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Rodger Allen Thompson | Forum Activity | Posted: Wed, Sep 18 2019 9:04 AM

What is the best way to search for the answer to a specific question like: "Whatever happened to the tabernacle after the temple was built?" Or, Where can I find a list of the kings of Israel and Judah with years and Prophets?" I know I can browse through resources for answers to questions but that can be very time-consuming. I need to find a way to more quickly get to the information I need.

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JT (alabama24) | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Sep 18 2019 12:23 PM

Welcome to the forums! Smile

Rodger Allen Thompson:
What is the best way to search for the answer to a specific question like: "Whatever happened to the tabernacle after the temple was built?" Or, Where can I find a list of the kings of Israel and Judah with years and Prophets?"

Let me preface by saying that I am not the best person to answer. We have some users that will be able to give you a much more detailed answer. With that said, in my opinion asking "natural language" questions are better performed in google (who spends billions of dollars perfecting those kinds of searches). 

Of course, you and I have both invested money in Logos and we want to utilize the resources that we have... many of which may be better than those found freely on the internet. When performing a search in Logos, you will need to utilize special syntax. This is where others will be more helpful. I would start with: 

tabernacle NEAR temple

That search will find text that has the word "tabernacle" located near "temple." It isn't perfect, but it would be much better than randomly flipping through resources. 

For your other query, sometimes it is helpful to know about the resources in your library. For a list of Kings & Prophets, along with dates, my first suggestion would be to utilize Study Bibles, which often provide that sort of information. A search of: 

kings NEAR prophets

limited to my study bibles produced an article in the Nelson Study Bible entitled "The Kings and Prophets of Israel and Judah," which I think is the sort of thing you were looking for.

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Posts 433
Robert Neely | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Sep 19 2019 4:45 AM

The Timeline tool works well for the list of prophets. Just type the word “prophet” without the quotes into the filter box.  

The Timeline tool doesn’t work so well for kings. But if you can get this resource, it shows all of the kings for Israel and Judah from several sources. 

https://www.logos.com/product/25368/israels-kings-timeline 

the more general answer to your question is that there is no “one way” to arrive at the particular information that you are looking for that may be contained in your library. The logos supplied training videos are good for getting an overview of the various tools, guides and basic search techniques. Read the dataset documentation that you have in your library for more clues and you must review the Logos wiki site. 

At some point you may want to invest in some training available from MP Seminars and/or LearnLogos. 

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Mark Barnes | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Sep 19 2019 5:10 AM

Rodger Allen Thompson:

What is the best way to search for the answer to a specific question like: "Whatever happened to the tabernacle after the temple was built?" Or, Where can I find a list of the kings of Israel and Judah with years and Prophets?" I know I can browse through resources for answers to questions but that can be very time-consuming. I need to find a way to more quickly get to the information I need.

There's no one answer to a general "what's the best way to search" question. Natural language questions are very hard for a computer to understand and process. Companies like Google are spending billions trying to be able to handle questions like that – and still haven't completed succeeded. It will be a long time before Logos can do so.

So users like us have to learn skills to help the computer understand what we want. So rather than just provide a search term for you, I'm going to take the time to suggest a process which you can hopefully apply to other cases.

Logos has great search extensions and extra datasets for searching in Bibles, and other specific datasets, but if you're searching your whole library, I find the best approach is to imagine a short phrase a writer is likely to use if answering your question, and use that in your search query. Phrases are useful because they help to narrow down the query (because phrases occur less often than individual words).

For your first query, it seems likely that the phrase "after the temple" would very likely be used by someone answering your question. But a writer is unlikely to use words like "whatever happened" when giving an ANSWER. So, in that case I'd search for tabernacle NEAR "after the temple". There are of course other possible ways of expressing that answer. You might say "once the temple was built", or "following the building of the temple", or "after the construction of the temple". (All those different ways of expressing the same thing demonstrate why it's so difficult for computers to process natural language questions.)

But, in my library at least, tabernacle NEAR "after the temple" produces some helpful results, which effectively conclude "no-one knows"!

With regard to your other question, again, think of the answer, not just the question. I searched for Jeremiah Isaiah Date Josiah which worked very well, giving me charts in "Day by Day through the OT" and "Exploring the OT".

Posts 5
Rodger Allen Thompson | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Sep 19 2019 6:52 AM

Thanks for the response. I'm not really looking for answers to the questions above. Those are just examples. My question is, how to best ask a question of Logos in order to get to the specific info needed to answer it. But thanks for the info anyway because it is all helpful.

