Updating library catalog - persistent annoyance

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Veli Voipio | Forum Activity | Posted: Fri, Dec 4 2020 12:48 AM

I am not sure what is the official term for this problem although I assume everyone knows it.

I think now it is good time to discuss about this when the L9 smoke is settling and the Covid alleviated Christmas frenzy has not started yet.

I mean the orange/yellow line in the picture saying "Updating library catalog, list may be incomplete". It appears and disappears unexpectedly and often right before I press the mouse button and then something annoying might happen. Someone else might be able to describe it better (more accurately, more vividly, more emphatically etc...). 

I've been using Logos for many years and I think this problem has been there all the time. I can even recall some discussion about it but I am not sure which words to use in the search string so I thought it is best to start a fresh thread. 

I guess the origin is that some summer trainee designed it while in the original Logos garage, and it is hard coded and nobody braves to touch that code. But I assume no user is happy with this "feature" so it is time to fix it. 

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Stephen McCracken | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Dec 4 2020 1:10 AM

Veli, I actually don't mind it as it it means my reading on my iPad is updating with my desktop, etc. Most of the time I never see it as its only when you open Library and my desktop always opens with where I closed the programme and that's where I start working. But everyone has their preferences.

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Rosie Perera | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Dec 4 2020 1:45 AM

It happens whenever you have downloaded new books into your library, or have changed the tagging or other metadata on any of your books. The catalog must be updated at that point.

I suppose we could request a feature that delays such catalog updates until late at night or something, so they won't disturb you. But the problem is, you need the catalog to be updated or else the Library won't work properly.

For example, suppose you had ordered a pre-pub book by a particular author, and it suddenly arrived today. And suppose you were filtering your library to show the books by said author. Well, the new one wouldn't show up in that list until the catalog had been updated.

Or suppose you were going through doing a bunch of tagging of some new resources, and you wanted to check your work partway through, so you filter your library to show rating:2 ANDNOT mytag:*  (that's my quick way to see what new resources have downloaded that I haven't applied tags to yet, since as soon as they download, I rate them all "2" which means new and unrated (0 stars means I haven't even marked them as new yet)). Well, it wouldn't work properly if the catalog hadn't finished updating, because the catalog wouldn't incorporate your most recent tagging changes.

I wish this step could be made quicker so we'd barely see the orange bar flashing by. Or perhaps you would rather not ever see it at all? Well, then you wouldn't know if what you were seeing in the Library was accurate or not. At least when we see the orange bar, we know we still have to wait a bit for the Library to show accurately what's in there.

I hope that makes sense.

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Stephen McCracken | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Dec 4 2020 2:33 AM

I realise now that this feature is bigger than my first response. I highlight a sentence from  commentary and it immediately its start updating (in this case in the Sermon Starter). I still don't mind, but I realise now that it affects more than simply Library. And working in dark mode I can see why it can be distracting for others.

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Veli Voipio | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Dec 4 2020 3:15 AM

Well, the bar itself is not annoying, but the movement of the whole library list and panels when the bar is coming and going.

For example, if I am about to delete mytags for a selected group of books, the panel moves at the moment I click and I then delete wrong tag without knowing it. Finding the books again takes time as the useful tags are gone Indifferent

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Veli Voipio | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Dec 4 2020 10:21 AM

I finally found the right description: it is like trying to hit a moving target!

I could think it as a computer game or software virus, but when it is in a professional program for productive work, it should be fixed some day.

.

Gold package, and original language material and ancient text material, SIL and UBS books, discourse Hebrew OT and Greek NT. PC with Windows 8.1

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DMB | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Dec 4 2020 10:34 AM

Now, Veli. Let's be just a little objective:

1. It's only been doing that for about 11 years. Try being patient.

2. It's not Logos' fault, the crazy customers preferred 'faster than molassas' speed, making the target-line progressively harder to predict.

3. Liven up your porch ... put a target on your screen and see if you can dodge the library-lines-moving hit.

4. View the repeated oops-wrong-line as just another cute Logos feature.

5. Or training support from Whatcom Community College.

More seriously, I agree ... and the UI not that hard to fix.

"God will save his fallen angels and their broken wings He'll mend."

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SineNomine | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Dec 4 2020 3:10 PM

Veli Voipio:
Well, the bar itself is not annoying, but the movement of the whole library list and panels when the bar is coming and going.

Agreed. I would much prefer a notification that didn't move everything on me.

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Veli Voipio | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Dec 8 2020 4:50 AM

Veli Voipio:
But I assume no user is happy with this "feature" so it is time to fix it. 

