Urgent & Important Request: WordSearch KJV to be transferred to the Logos Bible Library

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Posts 42
Curtis | Forum Activity | Posted: Mon, May 17 2021 9:28 PM

Dear Faithlife Family and Logos / WordSearch Users: 

I have been a customer for over 10 years and a volunteer missionary in sharing the benefits of Logos products with others.  I'm also a WordSearch customer, too.

Did you hear that Faithlife acquired WordSearch and it's entire digital library?

I was informed that the WordSearch library is being transferred to Logos which is great!     The reason I am sharing this important message and request is because there is a major misunderstanding and oversight with the issue of not transferring the WordSearch KJV Bible.  But I was told that the WordSearch KJV Bible will not be transferred to Logos because the Logos library already has a KJV Bible in the library.   As a result, the e-mail from Faithlife Logos Customer Support stated that they will "retire" the WordSearch KJV Bible. There is only one KJV Bible in Logos (KJV 1900) and it does not have periscopes (ie: headings/subheadings and proper spacings) through the text. I have purchased the printed Bibles such as: The Open KJV Bible, the KJV Study Bible, etc. and they all have proper spacing and periscopes. There is not an option in Logos to purchase a KJV Bible with the proper spacing and periscopes. The reason why the WordSearch KJV is so important is because it includes the proper spacing and periscope which makes it much easier to read and study. Please take a look at the WordSearch KJV Bible here: As you can see, this WordSearch KJV Bible is one of a kind, especially if it were transferred to the Logos Library.   There is only one KJV (1900) in the Logos Bible Library.  It looks like this: Compared to the WordSearch KJV, this Logos KJV is harder to read without the periscope and spacing.  I have made several phone calls to Logos, Faithlife and even WordSearch (Lifeway) and they all referred me back to the forums to make a suggestion. I followed through with the forums but I feel like my voice is not being heard.   Here are the links to my forum entries concerning this urgent and important request: 1.  https://community.logos.com/forums/p/200850/1166936.aspx#1166936   2.  https://community.logos.com/forums/p/183308/1167110.aspx#1167110 I feel like Logos has a valuable resource, asset and opportunity with the WordSearch KJV to be added to the Logos Library and to be informed that they are NOT planning to transfer but to RETIRE it is really bad news. I also called Logos Sales department to see if I could purchase another kind of KJV Bible such as the Open KJV Bible or Study Bible that includes the proper spacing and periscopes but they said they have NO KJV Bible that includes what I am looking for.   I called Logos Tech support and they showed me how I can link the Logos KJV Bible with the Outline Bible so that I can follow along with the other Bible's periscope and then go back and forth with the text. Here is a screenshot of what that looks like below. Even though I found a work around using The Outline Bible, which is an awesome tool, yet this is nothing like using the WordSearch KJV Bible as a good "Go To Bible" -- reading and study Bible.    I am making an urgent appeal that this specific WordSearch KJV Bible will also be transferred to Logos since it is part of the WordSearch Library.  Logos Bible Software has only one KJV and it does not include any headings whatsoever.  This WordSearch KJV Bible makes a great reading and study Bible and would be an asset for the Logos Library.   Here is the information:  
WordSearch KJV Number:  005619461
https://app.wordsearchbible.lifeway.com/library/title/005619461  I am making an urgent appeal that this specific WordSearch KJV Bible will also be transferred to Logos since it is part of the WordSearch Library.  
https://app.wordsearchbible.lifeway.com/library/title/005619461 It is my prayer that Faithlife will transfer the WordSearch KJV to the Logos Bible Software Library. Blessings, Curtis PS: How many of you all would like to see the WordSearch KJV in the Logos Bible Software digital library?
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NB.Mick | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, May 18 2021 2:09 AM

Curtis:
PS: How many of you all would like to see the WordSearch KJV in the Logos Bible Software digital library?

I personally understand your strong feeling that since you owned a KJV bible with very detailed section headings, the Logos Standard-KJV without any headings does not appear to give the same functionality (noting, however, that the Logos standard KJV has much more functionality than the WordSearch one ever had). While there's not always a 1:1 equivalence of functionality, having section headings versus not having them at all is a difference - and Logos is able to support such bibles. 

