Bug: Hits in BWS and Bible Search does not agree

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LimJK | Forum Activity | Posted: Thu, Jan 26 2017 12:56 AM

Hi Logos,

I discovered that the number of hits for <Lemma = lbs/el/ἰδού>  does not agree between Bible Word Study Guide (187) and Bible Search (200).

JK

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MJ. Smith | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Jan 26 2017 2:22 AM

If you save both as passage lists then do a diff merge, you should be able to identify why there is a difference.

Orthodox Bishop Hilarion Alfeyev: "To be a theologian means to have experience of a personal encounter with God through prayer and worship."

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Graham Criddle | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Jan 26 2017 3:11 AM

LimJK:
I discovered that the number of hits for <Lemma = lbs/el/ἰδού>  does not agree between Bible Word Study Guide (187) and Bible Search (200).

I think its because the BWS is showing results for words which are explicitly translated

When I do the same for the NIV I get 101 results in BWS and 200 in NIV - the differences seem to be related to the NIV not showing an English translation for the word

I don't understand why you get a different count in the Lemma section and the Translation section in the BWS

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LimJK | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Jan 26 2017 4:45 AM

MJ and Graham,

Thanks for responding to the Chinese Forum and keeping me company ... I was feeling a little lonely here Smile

In another thread, I was trying find out what is the underlining Original Language Text(s) used for the CUV RVI ... I have not got an answer yet, which might be one answer to the problem I am reporting here.

Based on the BWS translation ring, in the search on the right, I identified that there are 93 "no equivalent" or "un-translated" <Lemma = lbs/el/ἰδού> in CUV RVI in the Bible search.

In the Bible Word Study Guide, under the Lemma section, we have 187 hits, if I minus the 81 featured in the translation ring section I should get 106 "no equivalent" or "un-translated" in CUV RVI.  

So the numbers 93 is not equal to 106 ... does not add up Sad Bug!

JK

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LimJK | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Jan 26 2017 8:38 AM

Graham Criddle:

I don't understand why you get a different count in the Lemma section and the Translation section in the BWS

Graham,

I switched my Logos from Chinese to English and run the same scenario with NIV. Note that Hits under Lemma section is 187, and Hits in the Translation Wheel Section is 101. difference reflect that those <Lemma = lbs/el/ἰδού> that was not translated in NIV.

Nonetheless, we still have a problem, where BWS has 187 hits and Bible Search has 200 hits in NIV.

Hopefully someone in Logos can enlighten us, if it is a bug? 

JK

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Graham Criddle | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Jan 26 2017 8:51 AM

LimJK:
I switched my Logos from Chinese to English and run the same scenario with NIV. Note that Hits under Lemma section is 187, and Hits in the Translation Wheel Section is 101. difference reflect that those <Lemma = lbs/el/ἰδού> that was not translated in NIV.

That's the thing that confuses me - as per my screenshot above I get 101 for both.

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Isaiah | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Jan 26 2017 10:59 AM

LimJK, et al.

The number in the spark graph at the top of the Bible Word Study (BWS) pane is drawn from the reverse interlinear of your preferred Bible translationFurthermore, the BWS count does not include any alignments to nothing (i.e. bullet points in the translation, meaning the original text word was translated into the target language).

(Click this link to open a tutorial in Logos that explains how to do this: https://ref.ly/logosres/logos4help;hw=Choose_Preferred_Bible.)

Those two factors contribute to the reason that the numbers are different.

I'll be sure to link this forum post in the open case we have for this.

Hope that helps!

Isaiah

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Graham Criddle | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Jan 26 2017 1:26 PM

Thanks Isaiah

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LimJK | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Jan 26 2017 5:27 PM

Isaiah M. Hoogendyk:

The number in the spark graph at the top of the Bible Word Study (BWS) pane is drawn from the reverse interlinear of your preferred Bible translationFurthermore, the BWS count does not include any alignments to nothing (i.e. bullet points in the translation, meaning the original text word was translated into the target language).

Those two factors contribute to the reason that the numbers are different.

I'll be sure to link this forum post in the open case we have for this.

Isaiah,

Thanks so much for your reply to explain the reason for the different number in the spark graph for BWS and Bible Search Smile My default preferred Bible is ESV.

Is the open case you mentioned, intended to have the number in the spark graph computed in Lemma Section to based on the same RVI Bible selected under the Translation section? Thanks for considering that Smile

JK

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MJ. Smith | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Jan 26 2017 6:08 PM

LimJK:
computed in Lemma Section to based on the same RVI Bible selected under the Translation section?

er .. ah ... the later is a user option I would hate to lose.

Orthodox Bishop Hilarion Alfeyev: "To be a theologian means to have experience of a personal encounter with God through prayer and worship."

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LimJK | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Jan 26 2017 10:09 PM

MJ,

Certainly, that option should stay Smile May be if Logos can consider providing the same setting option under the Lemma section Wink

JK

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LimJK | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Jan 26 2017 10:34 PM

MJ,

May be another alternative is to have the translation wheel include a segment for words in Original Language Text that are not translated.  There is a precedent of doing that in Septuagint.

See my post couple of days ago http://community.logos.com/forums/t/135098.aspx 

JK

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MJ. Smith | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Jan 27 2017 1:54 AM

My solution is simply not to expect sections that focus on the original language to match sections that focus on the translation. Why not? Because the various translations do not use the same original language text.

Orthodox Bishop Hilarion Alfeyev: "To be a theologian means to have experience of a personal encounter with God through prayer and worship."

Posts 1002
LimJK | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Jan 29 2017 6:34 PM

LimJK:

Hi,

May I know if there is an easy way to search for <Lemma = lbs/el/ἰδού> in NT where it is not being translated like those with "." in the screen shot above.  Thanks.

JK

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Sophie Miller | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Feb 13 2017 4:37 AM

I'm new and I'm interested in this topic. Thank you!

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