It came to my mind that the baseball fans among Logos users might actually like the up-and-down movement of the library lines Big Smile. But the rest of us perhaps not.

I look forward to seeing comments from the FL software team.

Gold package, and original language material and ancient text material, SIL and UBS books, discourse Hebrew OT and Greek NT. PC with Windows 8.1

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John Kaess | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Dec 8 2020 8:52 AM

I agree that the process of updating the library needs to be fixed. I don't mind that it notifies me that this is happening, but the real problem is that when it appears and disappears it MOVES the contents of the library up and down, which is NOT NECESSARY. In addition, when it completes the update it unselects any resources I had selected. This is truly frustrating. The process of updating tags is fraught with danger because of the library contents moving and resources being unselected.

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Mattillo | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Dec 8 2020 10:27 AM

I agree. Anytime you tag a new book the banner pops up and you are playing whack a mole adding tags to multiple books. I don't remember it being this annoying. Also, even if I don't add any books, any time I restart Logos that banner will pop-up and sitt here from anywhere to 45 seconds to 2 minutes.  Not quite sure why that has to happen every time

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PL | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Dec 8 2020 2:31 PM

Also: Why does it need to update the catalog everytime the program is restarted?

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TWBeining | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Dec 8 2020 2:43 PM

PL:

Also: Why does it need to update the catalog everytime the program is restarted?

That is something I often wondered myself.

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MJ. Smith | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Dec 8 2020 2:43 PM

PL:
Why does it need to update the catalog everytime the program is restarted?

To the best of my knowledge, it doesn't - preparing library is setting up what needs to be accessible in memory or otherwise on your device.

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Rosie Perera | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Dec 9 2020 1:39 PM

PL:

Also: Why does it need to update the catalog everytime the program is restarted?

It doesn't, or shouldn't anyway. Only needs to if you've downloaded new resources and that's why you restarted the program. I got into a state a while back where it had to update the catalog every time I restarted the program, but that got fixed somehow. I don't remember how. So if you're seeing this every single time, even when you didn't download any new resources, then it's a problem and I'd ask Faithlife to look into it.

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TWBeining | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Dec 9 2020 5:10 PM

Rosie Perera:
It doesn't, or shouldn't anyway. Only needs to if you've downloaded new resources and that's why you restarted the program.

I agree with the "shouldn't" and "Only if it needs to" parts. But it does every time I start the program up and has been doing this for years. It is quite annoying.

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Rosie Perera | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Dec 9 2020 5:17 PM

TWBeining:

Rosie Perera:
It doesn't, or shouldn't anyway. Only needs to if you've downloaded new resources and that's why you restarted the program.

I agree with the "shouldn't" and "Only if it needs to" parts. But it does every time I start the program up and has been doing this for years. It is quite annoying.

Something has probably gotten corrupted. I would ask for help from Faithlife Tech Support.

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SineNomine | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Dec 9 2020 5:48 PM

TWBeining:

Rosie Perera:
It doesn't, or shouldn't anyway. Only needs to if you've downloaded new resources and that's why you restarted the program.

I agree with the "shouldn't" and "Only if it needs to" parts. But it does every time I start the program up and has been doing this for years. It is quite annoying.

Hmmm. As a test, what happens if you let it completely index, with all updates and everything, then close the program (bearing in mind that some updates trigger things that require indexing that only begins after restart), and then restart it shortly thereafter? If you do this a couple times in a row, does it eventually stop indexing on launch? It will always try to sync, so make sure that you don't accidentally confuse the two.

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TWBeining | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Dec 9 2020 6:45 PM

SineNomine:
Hmmm. As a test, what happens if you let it completely index, with all updates and everything, then close the program (bearing in mind that some updates trigger things that require indexing that only begins after restart), and then restart it shortly thereafter? If you do this a couple times in a row, does it eventually stop indexing on launch? It will always try to sync, so make sure that you don't accidentally confuse the two.

Indexing is not the problem I have. My program was recently reinstalled and is fully indexed. My problem has to do with the Library Upgrading the Catalog for no reason every time I start the program. I could understand it doing that if I added a resource.

It has done this for years. Did it on the iMac computer I had before this one. The one I'm using now is a PC running Windows 10. Come to think of it, it does this on my MacBook Pro. It does this on both Verbum and Logos.

I am one of those people who go straight to the Library when I fire up Verbum. It doesn't and shouldn't need to update something that is already up to date.

Tim

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TWBeining | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Dec 9 2020 6:56 PM

I have to agree with Veli and Mattillo. It is a moving target and just like whack-a-mole. It does get really annoying when you are in the Library trying to do tagging and such.

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