Help!!! Abrahamic Covenant
I'm trying to find or track down the "distance" from where Abraham started (from where God said go) and to then the place where Abraham was at the time God spoke and told him about bringing into the world a son.
I guess simply, I am trying to track down distance from one place to the other and years this took.
All help is welcome--THANK YOU!!!
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RevG. said:
I'm trying to find or track down the "distance" from where Abraham started (from where God said go) and to then the place where Abraham was at the time God spoke and told him about bringing into the world a son.
I guess simply, I am trying to track down distance from one place to the other and years this took.
All help is welcome--THANK YOU!!!
Found one tiny map in BKC (Bible Knowledge Commentary) vol 1 pg 49 by simple search for Abraham NEAR sojourn screenshots follow
Meanwhile, Jesus kept on growing wiser and more mature, and in favor with God and his fellow man.
International Standard Version. (2011). (Lk 2:52). Yorba Linda, CA: ISV Foundation.
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If you do a basic search on Abraham NEAR sojourn, years, you get a ton of hits. Wading through this will be time consuming, but I found some interesting prospects. Abraham Israel and the Nations, Abraham: Following God's Promise, Africa Bible Commentary and Anchor Yale Bible Dictionary; just scratching the surface. Also, Factbook has a timeline of his life under Media. Some maps are included.
Meanwhile, Jesus kept on growing wiser and more mature, and in favor with God and his fellow man.
International Standard Version. (2011). (Lk 2:52). Yorba Linda, CA: ISV Foundation.
MacBook Pro MacOS Sequoia 15.2 1TB SSD
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This map is available in The Logos Deluxe Map Set.
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RevG. said:
I'm trying to find or track down the "distance" from where Abraham started (from where God said go) and to then the place where Abraham was at the time God spoke and told him about bringing into the world a son.
Milestone search suggestion is:
(miles OR stay OR sojourn OR travel) WITHIN {Milestone <Ge11-22>}
Thread => Logos Deluxe Maps with Scripture has Personal Book with Bible Milestones => https://community.logos.com/forums/p/132032/866451.aspx#866451
Keep Smiling [:)]
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You might also want to look in the Factbook for: Ur (city)
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With the Atlas tool, you can measure distances: Ctrl + mouse drag (Windows) or Command+drag (Mac). This is "as the crow flies" distance, so only a lower-bound.
On the map Abram Emigrates to Canaan, you can see the travel routes. The straight-line distance from Haran to Bethel is over 400 miles.
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Sean Boisen said:
Unless there is some bizarre Mercator compression involved, this map can't possibly be legit.
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"The Unbelievable Work...believe it or not." Little children...Biblical prophecy is not Christianity's friend.
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How come I do not have this information about Abram in my Atlas (I've got all features Logos Now/Faithlife Connect Essentials without library)?
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J. Erik said:
How come I do not have this information about Abram in my Atlas (I've got all features Logos Now/Faithlife Connect Essentials without library)?
The maps tool is being re-done, and some maps are available on the web app that aren't yet available in the desktop software.
This is my personal Faithlife account. On 1 March 2022, I started working for Faithlife, and have a new 'official' user account. Posts on this account shouldn't be taken as official Faithlife views!
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David Paul said:
Unless there is some bizarre Mercator compression involved, this map can't possibly be legit.
Like almost all online maps, the projection is Spherical Mercator.
This is my personal Faithlife account. On 1 March 2022, I started working for Faithlife, and have a new 'official' user account. Posts on this account shouldn't be taken as official Faithlife views!
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Mark Barnes said:
The maps tool is being re-done, and some maps are available on the web app that aren't yet available in the desktop software.
Thanks! I can see that there is quite a difference between the two. Still, this map is on neither of them...
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J. Erik said:
Thanks! I can see that there is quite a difference between the two. Still, this map is on neither of them...
What happens if you click the link Sean gave above?
This is my personal Faithlife account. On 1 March 2022, I started working for Faithlife, and have a new 'official' user account. Posts on this account shouldn't be taken as official Faithlife views!
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J. Erik said:
I get this:
Logos 6 included 3 volumes of maps, whereas the Logos 7 Feature Set only includes two volumes (at least according to the feature set comparison page). A post from 2014 suggests that the missing map is indeed from volume 3.
Why volume 3 is missing from the Logos 7 Feature Set and therefore from Logos Essentials, I have no idea. Maybe someone from Faithlife can shed some light on that. Hopefully it's just an oversight.
This is my personal Faithlife account. On 1 March 2022, I started working for Faithlife, and have a new 'official' user account. Posts on this account shouldn't be taken as official Faithlife views!
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J. Erik said:
Seems you are missing some maps for whatever reason. Running latest beta as well as LCE (formerly LNow) I get this in the WebApp:
i.e it opens the "Biblical World - Pre-patriarchal period" map, but I can open the correct one is the list below if I want to see it in the WebApp, however, this is just the interim step to opening my Logos desktop application to the Atlas map "Abram Emigrates to Canaan"
Have joy in the Lord!
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That should be it. I found the resource here: https://www.logos.com/product/45673/logos-6-maps-volume-3
I will ask customer service about it. Seems strange that it has been removed...
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Now it is only available in German, Korean and Portuguese Gold packages [<:o)]
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David Paul said:
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Unless there is some bizarre Mercator compression involved, this map can't possibly be legit.
