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Phil Gons (Faithlife) | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Feb 24 2018 2:47 PM

Dave Hooton:

Phil Gons (Faithlife):
But buying the L8 FFS will cost less than buying the L7 FFS and then upgrading to the L8 FFS.

Is that true in every case, though?  Are you assuming that the buyer owns NO features from prior versions of Logos?

It should be true in every case, all else being equal, regardless of whether a customer owns no, some, or all pre-Logos 7 features, datasets, etc.

Posts 247
Gary Osborne | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Feb 24 2018 2:58 PM

I too have turned off the auto-renew.  I actually have my Logos Now subscription until the very last day of the year.  I'll hold off buying the L7 FFS for now as I assume I'll probably have almost 2 months to see what L8 will look like before I have to make a decision.  My biggest frustration is that Bob's explanations about less books being bought are only true - at least for me - because the theological offerings that I'm most interested in have taken a huge nose-dive over the last several years.  As a conservative Pentecostal (A/G background) I have begged and begged Faithlife to offer the one basic resource (Full Life Study Bible, now called the Fire Bible) I use more than anything else and they've yet to do so even though it's been offered for Y-E-A-R-S by two other Bible software companies.  I've invested a lot of money in this product over many, many years but feel like I've been abandoned by them on the most basic of levels.

Posts 20
Sojourner | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Feb 24 2018 5:01 PM

I second you, Gary. Unlike you, I am very new to Logos. I love the software, but have been frustrated by the lack of theological resources within the Pentecostal side as I started digging into what I will one day buy. I do appreciate books by Amos Yong, though I wish there was more of his. (I am saving up to buy the books.) But lacking something as basic as the Fire Bible is crazy. As I'm still young here, I am still holding out that things will improve.

Posts 17909
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Keep Smiling 4 Jesus :) | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Feb 24 2018 5:30 PM

Matthew Cillo:
... lacking something as basic as the Fire Bible is crazy.

+1 Yes dreaming and praying for 2012 Fire Bible by Hendrickson Publishers (previously Full Life Study Bible by Donald Stamps)

Searching Logos.com for Spirit filled => https://www.logos.com/products/search?q=spirit+filled&start=0&sort=rel&pageSize=60 has 475 results (smallish subset of resources), which include Spirit Filled Study Bibles by Jack Hayford

2002 => New Spirit-Filled Life Bible

1997 => Spirit-Filled Life Study Bible

Keep Smiling Smile

Posts 228
Graham Owen | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Mar 2 2018 3:33 AM

Kevin A. Purcell:

Just turned of the auto renew. If we all do that I think they'll get the idea and maybe reconsider. Before this I was a happy Logos Now subscriber. Now, I have a very bad taste in my mouth regarding this company.

Great suggestion, just did the same.

Based on experience I'm sure that this will work out alright in the end I just don't know why every time Faith Life make a change like this it is so painful. While polling us all might not be an option talking to a few of the users here to gauge how things might be received and perceived would make a lot of sense.

It was the same when they introduced Logos Now it took me weeks to figure out what would be the best approach for me. Seems I was wrong but in fairness when 8 comes out I'm expecting the discount coupon to offset the additional cost involved in going back to being a fully fledged desktop user.

Bad news is that we have been here before ("bad taste in my mouth"), good news is Faith Life have a history of doing the right thing, sad truth is that we'll probably end up going through this again.

Posts 228
Graham Owen | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Mar 2 2018 3:38 AM

Gary Osborne:
As a conservative Pentecostal (A/G background) I have begged and begged Faithlife to offer the one basic resource (Full Life Study Bible, now called the Fire Bible)

I'm Church of God and what bothers me most is the mislabelling of resources as Pentecostal.

Posts 247
Gary Osborne | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Mar 2 2018 7:30 AM

Graham Owen:

I'm Church of God and what bothers me most is the mislabelling of resources as Pentecostal.

I won't disagree with you on that one either.  A lot of resources are being labeled Pentecostal when they should be labeled Charismatic (and yes, there's a pretty big difference).    

Posts 20
Sojourner | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Mar 2 2018 8:32 AM

Gary Osborne:
A lot of resources are being labeled Pentecostal when they should be labeled Charismatic

Wait. There's a way to see the labels for them? In the store or in Logos? I don't know of any way to identify the traditions within Logos. Within the store, I know I can click on Pentecostal/Charismatic, but is there a way to see the labels you are describing? 

Or is this just an issue with the P/C groups being bundled together?