However, since we've seen the incredible effort it takes to produce a bible, I'm not in favor of Faithlife making an effort to produce the exact same edition of the KJV WordSearch sold (or gave away, whatever it was). In fact, Logos has several editions of the KJV/AV - one of which, the Webster edition of 1833, has nearly the same section headings as the WordSearch KJV (it seems, Wordsearch took those or a similar source and modernized the spelling a bit). So my proposition to Faithlife would be to give a license to the Webster edition to all who owned the WS KJV and ask for section headings (or: to all who owned the WS KJV, period - which would be a very gracious move).

Running Logos 9 latest (beta) version on Win 10

Posts 1831
Ken McGuire | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, May 18 2021 3:32 AM

I thought real KJV users read things like this:

Luke Chapter-24-24B John

The Gospel is not ... a "new law," on the contrary, ... a "new life." - William Julius Mann

L8 Anglican, Lutheran and Orthodox Silver, Reformed Starter, Academic Essentials

L7 Lutheran Gold, Anglican Bronze

Posts 42
Curtis | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, May 18 2021 3:34 AM

NB.Mick:

Curtis:
PS: How many of you all would like to see the WordSearch KJV in the Logos Bible Software digital library?

I personally understand your strong feeling that since you owned a KJV bible with very detailed section headings, the Logos Standard-KJV without any headings does not appear to give the same functionality (noting, however, that the Logos standard KJV has much more functionality than the WordSearch one ever had). While there's not always a 1:1 equivalence of functionality, having section headings versus not having them at all is a difference - and Logos is able to support such bibles. 

However, since we've seen the incredible effort it takes to produce a bible, I'm not in favor of Faithlife making an effort to produce the exact same edition of the KJV WordSearch sold (or gave away, whatever it was). In fact, Logos has several editions of the KJV/AV - one of which, the Webster edition of 1833, has nearly the same section headings as the WordSearch KJV (it seems, Wordsearch took those or a similar source and modernized the spelling a bit). So my proposition to Faithlife would be to give a license to the Webster edition to all who owned the WS KJV and ask for section headings (or: to all who owned the WS KJV, period - which would be a very gracious move).

Hi NB. Mick,

Thank you for taking the time to provide your thoughtful feedback concerning the transfer of the WordSearch library to the Logos Library, specifically the WordSearch KJV Bible.

You are correct.  The "Logos standard KJV" Bible that is in the Logos Bible Software "has much more functionality than the WordSearch one ever had."  That's because with the Logos Bible Software, you can search, cross reference, highlight, etc.

That has nothing to do with my urgent and important request.

As a WordSearch customer, I was informed that Faithlife acquired WordSearch and was assured that my whole and complete digital WordSearch library would be transferred over to the Logos Bible Software library.

As I kept an eye on the list of digital books that were being transferred over to Logos, I noticed that the WordSearch KJV was not being transferred.

Since that was the only reason I used the WordSearch app and website was solely for the reading and studying of the WordSearch KJV, this raised a lot of concern.

I never enjoyed reading and studying from the Logos standard KJV Bible because of the format that it comes in.

See below:

If you compare the Logos standard KJV with other Bible versions, you will see that the other versions are easier to read because of the periscopes and the formatting (not referring modernized language).

But the issue is, I enjoy reading and studying from the KJV Bible. 


The fact that the Logos Library does not include a standard KJV Bible with periscopes is shocking. 


I bought the a few KJV reference Bibles in print such as: The Open Bible and many others and they include periscopes.  But when you buy these KJV Bibles in Logos, it does not come with it at all.  Logos offers you a basic KJV, nothing more and nothing less.

Yes, I could use "the Webster edition of 1833" since it "has nearly the same section headings as the WordSearch KJV" as you stated but I do not want to read and study and memorize from The Webster edition.  I want to read and study and memorize from the KJV edition.

My main point is this, Faithlife/Logos customer service sent me an e-mail and stated that because Logos already has a KJV Bible, they don't see the need of transferring the WordSearch KJV to the Logos library. 

Since they don't see the need to add the WordSearch KJV Bible to the Logos library, they are planning to RETIRE the WordSearch KJV Bible.

Faithlife should keep their promise in transferring all of the WordSearch library to the Logos Library as they promised the WordSearch customers, which would include the WordSearch KJV Bible.

And if they were to add WordSearch KJV Bible to the Logos library, with all the extra functions that Logos Bible Software includes, it would make this KJV Bible much better than the "Logos standard KJV" Bible. 

You mentioned or commented about "the incredible effort it takes to produce a Bible" then went on to say that you're "not in favor of Faithlife making an effort to produce the same exact edition of the KJV WordSearch" Bible available to Logos.