David, can you elaborate? What seems incorrect about this map?
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Sean, simply compare the map in question with the map Ted Weis posted above. His map shows that the distance from Haran to the Mediterranean is about 2/3 to 3/4 of the distance of the eastern edge of the Mediterranean.
The map you posted shows that Haran's distance from the Sea is only about 1/4 to 1/3 of the distance of the eastern coast. Despite Mark's comment about use of Spherical Mercator, the ratios are too drastic to account for the compressed relationship in the map you posted. To me, Haran in your map looks like it ought to be labeled as Aleppo.
I understand that it is essentially impossible to make flat correspond to spheroid, but my immediate reaction upon viewing your map was a wrinkled brow and a double-take. Haran is much further from the Sea than it appears in the second map. I'm probably in a minority, but I would prefer to see wide-ranging maps such as these presented in a truncated cone that is narrower at the top. Maps of the Mediterranean & ANE are not so far north that this would be distracting, but would give a more accurate sense, imo.
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"The Unbelievable Work...believe it or not." Little children...Biblical prophecy is not Christianity's friend.
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David Paul said:
Sean, simply compare the map in question with the map Ted Weis posted above. His map shows that the distance from Haran to the Mediterranean is about 2/3 to 3/4 of the distance of the eastern edge of the Mediterranean.
...
I can't be sure, but I wonder if the "Logos Deluxe Map Set" simply has Haran in the wrong location, much too far east. Compare the relationship to Lake Van (red arrow):
and from the Zondervan Atlas of the Bible
I'm not sure differences in projection are enough to account for this disparity with the Logos Deluxe Map Set, but there's no way now to check what was behind the older map. Our current data shows Haran at 36.864 latitude, 39.032 longitude, so it's verifiable.
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Well, if the old Deluxe Map Set was wrong, pretty much everything I've ever seen about Haran must be wrong, too...which is possible, I guess. However, if that is the case, then Haran isn't the only problem. Look at the "suggested" location of Nineveh on the bottom and top maps. The top one has it well east of the lake you referenced, and in the bottom map it is well to the west. The orientation of that same lake is also very different in the middle map compared to the bottom one (the bottom one looks like it's been spun 90-degrees counter-clockwise). I guess we shouldn't put too much stock in maps, eh?
ASUS ProArt x570s Creator, AMD R9 5950x, HyperX 64gb 3600 RAM, ASUS Strix RTX 2080 ti
"The Unbelievable Work...believe it or not." Little children...Biblical prophecy is not Christianity's friend.
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Good day brothers in Christ! I appreciate all the help trying to hunt down distance and a correct place from Abraham's journey.
Thank you all--I have been silent but aware of all the help. I am going to use this email thread with my professor who teaches Old Testament Survey.
I wonder with all this chatter has Logos figured this issue out?
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David Paul said:
Well, if the old Deluxe Map Set was wrong, pretty much everything I've ever seen about Haran must be wrong, too...which is possible, I guess. However, if that is the case, then Haran isn't the only problem. Look at the "suggested" location of Nineveh on the bottom and top maps. The top one has it well east of the lake you referenced, and in the bottom map it is well to the west. The orientation of that same lake is also very different in the middle map compared to the bottom one (the bottom one looks like it's been spun 90-degrees counter-clockwise). I guess we shouldn't put too much stock in maps, eh?
Sorry, the arrow on my last screenshot from the Zondervan Atlas is pointing to Lake Urmia: Lake Van isn't visible on this map (and i couldn't zoom out to check!). Here's a closer comparison (approximating: i'm not a cartographer):
The main points remains, though: projections (and rotation, and other skewing) can definitely affect your perception. Geo-coordinates and distance measures are more reliable. Ctrl-Cmd-click and drag on an Atlas map shows the distance from Haran straight west to the Mediterranean as about 160 miles.
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Why not just use google maps and let it plan the route from the modern equivalents to these Biblical cities? Most major roads will follow or parallel ancient caravan routes.
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Dan Starcevich said:
Why not just use google maps and let it plan the route from the modern equivalents to these Biblical cities? Most major roads will follow or parallel ancient caravan routes.
wheres the fun in that? 😉 that’s why I spent good money on a sophisticated bible software program.
on a side note - are modern roads really near these ancient ones?
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Richard Villanueva said:
are modern roads really near these ancient ones?
Yes, often. One very well-known example: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/King%27s_Highway_(ancient)
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Richard Villanueva said:
wheres the fun in that? 😉 that’s why I spent good money on a sophisticated bible software program.
Nice new pic Richard..
Not sure if Michelle still remember me
... but tell her I said "hi" .. [:)]Hope you guys are going even stronger!
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Mark Barnes said:J. Erik said:
I get this:
Logos 6 included 3 volumes of maps, whereas the Logos 7 Feature Set only includes two volumes (at least according to the feature set comparison page). A post from 2014 suggests that the missing map is indeed from volume 3.
Why volume 3 is missing from the Logos 7 Feature Set and therefore from Logos Essentials, I have no idea. Maybe someone from Faithlife can shed some light on that. Hopefully it's just an oversight.
Why would we be missing anything at all if we supposedly keep everything and lose nothing when we upgrade? That doesn’t give anybody a good feeling 🤔
DAL
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mike said:
Hope you guys are going even stronger!
heck yeah! 16 years this November! God has been too good to us.
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