Thoughts on Logos 9 Arrival?
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8 only came out this year, didn’t it? I wouldn’t expect it before 2021 at the earliest
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David Wanat said:
8 only came out this year, didn’t it?
No, last year (in October, so almost exactly one year).
David Wanat said:I wouldn’t expect it before 2021 at the earliest
FL does not make comments on things like this, but they have gone to about a two year development cycle. I would expect Fall 2020.
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Based on comments on the forums and the last two cycles, I agree that we have some small amount of confidence that they would aim for fall of 2020
Disclaimer: I hate using messaging, texting, and email for real communication. If anything that I type to you seems like anything other than humble and respectful, then I have not done a good job typing my thoughts.
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My pocketbook hopes it is still at least a year away. [;)]
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I'm excited for 9 as well but let's not forget that they still have L8 features to finish...
e.g. Source Criticism dataset
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JT (alabama24) said:David Wanat said:
8 only came out this year, didn’t it?
No, last year (in October, so almost exactly one year).
David Wanat said:I wouldn’t expect it before 2021 at the earliest
FL does not make comments on things like this, but they have gone to about a two year development cycle. I would expect Fall 2020.
A year already? It didn’t feel like that long. Time flies I guess 🙂
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Are future 9 features still being released in the old "Logos Now" fashion - or is that old news.?
Never bought into that approach myself
Shalom
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Bruce Dunning said:
My pocketbook hopes it is still at least a year away
I used to feel this way about a new release, but once your library reaches a certain size, the price of admission is chump change.
The mind of man is the mill of God, not to grind chaff, but wheat. Thomas Manton | Study hard, for the well is deep, and our brains are shallow. Richard Baxter
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Kevin A Lewis said:
Are future 9 features still being released in the old "Logos Now" fashion - or is that old news.?
Not really. A "faithlife connect" subscription provides ALL features, new & old. It isn't billed as a "tommorows features NOW" type of thing.
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Mattillo said:
still have L8 features to finish... e.g. Source Criticism dataset
Just as a point of clarification: we have already shipped the Source Criticism dataset. This is a supplemental dataset which labels the source of Old Testament passages as J, E, P, D, or L, according to Eissfeldt's 1922 analysis. You can learn more about how to use the dataset in its documentation.
To your larger point, there are some Logos 8 features that we are still working on. Two that come to mind are The Composite Gospel harmony and Text Comparison Interlinear Deuterocanon Dataset. Data for both of these are still being finalized.
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Adam Borries (Faithlife) said:Mattillo said:
still have L8 features to finish... e.g. Source Criticism dataset
Just as a point of clarification: we have already shipped the Source Criticism dataset. This is a supplemental dataset which labels the source of Old Testament passages as J, E, P, D, or L, according to Eissfeldt's 1922 analysis. You can learn more about how to use the dataset in its documentation.
To your larger point, there are some Logos 8 features that we are still working on. Two that come to mind are The Composite Gospel harmony and Text Comparison Interlinear Deuterocanon Dataset. Data for both of these are still being finalized.
i stand corrected; my apologies and thank you for the updates
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Adam Borries (Faithlife) said:
This is a supplemental dataset which labels the source of Old Testament passages as J, E, P, D, or L, according to Eissfeldt's 1922 analysis.
I hope this is not considered "completed" as I would like Mowinkel's Jeremiah which is in AFAT and used to be readily available i.e. before base of the interlinears/reverse interlinears was done. And some version(s) of the Gospel/Q should also be added.
Orthodox Bishop Alfeyev: "To be a theologian means to have experience of a personal encounter with God through prayer and worship."; Orthodox proverb: "We know where the Church is, we do not know where it is not."
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The Notes tool is far from finished, there is lots to be done to get it up to an acceptable standard. i have no interest in Logos 9 until the Notes Tool works correctly across all platform. I would also think there is more work to be done on the ST dataset to expand its coverage.
