I bought Collector's first...

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This post has 103 Replies | 4 Followers

Posts 44
aboutthelord | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Jul 4 2017 9:11 AM

good idea! 

Blessed Be Your Name O God!

Posts 1966
Joseph Turner | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Jul 4 2017 9:55 AM

matt wilkes:

Joseph Turner:

aboutthelord:

So you saying I should stick with it? Or downgrade? I am taking votes

You really have to answer the questions first before anyone could even begin to help you answer that question.

1.  What, if anything, is in Collector's that you cannot live without?

2.  What resources or types of resources can you put your finger (or mouse) on and say that they are must haves?

I really don't know but look at this...

If you buy Platinum, then you will get a deep discount on Lutheran Portfolio, which includes Anchor, ICC, TDNT, as well as a small part of the Eerdmans Bible Reference Bundle.  You could then get the TDOT if you must, but I don't think I would given what you have said, I would also skip Black's and EEC, and either leave it at that, or get NICOT/NT instead, which again is on sale right now for around the cost of those two sets, and it is much more complete, if not complete.

Make sure you don't buy on the website, because I don't think it will take into account the discounts involved in purchasing the multiple base packages.  You would have to do it through a rep. It may be the the cost comes out similar to Collector's edition, but with what you have above, this would be the best way to do it as far as I can see.

Disclaimer:  I hate using messaging, texting, and email for real communication.  If anything that I type to you seems like anything other than humble and respectful, then I have not done a good job typing my thoughts.

Posts 5248
Dan Francis | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Jul 4 2017 9:57 AM

About I am in a similar position to you I do not own collector nor am I likely to purchase it I have in the past purchased cornerstone 6 (top catholic at the time equivalent to platinum ) Lutheran gold 6,  Orthodox gold 6, and currently have Anglican Portfolio 7. One thing no package offers that I have time and time again found to be my primary resource is New Interpreter’s Bible (12 vols.) Now it and Word Biblical commentary  do tend to be my primary goto commentaries I branch out from. Now I don't know which package is going to be right for you but I do think you will find benefit in the NIB I have used it intently for 20 years and find value in it still. Indeed it is the only physical commentary in complete I have remaining in my physical library.

-dan

Posts 1417
Wild Eagle | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Jul 4 2017 10:54 AM

aboutthelord:

... I really don't even know how much i need, AYBC, ICC, Hermeneia, Word Biblical, NAC, NICOT/NICNT, etc. (the last 3 i don't have yet) All I know is that I want to be more knowledgeable about Biblical truth and be able to teach and research when i am asked something i don't know or understand. I can make these payments but I don't know if I should have went this far up... 

So basically I feel I should have just went with Platinum with no additions and be happy. I am not a scholar or Ph.D ( I have an Associates in Communications Electronics and Work on F-15 Radar), and i really don't understand why scholars need one resource and us laypeople need more "watered down" tools (at least it seems that way if you read all of the Forums about who should buy which package...) According to all the reviewers, I should buy Bronze or Gold...

Any constructive criticism, I have til the 19th of July to change my base package.... 

First I used to think that I dont need "watered down" tools, but based on my studies I often go to commentaries who might not even be even Christians, to see "outsiders" point of view. Some passages need just textual interpretation and sometimes I feel like evangelicals put their meaning based on their belief instead of what actual text is. Example: check Psalm 82 with Evangelical commentaries and with "liberal" ones and see the difference. Without any theological assumptions draw your own conclusion what actually the text in the context is. Hope that helps

"No man is greater than his prayer life. The pastor who is not praying is playing; the people who are not praying are straying." Leonard Ravenhill 

Posts 44
aboutthelord | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Jul 4 2017 11:18 AM

When i said watered down, I meant that is the way it seems listening to reviewers. They seem to say, "why buy a commentary of a commentary". Meaning why by Commentary A when they got most of their info from Commentaries B & C...

Blessed Be Your Name O God!

Posts 9075
Forum MVP
Mark Smith | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Jul 4 2017 11:59 AM

You want to better understand the Bible. Great. You bought a tons of books hoping that would help. Not so great.

Better knowledge of the Bible comes from studying it, not studying books about it. You can benefit from tools that help you understand the Bible, but that doesn't have to cost a fortune, and doesn't have to take you away from studying the Bible itself.