Posts 5
Rodger Allen Thompson | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Sep 19 2019 6:54 AM

Thanks Mark. I suspected there would be no way to ask Logos a direct question but wanted to make sure. Anyway thanks for the helpful info.

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Mark Barnes | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Sep 19 2019 7:36 AM

Rodger Allen Thompson:

Thanks Mark. I suspected there would be no way to ask Logos a direct question but wanted to make sure. Anyway thanks for the helpful info.

Faithlife are experimenting with it, but at the moment it only works for very simple requests: https://support.logos.com/hc/en-us/articles/360016143391-Faithlife-Assistant

Posts 5
Rodger Allen Thompson | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Sep 19 2019 8:50 AM

Thanks for the tip about Faithlife Assistant. I was unaware of this feature and it is a huge step in the right direction.

Posts 283
Michel Pauw | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Sep 20 2019 8:46 PM

Mark Barnes:

But, in my library at least, tabernacle NEAR "after the temple" produces some helpful results, which effectively conclude "no-one knows"!

This search returns a very interesting reference to a note in the the Faithlife Study Bible on Ex. 25:8, where it says: "The temple replaced the tent-structure of the tabernacle (2 Sam 7) and the tent was deposited in the temple after its construction (1 Chr 20:8; 28:10)."

The interesting thing is that the underlined claim is not supported at all by the references given.

Is there a way to address such a 'fake news' in Faithlife's resources?

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MJ. Smith | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Sep 20 2019 9:59 PM

I would report it as a data error with John Barry tagged in the heading. It is a problem that reflects very poorly on FL and they should want to correct it ASAP. I personally would add a picture of Bill the Cat but that probably is not the right approach.

Orthodox Bishop Hilarion Alfeyev: "To be a theologian means to have experience of a personal encounter with God through prayer and worship."

Posts 201
Roy | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Sep 20 2019 10:54 PM

Don't know how accurate this is but I found this with a Google search.

https://jbqnew.jewishbible.org/jbq-past-issues/2016/441-january-march-2016/reconstructing-destruction-tabernacle-shiloh/ 

This is a Jewish perspective and is very interesting.

It is a bit too long to copy and paste here.... the article gives what is suppose to be the history of the Tabernacle and gives a "guess" as to what could have been its ultimate end.

Concerning the part from the FSB where it was deposited in the temple this may address that (from the article)...

  1. C) TB Sotah 9a records the following tradition in the name of Rabbi Hanina bar Papa: The original Tabernacle of Moses never fell into enemy hands. When the building of King Solomon’s Temple was complete, the Tabernacle of Moses – no longer being needed – was disassembled and stowed away.8Now if the Philistines destroyed the Tabernacle of Shiloh, how can the Talmudic tradition (that the Tabernacle was respectfully stored away) be correct?

Posts 201
Roy | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Sep 20 2019 11:18 PM

A little more...

E. “Moses: A master has said, ‘After the first sanctuary was built, the tent of meeting, its boards, hooks, bars, pillars, and sockets, were stored away.’ [So in both cases, no one profited by the materials of the sanctuary and the tent of meeting when the Temple was destroyed.]”

F. Where were they stored away?

G. Said R. Hisda said Abimi, “Underneath the crypts of the Temple.”

Neusner, J. (2011). The Babylonian Talmud: A Translation and Commentary. Peabody, MA: Hendrickson Publishers.

Posts 201
Roy | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Sep 20 2019 11:23 PM

Rodger Allen Thompson:
I'm not really looking for answers to the questions above. Those are just examples.

Of course, if I would read all of the responses more carefully, I would know the O.P. didn't really want an answer.....Embarrassed

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MJ. Smith | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Sep 21 2019 1:17 AM

Ah, but then others wouldn't enjoy your answers.

Orthodox Bishop Hilarion Alfeyev: "To be a theologian means to have experience of a personal encounter with God through prayer and worship."

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Keep Smiling 4 Jesus :) | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Sep 22 2019 8:23 PM

Rodger Allen Thompson:
What is the best way to search for the answer to a specific question like: "Whatever happened to the tabernacle after the temple was built?"

One search suggestion is looking for Tabernacle articles that mention Temple:

([field heading,largetext] tabernacle) WITHIN 7 WORDS temple

Both articles mention 1 Kings 8:4

FYI: Herod's Temple did not have the ark in the Holy of Holies.

Keep Smiling Smile

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