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Accordance will be releasing Version 13 soon and their “Sermon Editor” (called Paper) will finally blow Logos’s sermon editor out of the water! They have improved it on so many levels it’s going to be the best sermon builder tool ever. And to think Logos was, in my opinion, only one step away from reaching perfection and the number 1 spot for sermon editor tool — but they never added the ability to insert pictures that zoom in and out on the main points and subpoints of the sermon editor to help people who present from their screen to avoid using PowerPoint all together. Accordance’s sermon editor (Paper) even has the ability to collapse and un-collapse the outline’s subpoints and sub-subpoints so you can present one point at a time! And they’ll be improving their sermon editor even more upon version 13’s release! How about that! After all, isn’t writing sermons just as important as other features for studying and teaching God’s Word?
DAL
Ps. You can even add hyperlinks and create your own customized links in Paper; something so basic you can’t do with Logos’s sermon editor.
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Accordance also has Carta, just saying ....
DAL said:Accordance will be releasing Version 13 soon and their “Sermon Editor” (called Paper) will finally blow Logos’s sermon editor out of the water! They have improved it on so many levels it’s going to be the best sermon builder tool ever. And to think Logos was, in my opinion, only one step away from reaching perfection and the number 1 spot for sermon editor tool — but they never added the ability to insert pictures that zoom in and out on the main points and subpoints of the sermon editor to help people who present from their screen to avoid using PowerPoint all together. Accordance’s sermon editor (Paper) even has the ability to collapse and un-collapse the outline’s subpoints and sub-subpoints so you can present one point at a time! And they’ll be improving their sermon editor even more upon version 13’s release! How about that! After all, isn’t writing sermons just as important as other features for studying and teaching God’s Word?
DAL
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DAL said:
Accordance will be releasing Version 13 soon and their “Sermon Editor” (called Paper) will finally blow Logos’s sermon editor out of the water! They have improved it on so many levels it’s going to be the best sermon builder tool ever. And to think Logos was, in my opinion, only one step away from reaching perfection and the number 1 spot for sermon editor tool — but they never added the ability to insert pictures that zoom in and out on the main points and subpoints of the sermon editor to help people who present from their screen to avoid using PowerPoint all together. Accordance’s sermon editor (Paper) even has the ability to collapse and un-collapse the outline’s subpoints and sub-subpoints so you can present one point at a time! And they’ll be improving their sermon editor even more upon version 13’s release! How about that! After all, isn’t writing sermons just as important as other features for studying and teaching God’s Word?
DAL
Ps. You can even add hyperlinks and create your own customized links in Paper; something so basic you can’t do with Logos’s sermon editor.
Accordance 13's new note markup tool also looks awesome. Markers/arrows that resizes automatically if the text is resized??? Amazing. They're also getting Dark Mode! PDF Import. These features may be enough to for me to run Accordance along side Logos. And I'd gain access to Sacred Bridge also.
I think Faithlife should pay very close attention.
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A gentle reminder that the forum guidelines ask us not to promote or link to competitors.
Thanks to FL for including Carta and a Hebrew audio bible in Logos 9!
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PetahChristian said:
A gentle reminder that the forum guidelines ask us not to promote or link to competitors.
This thread is about Logos 9 and commenting upon where competitors are getting a leg up or already do so over FL to highlight where we as users would like to see Logos 9 improved to bring FL‘s offering in these areas back into the game need to mention what those competitors are doing better.
Surely we all can cope with a competitor being mentioned in this context?
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Why not ask Phil directly, since he posted the forum guidelines?
Thanks to FL for including Carta and a Hebrew audio bible in Logos 9!
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PetahChristian said:
A gentle reminder that the forum guidelines ask us not to promote or link to competitors.
I was just comparing the “sermon editor” feature and how Logos is missing out for not wanting to implement a request I and others have been asking for years now. That’s all, no promoting or links included.
DAL
Ps. I guess you have a different idea of what “promoting” means. But the reality is that none of that is being done here. Sometimes I wish new MVP’s wouldn’t get so zealous and take things to the extreme. It’s really unnecessary...just saying.
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I don’t feel there is a need to ask Phil. I am comfortable with a competitor being mentioned in this context. If it makes FL feel a little bit uncomfortable because customers like what the competitor is doing then surely that is a good thing in the long run for FL to hear that sort of feedback.
PetahChristian said:Why not ask Phil directly, since he posted the forum guidelines?