So:

First, do yourself a favor and return the Collector's Edition. Why buy what Faithlife wants to bundle together, rather than what you actually need?

Second, buy no higher than the Platinum edition (I'd stop at Gold) and use it for a number of months doing research, then decide what sort of resources you need to have in greater depth. For most serious study at some point you need a good Bible dictionary. AYBD is the best, but there are some other options. ISBE, Revised is perhaps the best of the next tier down. 

Third, you will want a few good commentaries, but for one reason or another you will probably be disappointed in AYBC, Hermeneia, much of the ICC, and a good bit of the Word commentary. You will be better served with NAC, Tyndale, Pillar, Baker Exegetical, Black's, and NICOT/NICNT (and some others). These are accessible, mid-level commentaries that will not bog you down in too much technical information but will help you understand the text and, in at least some of them, interact with the current dialog about scripture interpretation. I have lots of commentaries including the ones I don't recommend for you, and many of them go unused. BTW: you don't need all the Classic Commentary groups Faithlife has produced but loves to put in the larger collections.

Fourth, choose monographs that help you with questions you have. Don't get a bunch that have sophisticated scholarly titles that you know nothing about. Ask here when the time comes and you can get some good advise on almost any subject.

So, save your money until you know what you need. Take your time to assemble a library that you can use and that answers questions you are dealing with.

 

Pastor, North Park Baptist Church

Bridgeport, CT USA

Posts 650
Kiyah | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Jul 4 2017 12:00 PM

What about stacking base packages? You would have to buy them in separate orders since you can't have more than one base package in your cart at a time. You could call customer service and have them combined into one payment plan.

Take a look at combining the Lutheran Portfolio package and the Standard Diamond package.  The Lutheran Portfolio package is jam-packed with great commentary series like the AYB, ICC, Hermeneia, Interpretation, ITC, etc. The Standard Diamond package would round out the commentaries, reference works, and journals that Lutheran Portfolio is missing. You would probably still come out cheaper than getting Collector's.

If you're still looking to spend more money after that you can donate to a poor seminarian's Logos collection. I have the perfect seminarian in mind Wink

Posts 1599
Ken McGuire | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Jul 4 2017 12:38 PM

matt wilkes:
I need to look at Lutheran, honestly don't even fully know what Lutheran is (embarrassing).

The denominational landscape is a bit complicated, so no real reason to be embarrassed. When Martin Luther brought forward his ideas about how to refocus the Church in the 16th century, his followers were called "Lutherans". We eventually accepted the label. Our vision of this refocused church is on the Good news of Jesus (the Gospel) and the Sacraments Jesus gave us.

All of this could be expanded upon greatly, but as it is, I am stretching the forum rules. There are many places where theological discussion would be on topic...

With regards to the original poster, you have been given various gifts by our Lord and get to be the wisest steward of those gifts. Logos packages can be addicting to some of us - and so a real temptation is to spend more than you should wisely. Some of the reason for different levels is because different people have different levels of understanding of original languages and the technical jargon of the field. Only you can really decide in prayerful consideration what is the wisest way to be the steward of the mysteries of God... I would suggest that you take a look at some of the sample pages provided on the Logos pages to see if it would be useful or even understandable to you now. Of course, this may change farther on the road. And while some specials are better than others, there will be other special sales from Logos....

The Gospel is not ... a "new law," on the contrary, ... a "new life." - William Julius Mann

Posts 44
aboutthelord | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Jul 4 2017 12:47 PM

Mark Smith:

You want to better understand the Bible. Great. You bought a tons of books hoping that would help. Not so great.

Better knowledge of the Bible comes from studying it, not studying books about it. You can benefit from tools that help you understand the Bible, but that doesn't have to cost a fortune, and doesn't have to take you away from studying the Bible itself.

So:

First, do yourself a favor and return the Collector's Edition. Why buy what Faithlife wants to bundle together, rather than what you actually need?

Second, buy no higher than the Platinum edition (I'd stop at Gold) and use it for a number of months doing research, then decide what sort of resources you need to have in greater depth. For most serious study at some point you need a good Bible dictionary. AYBD is the best, but there are some other options. ISBE, Revised is perhaps the best of the next tier down. 