Posts 247
Gary Osborne | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Mar 2 2018 11:03 AM

Matthew Cillo:

Gary Osborne:
A lot of resources are being labeled Pentecostal when they should be labeled Charismatic

Wait. There's a way to see the labels for them? In the store or in Logos? I don't know of any way to identify the traditions within Logos. Within the store, I know I can click on Pentecostal/Charismatic, but is there a way to see the labels you are describing? 

Or is this just an issue with the P/C groups being bundled together?

I just meant that you can see them in the store.  If there's a labeling in our libraries after they are downloaded, I'm not aware of it.  The fact is some of the material that is put into the P/C grouping is also in other tradition groupings (like Wesleyan, for instance).

Posts 20
Sojourner | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Mar 2 2018 11:58 AM

Gary Osborne:

I just meant that you can see them in the store.  If there's a labeling in our libraries after they are downloaded, I'm not aware of it.  The fact is some of the material that is put into the P/C grouping is also in other tradition groupings (like Wesleyan, for instance).

Ok. Thanks. And yes, I agree though sometimes it is appropriate, if the author had both traditions, for example, and approached the subject with both traditions. That should be fairly rare though. Yet, then you have authors like Ben Witherington III... whose books are split between them (M/W and P/C) in such an odd way on top of it all. I do not understand how the labeling decisions are made.

As this seems just a bit off topic, I'm just going to drop it.

Posts 17909
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Keep Smiling 4 Jesus :) | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Mar 2 2018 12:59 PM

Sean McIntyre:
I paid for a year of 'Logos Now' in advance. You can't transfer me, it's a different product and not what I paid for.

Thankful for Bob Pritchett's => Announcement: Logos Now to continue at same price (with new name) 

Keep Smiling Smile

Posts 228
Graham Owen | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Mar 3 2018 4:01 AM

Gary Osborne:

Matthew Cillo:

Gary Osborne:
A lot of resources are being labeled Pentecostal when they should be labeled Charismatic

Wait. There's a way to see the labels for them? In the store or in Logos? I don't know of any way to identify the traditions within Logos. Within the store, I know I can click on Pentecostal/Charismatic, but is there a way to see the labels you are describing? 

Or is this just an issue with the P/C groups being bundled together?

I just meant that you can see them in the store.  If there's a labeling in our libraries after they are downloaded, I'm not aware of it.  The fact is some of the material that is put into the P/C grouping is also in other tradition groupings (like Wesleyan, for instance).

There is some labelling some of which I understand some of which remains a mystery to me.

If you simply type "Pentecostal" into the bar at the top of your library you then look in detail at the contents of the title, subject and other fields you will probably find some books that are in the results which you cannot explain based on the information that you can see. I attribute these results to tagging although I accept that I may be wrong on this.

For the Wesleyan there is definitely an argument to include some of the materials for pentecostal study especially the older ones that reflect the Wesleyan Holiness movement from which elements of pentecostal theology emerged and newer ones that continue in that tradition.

There's a great book by Steven Jack Land titled Pentecostal Spirituality that explores the roots of Pentecostalism, the origins of aspects of our theology and practice. Definitely a revelation but unfortunately not available in Logos.

Unfortunately, in my experience at least, most of the best pentecostal books are tied to one of our denominational publishers so are not easily available in bookshops, Amazon or Logos, end result is that many pentecostals, including ministers, read and absorb a lot from other traditions. The comments about charismatic theology earlier being an example of this issue.

Posts 247
Gary Osborne | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Mar 3 2018 6:03 AM

Graham Owen:

There is some labelling some of which I understand some of which remains a mystery to me.

If you simply type "Pentecostal" into the bar at the top of your library you then look in detail at the contents of the title, subject and other fields you will probably find some books that are in the results which you cannot explain based on the information that you can see. I attribute these results to tagging although I accept that I may be wrong on this.

For the Wesleyan there is definitely an argument to include some of the materials for pentecostal study especially the older ones that reflect the Wesleyan Holiness movement from which elements of pentecostal theology emerged and newer ones that continue in that tradition.

There's a great book by Steven Jack Land titled Pentecostal Spirituality that explores the roots of Pentecostalism, the origins of aspects of our theology and practice. Definitely a revelation but unfortunately not available in Logos.

Unfortunately, in my experience at least, most of the best pentecostal books are tied to one of our denominational publishers so are not easily available in bookshops, Amazon or Logos, end result is that many pentecostals, including ministers, read and absorb a lot from other traditions. The comments about charismatic theology earlier being an example of this issue.

Well said, Graham.  I concur with everything you wrote 100%.  I so wish Logos could get access to GPH material (A/G) or related publishing houses.  It would be a Godsend.

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