My response is this:

1. Since Faithlife informed the WordSearch customers that their digital library would be transferred over to the Logos library, and since the WordSearch KJV Bible is included in that library, it is of my opinion that it would NOT take an "incredible effort" to transfer this WordSearch KJV Bible to Logos.

2.  Since the Logos Library does not include any standard KJV Bibles with periscopes, this would be a perfect opportunity to transfer the WordSearch KJV over to Logos which would benefit all those who love to read and study and to memorize the standard KJV Bible.

3.  As a WordSearch customer and as a Logos customer, I would really like to see "MY" WordSearch KJV Bible to be transferred over to "MY" Logos Bible Software library as promised.

If you're not a WordSearch customer and if you do not use and appreciate the WordSearch KJV Bible as we or I do, I am not sure if you truly understand where I am coming from and why this is my urgent and important request for Faithlife to fulfill their promise to transfer OUR WordSearch digital library which includes the WordSearch KJV Bible to OUR Logos digital library.

What would be a "very gracious move" in my humble opinion is for Faithlife to fulfill their promise to the WordSearch customers.

The reason that they gave me for not transferring the WordSearch KJV Bible is because Logos already includes the standard KJV Bible.  And that is another reason I spoke up about this issue because it is my opinion that the WordSearch KJV Bible is easier to read and to study from. 

My other Logos KJV Bibles that should have included the periscopes did not come through so I feel like I didn't receive what I paid for especially since the other KJV Bibles in printed format includes the periscopes.

I do, however, appreciate your time and recommended suggestions in using the Webster edition of 1833 and the work around solutions.

Blessings,

Curtis

I decided to contact Logos customer service about this issue

Posts 42
Curtis | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, May 18 2021 3:55 AM

Ken McGuire:

I thought real KJV users read things like this:

Luke Chapter-24-24B John

Hi Ken,

I am not sure if you are trying to be funny or sarcastic but I want to clarify a few issues.

1.  Not all KJV users read, study and memorize from the the original 1611 KJV.  However, I do appreciate the KJV 1611 Bible.

2.  As a WordSearch customer, I enjoyed reading and studying from the WordSearch KJV Bible. 

3.  As a Logos Bible Software customer, I currently use the work around way to best utilize my Logos library which includes the KJV 1900 that does not include any periscopes.

4.  The reason I like to read, study and to memorize from the KJV Bible is because it does not omit important parts of the Scriptures.  If you take a modern day Bible such as NIV, NASB, NLT, etc. and look up Luke 4:4 and Luke 4:8, you will see that they omit Jesus' own words.  There are so many other verses where the translators omit the inspired Word of God.  You can read more here:  https://inspiredwritings.com/bible-versions

Anyway, my point is not to get into a discussion or argument concerning which is the best Bible to read, study and to memorize from.

I am thankful that we have the "inspired Word of God" and I do believe in 2 Timothy 3:16, 17. 

So with this in mind, why omit Jesus' own words in Luke 4:4 and Luke 4:8 and so many other passages in Scripture?

Even with this in mind, I do read and study and cross reference to other Bible versions for comparative study.  It is my preference to memorize from the KJV Bible.  I can't imagine memorizing Luke 4:4 and Luke 4:8 in any of the modern Bibles such as NIV, NASB, NLT, etc.  I want to make sure I am memorizing the complete Bible text, including Jesus' own words.

Again, I am going back to my original urgent and important request that Faithlife will prayerfully reconsider their decision and transfer the WordSearch KJV Bible to the Logos Library as promised. 

When I heard that Faithlife acquired WordSearch digital library, I was grateful that ALL of my WordSearch Library was going to be transferred to Logos and then I would have the full search features and functionality to use with my WordSearch library.

I was disappointed to learn why they were deciding not to transfer the WordSearch KJV because Logos already has the standard KJV.  What they don't realize is that there are a lot of added benefits with the WordSearch KJV. 

That is the main point and message I am trying to get across and to send this urgent and important request to the decision makers at Faithlife.

Logos Bible Software is an awesome Bible study tool.  Wouldn't you agree?  =)

Blessings,

Curtis

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Graham Criddle | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, May 18 2021 4:55 AM

Hi Curtis

Curtis:
There is only one KJV (1900) in the Logos Bible Library.  It looks like this:

This is not in response to the request for pericope headings - I understand that and I believe, from another thread, that Phil Gons is looking into it.