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MJ. Smith said:Adam Borries (Faithlife) said:
This is a supplemental dataset which labels the source of Old Testament passages as J, E, P, D, or L, according to Eissfeldt's 1922 analysis.
I hope this is not considered "completed" as I would like Mowinkel's Jeremiah which is in AFAT and used to be readily available i.e. before base of the interlinears/reverse interlinears was done. And some version(s) of the Gospel/Q should also be added.
Hi, MJ,
That's certainly possible, but not planned for now. We intentionally designed the label schema to be extensible for other sources, but adding more textual source data is dependent on licensing; and of course on our internal bandwidth to take on the work of adapting it for Logos. Thanks for voicing your support for it.
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On another note, though it has been a bit since I checked last, was the atlas. Only some of the maps had accompanying slides to go with them.
I did notice the other day that when I created a MacArthur slide his face came up so that is good!
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So where are we now? Does Covid move a release date into 21?
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My heart says 20. My wallet says 21. My wife says 30.
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Donnie Vick said:
So where are we now? Does Covid move a release date into 21?
FL doesn't publicly address these questions often. Software development is better suited than most fields to "work from home," so I would not expect COVID to play too big a part in the release date. Just a guess.
GaoLu said:My heart says 20. My wallet says 21. My wife says 30.
[:D]
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GaoLu said:
My heart says 20. My wallet says 21. My wife says 30.
Heart - Ditto
Wallet - Ditto
Wife - "Never!"
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Mine says the same [:)]
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That's where we then read Ephesians 5:23.
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My wife already assumes I am going to buy something on Logos every month. It's me trying to keep up with the new features and stuff. [8-|]
The mind of man is the mill of God, not to grind chaff, but wheat. Thomas Manton | Study hard, for the well is deep, and our brains are shallow. Richard Baxter
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I can really say. I am really looking forward tho. Logos 9 will be great
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JT (alabama24) said:Donnie Vick said:
So where are we now? Does Covid move a release date into 21?
FL doesn't publicly address these questions often. Software development is better suited than most fields to "work from home," so I would not expect COVID to play too big a part in the release date. Just a guess.
From a standpoint of working on development no, from a stand point of people willing to pay for new packages yes. Very different financial environment this go around. All comes down to where things are and if people are still in savings mode not knowing what the rest of the year brings I think with Faithlife taking this into account,and I could see a few different strategy's on their part play out.
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From watching all but the first release, I offer the following observations:
- there may be a subtle hint within two weeks of release; or there may not be
- there may be a night (day, weekend) when logos.com and verbum.com are acting wonky ... that is usually a clue that the site is being reconfigured for the new release; or it may simply mean a hardware upgrade - or failure.
- when it does come there will be little advanced notice and some features will be incomplete ... okay, this is probably the most consistent observation
- when several major forum posters drop their contributions substantially, that may mean that they are beta testing, or on vacation, or the people usually asking questions are on vacation
- when the beta notes for the current version drop to only critical patches that likely means the programmers have been reassigned - you can expect either a major upgrade in mobile apps, major upgrade in web app, major restructuring or new function in desktop app, or improvements to Faithlife or Proclaim or interfaces to them.
- conclusion - get yourself a nice cup of pu-erh tea and read the leaves - that may be as accurate. Bob will release Logos 9 whenever he decides to.
Orthodox Bishop Alfeyev: "To be a theologian means to have experience of a personal encounter with God through prayer and worship."; Orthodox proverb: "We know where the Church is, we do not know where it is not."
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Typically, star people offer confusing, though almost reasonable explanations for their absence, 22-23 days before major release (some years, it's been as many as 25 days). [*-)]
"If myth is ideology in narrative form, then scholarship is myth with footnotes." B. Lincolm 1999.
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30% off Covid-19 upgrades and 35% off upgrades for FL Connect Subscribers 👍😁👌 They will sell like hot pancakes!
DAL
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If other users are like me, I have expense money that I need to use before the end of the year. Conferences were cancelled so I have extra money this year that can be put toward a nice upgrade.
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Donnie Vick said:
If other users are like me, I have expense money that I need to use before the end of the year. Conferences were cancelled so I have extra money this year that can be put toward a nice upgrade.