Third, you will want a few good commentaries, but for one reason or another you will probably be disappointed in AYBC, Hermeneia, much of the ICC, and a good bit of the Word commentary. You will be better served with NAC, Tyndale, Pillar, Baker Exegetical, Black's, and NICOT/NICNT (and some others). These are accessible, mid-level commentaries that will not bog you down in too much technical information but will help you understand the text and, in at least some of them, interact with the current dialog about scripture interpretation. I have lots of commentaries including the ones I don't recommend for you, and many of them go unused. BTW: you don't need all the Classic Commentary groups Faithlife has produced but loves to put in the larger collections.

Fourth, choose monographs that help you with questions you have. Don't get a bunch that have sophisticated scholarly titles that you know nothing about. Ask here when the time comes and you can get some good advise on almost any subject.

So, save your money until you know what you need. Take your time to assemble a library that you can use and that answers questions you are dealing with.

 

For some reason I feel the Lord on what you said. All of you are really helping me with this journey! but Mark, I think you nailed it for me... NAC is in Baptist gold so I could add that to platinum and add NICOT/NT since it is on sale... That should do me for a while. and add Logos Now to get some cool features and web app....

Blessed Be Your Name O God!

Posts 44
aboutthelord | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Jul 4 2017 12:51 PM

Kiyah:

What about stacking base packages? You would have to buy them in separate orders since you can't have more than one base package in your cart at a time. You could call customer service and have them combined into one payment plan.

Take a look at combining the Lutheran Portfolio package and the Standard Diamond package.  The Lutheran Portfolio package is jam-packed with great commentary series like the AYB, ICC, Hermeneia, Interpretation, ITC, etc. The Standard Diamond package would round out the commentaries, reference works, and journals that Lutheran Portfolio is missing. You would probably still come out cheaper than getting Collector's.

If you're still looking to spend more money after that you can donate to a poor seminarian's Logos collection. I have the perfect seminarian in mind Wink

I think we are all too greedy to share our Logos money ;) I have just lost my mind and I need someone to help me find it :)

Blessed Be Your Name O God!

Posts 492
Richard Villanueva | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Jul 4 2017 2:07 PM

aboutthelord:
but Mark, I think you nailed it for me...

Yes Mark knows his stuff!

aboutthelord:
add Logos Now to get some cool features and web app....

As of July 1st everyone who has purchased a Logos 7 Base Package gets the Web App included.  It's not a Logos Now exclusive anymore.

MBPro'12 / i5 / 8GB // 3.0 Scholars (Purple) / L6 & L7 Platinum, M&E Platinum, Anglican Bronze, P&C Silver / L8 Platinum, Academic Pro

Posts 44
aboutthelord | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Jul 4 2017 2:14 PM

Richard Villanueva:
As of July 1st everyone who has purchased a Logos 7 Base Package gets the Web App included.  It's not a Logos Now exclusive anymore.

That is AWESOME!!! I just tried it... Maybe I can access it on Base... (during lunch of course)

Blessed Be Your Name O God!

Posts 852
Michael McLane | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Jul 4 2017 3:27 PM

I agree with Mark. I do not think it is a good idea to financially extend yourself to the point of feeling uncomfortable about it. Logos resources can easily become a desire of the eyes if one is not careful. You will use the tools more than all the resources.

What about the Cloud version? Is that still around and is it a good way to test out all resources? Or does it not contain the high dollar ones?

Posts 44
aboutthelord | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Jul 4 2017 4:04 PM

Michael McLane:

I agree with Mark. I do not think it is a good idea to financially extend yourself to the point of feeling uncomfortable about it. Logos resources can easily become a desire of the eyes if one is not careful. You will use the tools more than all the resources.

What about the Cloud version? Is that still around and is it a good way to test out all resources? Or does it not contain the high dollar ones?

the cloud option doesn't seem like a good deal to me... but I will look more into it. I would rather own it personally. I agree about the money though, I may be extending myself too far... if they would have done 24 months I wouldn't have even started this discussion because I would be under $400 a month and i am much more comfortable there.

Blessed Be Your Name O God!

Posts 13342
Forum MVP
Mark Barnes | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Jul 4 2017 4:44 PM

Even if you have a Collectors' sized budget, it's very doubtful that Collectors will be right for you.

