warning enough.

- I'd assume, given the equation, each produced volume is 'thank your lucky stars'. The odds were never favorable.


Posts 172
Matt Hamrick | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, May 11 2018 3:51 PM

Denise:

Dan Francis:

IT  is truly sad that by now the majority of the volumes are not out but I believe it was a naivety of the complexities of publishing and not a willful deception. 

I don't have a dog in this hunt. But if memory serves, Logos wanted folks to sign up for the whole thing, with the promise of shizam! That sounds not accidental or naive.

- Wasn't the project already iffy, when they came to Logos? And credit due, Bob could have simply shrugged.

- An academic commentary limited to a high-end software platform was warning enough.

- I'd assume, given the equation, each produced volume is 'thank your lucky stars'. The odds were never favorable.

It's not the fact the series will now be completed years after it was promised, it's the fact that through it all the lack of information about what is going on with it never arrived, and we still have a problem getting information about it.

Posts 4823
doc | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, May 11 2018 9:06 PM

Matt Hamrick:
It's not the fact the series will now be completed years after it was promised, it's the fact that through it all the lack of information about what is going on with it never arrived, and we still have a problem getting information about it.

Totally agree Matt, from the outset I never expected the timeline presented to be met. I am not upset by the delay's.  Writing a commentary is big project and I'd rather extra time be taken if required than have a rushed product.

The issue is the lack of clear open communication from Faithlife...but that's something I have been saying for many years. They just don't get it because they are too busy chasing their next big idea to take the care and consideration to do communication well.

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