BUG? POOR PROGRAMMING? Library Facets Less than helpful

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Jack Caviness | Forum Activity | Posted: Fri, Dec 20 2019 1:52 PM

Wanted to see my resources on the book of Daniel, so expanded facet Subject and typed Daniel in the filter field. Received nothing on any subject containing Daniel, only authors—which should have been in another facet, not in subject. However, if I type subject:Daniel in the main search field, I get a list of resources with the subject Daniel.

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Philana R. Crouch | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Dec 20 2019 2:32 PM

Hi Jack,

I wanted to talk with a developer before I responded and he confirmed that it is working as expected. Here is his response:

The facet list can only show facets at a single level of the subject hierarchy at a time. Therefore, entering text in the facet "Find" box will only find matches at the current level of hierarchy. If you had first selected the "Bible O.T." subject in the facet list, then the "Find" box would show matches more like what you would expect.

Typing "Daniel" in the "Find resources" box works closer to what you expect, because it is matching the provided text against subjects at any level of the subject hierarchy.

With regards to your concerns about authors, I suspect you will find that those subjects don't refer to the author, but to the fact that they are about the subject. They are likely biographies, autobiographies, or something similar.

I hope this is helpful.

Philana

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Jack Caviness | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Dec 21 2019 7:17 AM

Philana R. Crouch:
I hope this is helpful.

Helpful is not quite the word I would use to describe this response. This is Bible software, so I would expect a Biblical response to my filter. However, if that is what the developers believe is correct, I will learn to live with it.

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SineNomine | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Dec 21 2019 11:32 AM

As best I can tell, even if you know the exact subject you are looking for, it isn't possible to use the [search function in the] Library facets to select a topic specific to Daniel. The closest I've managed to get is "Bible O.T."

If it is in fact impossible, then I don't know whether to call that a bug or a design failure.

EDIT: Added the text in [brackets] subsequent to Andrew Batishko's reply below.

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SineNomine:
As best I can tell, even if you know the exact subject you are looking for, it isn't possible to use the Library facets to select a topic specific to Daniel. The closest I've managed to get is "Bible O.T."

Select "Bible O.T."

Then select "Daniel"

Subjects are a hierarchy. The subject facet starts by letting you select values at the root of the hierarchy. Once you've selected a root value, then you are given a list of the values that start with the selected value (and so on).

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Jack Caviness | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Dec 21 2019 2:05 PM

Andrew, since I have your attention. Also on the subject of Daniel. The resource in this screenshot is tagged as Bible Commentary, but it contains no Bible milestones.In case you can't read the screenshot, the resource is the Most High God by Rebald Showers. I posted a bug report in a separate thread, but have received no response from FL.

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Dave Hooton | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Dec 21 2019 2:17 PM

A more detailed explanation is given here. It's clear that treating Bible O.T. as a "single level" was a deliberate design choice. After selecting Genesis, however, the flaw is that you cannot go back one level from Subject: Bible O.T., Genesis. It is treated as a "single level", as denoted by the comma separator. I would call that a design failure, or inconsistency.

Dave
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SineNomine | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Dec 21 2019 5:32 PM

Andrew Batishko (Faithlife):

SineNomine:
As best I can tell, even if you know the exact subject you are looking for, it isn't possible to use the Library facets to select a topic specific to Daniel. The closest I've managed to get is "Bible O.T."

Select "Bible O.T."

Then select "Daniel"

Subjects are a hierarchy. The subject facet starts by letting you select values at the root of the hierarchy. Once you've selected a root value, then you are given a list of the values that start with the selected value (and so on).

I see the problem. You did it a different way.

I attempted to get to it by using the search mechanism built into the facets. The deepest I can get in one step using that is "Bible O.T." Once I get there, I can't get any deeper... there is no possible step two. This I think is either a bug or a program failure.

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SineNomine | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Dec 21 2019 5:40 PM

Dave Hooton:
A more detailed explanation is given here.

Andrew Batishko (Faithlife):

A search for subject:Hebrews is not the same thing as searching for one of the multiple instances for Hebrews in the facet list.

When you look at the Subjects for a book, you'll see a whole bunch of words with some double-dashes (--) inserted and some semi-colons (;). When a book has multiple subjects, each is separated by a semi-colon. You can see these individually if you click on the Subjects column in Details view mode in order to group the results by Subject. This still leaves subjects containing the double-dashes. Those double-dashes represent tiers (or groupings) of subject information. So, "United States--History" indicates a broad subject group of "United States" and a more detailed subject group of "History" within the larger group of "United States". It's possible that other broad subject groups also contain a "History" subject too. For example, "Classics--Latin--History" or "Classics--English--History". Even though "History" is found in both "United States" and "Classics", it has a very different meaning that is dependent on the parent grouping.

The Subjects facet group works by displaying all the top level subject groups ("United States" and "Classics"). If you select one of those, it will then display all of the subgroups within that subject group. So, selecting "Classics" might show you "English", "Greek", and "Latin".

If you don't care about the organization of the subject group hierarchy, then the right solution is to use a search string that searches the subject fields. For example, if you want to look for history anywhere in the subject, then use: subject:history

Note that "Bible. N.T." and "Bible. O.T." are specially treated as their own top level group, even though they don't usually have the "--" separator. This allows these subjects to group together in a much more useful fashion.

Dave Hooton:
It's clear that treating Bible O.T. as a "single level" was a deliberate design choice. After selecting Genesis, however, the flaw is that you cannot go back one level from Subject: Bible O.T., Genesis. It is treated as a "single level", as denoted by the comma separator. I would call that a design failure, or inconsistency.

I think this is a version of the same (conceptual) design failure that doesn't let me navigate any deeper than "Bible O.T." if I get there by running a search in the left pane.

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Dave Hooton | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Dec 22 2019 3:17 PM

SineNomine:

Dave Hooton:
It's clear that treating Bible O.T. as a "single level" was a deliberate design choice. After selecting Genesis, however, the flaw is that you cannot go back one level from Subject: Bible O.T., Genesis. It is treated as a "single level", as denoted by the comma separator. I would call that a design failure, or inconsistency.

I think this is a version of the same (conceptual) design failure that doesn't let me navigate any deeper than "Bible O.T." if I get there by running a search in the left pane.

If this is what you mean:

    1. Search the facet by bible o.t.

The facet result has to be incorrect as the Series and Publisher entries do not contain bible o.t.  They do contain bible, but the rationale for this escapes me!

The Pseudepigrapha entry is not counted with the 393 others. It is a Personal Book, and it appears that my Subject entry is "incorrectly" formatted for a strict match.

2. Select "Bible O.T." in the facet

This facet result also has to be wrong as the Series entries only contain bible

Note that clicking the X to remove the search entry will display the facet entries you would expect.

Dave
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SineNomine | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Dec 25 2019 5:45 PM

Dave Hooton:
If this is what you mean:

It is.

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