I'm sure FL will take that into account.[;)]
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November 3rd would be perfect. Absolutely nothing else going on around that time. [;)]
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I figure I’ll play catch-up with my preferred package when upgrading to 9 (Verbum). Then I’ll check on what resources I can get for cheap on other base package upgrade. I recall in past version upgrades, they had discounts for awhile.
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David Wanat said:
Then I’ll check on what resources I can get for cheap on other base package upgrade.
I tried to count every possible package, including Basic, Fundamentals, Features, etc. and came up with 95.
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Bruce Dunning said:
My pocketbook hopes it is still at least a year away.
You should probably wait for a year to upgrade anyway for them to work out all the bugs and add back all the features if the Logos 8 rollout was any indication.
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Dale E Heath said:David Wanat said:
Then I’ll check on what resources I can get for cheap on other base package upgrade.
I tried to count every possible package, including Basic, Fundamentals, Features, etc. and came up with 95.
Searching Logos.com for Base Packages => https://www.logos.com/search?page=1&sortBy=Savings&limit=60&filters=status-live_Status%2Bproducttype-basepackages_Product%20Type&ownership=unowned&geographicAvailability=all finds 123 that includes Logos 8 Basic, Verbum 8 Basic, and a dataset => Deuterocanon Reported Speech while missing Logos 8 Fundamentals, Logos 8 Academic Basic, Logos 8 Academic Standard, and Feature Upgrades (so my base package and feature set count for all languages is 128)
Keep Smiling [:)]
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Dale E Heath said:David Wanat said:
Then I’ll check on what resources I can get for cheap on other base package upgrade.
I tried to count every possible package, including Basic, Fundamentals, Features, etc. and came up with 95.
Searching Logos.com for Base Packages => https://www.logos.com/search?page=1&sortBy=Savings&limit=60&filters=status-live_Status%2Bproducttype-basepackages_Product%20Type&ownership=unowned&geographicAvailability=all finds 123 that includes Logos 8 Basic, Verbum 8 Basic, and a dataset => Deuterocanon Reported Speech while missing Logos 8 Fundamentals, Logos 8 Academic Basic, Logos 8 Academic Standard, and Feature Upgrades (so my base package and feature set count for all languages is 128)
Keep Smiling
Nice filter. I'll save it for when 9 comes out [:)]
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Dale E Heath said:David Wanat said:
Then I’ll check on what resources I can get for cheap on other base package upgrade.
I tried to count every possible package, including Basic, Fundamentals, Features, etc. and came up with 95.
Searching Logos.com for Base Packages => https://www.logos.com/search?page=1&sortBy=Savings&limit=60&filters=status-live_Status%2Bproducttype-basepackages_Product%20Type&ownership=unowned&geographicAvailability=all finds 123 that includes Logos 8 Basic, Verbum 8 Basic, and a dataset => Deuterocanon Reported Speech while missing Logos 8 Fundamentals, Logos 8 Academic Basic, Logos 8 Academic Standard, and Feature Upgrades (so my base package and feature set count for all languages is 128)
Keep Smiling
Even then, that search is sadly still missing the excellent Verbum Clergy Starter package. So many base packages! Could be worse. There might be fewer of them.
“The trouble is that everyone talks about reforming others and no one thinks about reforming himself.” St. Peter of Alcántara
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SineNomine said:
Even then, that search is sadly still missing the excellent Verbum Clergy Starter package. So many base packages!
Logos9 is rumored to include what is being called the Combo Package. A Logosian selects which packages to check the dynamic content, and then it re-packages to offer the lowest price in a single pass (obviating the need to test the 9,768 possible combinations).
"If myth is ideology in narrative form, then scholarship is myth with footnotes." B. Lincolm 1999.
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Denise said:SineNomine said:
Even then, that search is sadly still missing the excellent Verbum Clergy Starter package. So many base packages!
Logos9 is rumored to include what is being called the Combo Package. A Logosian selects which packages to check the dynamic content, and then it re-packages to offer the lowest price in a single pass (obviating the need to test the 9,768 possible combinations).
😱😱😱
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