Given your large budget, I'd suggest Baptist Portfolio as hitting a particular sweet-spot. It contains a large number of evangelical commentaries that are not too technical, but not to simple, including NAC, Mentor, College Press, Focus on the Bible, Cornerstone, Life Application, IVP NT, Wiersbe and Welwyn, Lexham Bible Guide, Lloyd-Jones on Ephesians, Holman NT, Opening Up, plus the Early Church Fathers. Judging by your comments, these are exactly the right sort of commentaries for your needs — certainly much more appropriate than  AYBC, Hermenia, and most of Word/ICC. You'll also get some decent lexicons (including BDAG and TDNT) and dictionaries and a few systematic theologies.

If you still want more, Gold will be a good buy (do it in a separate purchase or through a sales rep, as it will be heavily discounted because you'll already own much of the material). You can still do it on a payment plan if you speak to the sales team. That will give you NIGTC, Pillar, New Daily Study Bible, Tyndale Commentaries, AYBD, BST NT commentaries.

Still more? Anglican Starter includes some NT Wright and John Stott and will probably be very cheap by this stage. So will Methodist & Wesleyan Starter which includes the Socio-Rhetorical commentary.

Any yet more? Reformed Silver will include Calvin's Commentaries and Institutes.

I doubt there's much in Lutheran, Othodox, SDA or Verbum that will appeal. And you'll probably have most of the really good stuff from Pentecostal/Charismatic by now.

If you want more technical commentaries in addition, you'll need to buy NICOT/NICNT, or Baker Exegetical — neither of which are in base packages any longer.

With all of that, compared to Collectors, the only important evangelical resources you'll be missing would be the few decent ICC volumes there are, and the black IVP dictionaries.

So, to summarise, in your position, with a Collector's sized budget, I'd be buying:

  • Baptist Portfolio ($4,500)
  • Gold (estimated at $450)
  • Anglican Starter (estimated at $100)
  • Methodist & Wesleyan Starter (estimated at $75)
  • Reformed Silver (estimated at $300)
  • NICOT/NICNT ($1,305)
  • Baker Exegetical ($849)
  • IVP dictionaries ($329)

It's impossible to know just how much that will cost, so my numbers are just guesses (my guess totals just under $8,000), but I'd be fairly confident that it would be cheaper than Collectors — and much better value. A sales rep would be able to confirm the price before you purchase.

Posts 492
Richard Villanueva | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Jul 4 2017 4:52 PM

Mark-your post makes me miss your expert buying guides!! They were superb. I have a couple pastor-friends that are considering joinong the Logos crowd, so I'll share this with them as well. (Not tying to hijack the thread, just saying this is a great synopsis.)

MBPro'12 / i5 / 8GB // 3.0 Scholars (Purple) / L6 & L7 Platinum, M&E Platinum, Anglican Bronze, P&C Silver / L8 Platinum, Academic Pro

Posts 650
Kiyah | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Jul 4 2017 5:28 PM

Richard Villanueva:

Mark-your post makes me miss your expert buying guides!! They were superb. I have a couple pastor-friends that are considering joinong the Logos crowd, so I'll share this with them as well. (Not tying to hijack the thread, just saying this is a great synopsis.)

Yes, Mark definitely dropped the mic on that one.

Posts 3189
Forum MVP
PetahChristian | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Jul 4 2017 5:53 PM

aboutthelord:
That should do me for a while. and add Logos Now to get some cool features and web app....

I don't mean to oversimplify this, as LN offers a lot of different benefits, but if you bought a feature set already and you also subscribe to Logos Now, there's some overlap in the sense that you both own the features and are renting (subscribing to) the features.

There's nothing that says you can't both buy and rent as long as you are aware of it.

Posts 44
aboutthelord | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Jul 4 2017 8:28 PM

Well now that I know everyone gets web app I am not getting Logos Now. I bought the extended feature set.

Blessed Be Your Name O God!

Posts 44
aboutthelord | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Jul 4 2017 8:43 PM

Mark Barnes:
much more appropriate than  AYBC, Hermenia, and most of Word/ICC. You'll also get some decent lexicons (including BDAG and TDNT) and dictionaries and a few systematic theologies.

can you expand on that? Are saying I shouldn't ever have these? I really like your plan but I am curious about that particular statement. And what do you think about Eerdmans 309?

Blessed Be Your Name O God!

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