I noted that in your screenshot of the Logos KJV you have one verse per line. Are you aware that you can have it display in paragraphs which results in something more like what you see in Wordsearch?

Image

It looks as though you have the One verse per line option selected in the Bible text only resource filter. Have you tried disabling that and seeing if it is any better?

Posts 42
Curtis | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, May 18 2021 4:58 AM

Graham Criddle:

Hi Curtis

Curtis:
There is only one KJV (1900) in the Logos Bible Library.  It looks like this:

This is not in response to the request for pericope headings - I understand that and I believe, from another thread, that Phil Gons is looking into it.

I noted that in your screenshot of the Logos KJV you have one verse per line. Are you aware that you can have it display in paragraphs which results in something more like what you see in Wordsearch?

Image

It looks as though you have the One verse per line option selected in the Bible text only resource filter. Have you tried disabling that and seeing if it is any better?

Hi Graham,

Thank you for sharing this cool feature.  I will definitely use it.

Blessings,

Curtis

Posts 5506
SineNomine | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, May 18 2021 5:31 AM

Just a brief note to indicate two things:

1. I hope Faithlife works things out to Curtis's satisfaction.

2. A periscope is a tool for seeing over or around objects. A pericope is a group of verses, often Bible verses; in some editions of certain Bibles, editors have added headings at the beginning of at least some pericopes. Unlike "periscope", "pericope" may not appear in one's electronic spellchecking dictionary.

Posts 8200
DAL | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, May 18 2021 6:42 AM

Ken McGuire:

I thought real KJV users read things like this:

Luke Chapter-24-24B John

Man, that’s even worse than Shakespeare! I have an old Spanish Bible in Logos.  It’s called Biblia del Oso 1569 and some of the Spanish looks like old English and some it’s hard to understand.  Amazing how languages evolve over time! 

DAL

Ps. I just checked and Biblia del Oso was either removed from the Spanish Logos website or it only comes included in a base package, but I can’t find it anymore.

Posts 42
Curtis | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, May 18 2021 7:12 PM

DAL:

Ken McGuire:

I thought real KJV users read things like this:

Luke Chapter-24-24B John

Man, that’s even worse than Shakespeare! I have an old Spanish Bible in Logos.  It’s called Biblia del Oso 1569 and some of the Spanish looks like old English and some it’s hard to understand.  Amazing how languages evolve over time! 

DAL

Ps. I just checked and Biblia del Oso was either removed from the Spanish Logos website or it only comes included in a base package, but I can’t find it anymore.

Hi DAL,

The picture of the 1611 KJV is hard to read.  Take a look at this 1611 KJV: https://www.kingjamesbibleonline.org/1611-Bible/

Blessings,

Curtis

Posts 35
Peter Ryan | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, May 19 2021 1:07 AM

As a modern translation user only up to this point, I'd love to see a KJV with pericopes. Looks like some of the print versions include them.

OT: I think the photo posted above looks fantastic - is this the 400th anniv. edition?

Posts 8200
DAL | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, May 19 2021 12:09 PM

Thanks for sharing that link, Curtis! 

Yep, I can read that much better, but the language is old.  I can handle ESV 1901 English pretty good, but 1611 or older is different.  You can figure some stuff out, but it's definitely harder to read.

DAL

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Posts 35
Peter Ryan | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, May 21 2021 1:09 AM

My mistake, not the quatercentenary ed. Tried a sample and the font is Roman. Looks good too though...

Posts 35
Peter Ryan | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, May 21 2021 1:17 AM

In terms of hard copies with pericopes, there look to be a few different versions.

The KJV Filament Bible (Tyndale) contains what looks to me like slightly modified NLT pericopes (there is also an NLT Filament). Some of the other editions (eg KJV Preaching Bible (Nelson)) appear to have different headings.

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Kyle G. Anderson | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, May 21 2021 10:12 AM

Thank you for your feedback. We've discussed it internally and will be producing the WordSearch edition of the King James Version.

It will be available to you either Tuesday afternoon or Wednesday morning.

Posts 8200
DAL | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, May 21 2021 10:21 AM

Kyle G. Anderson:

Thank you for your feedback. We've discussed it internally and will be producing the WordSearch edition of the King James Version.

It will be available to you either Tuesday afternoon or Wednesday morning.

Wow, that is quick! 👍😁👌

Posts 35
Peter Ryan | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, May 21 2021 11:17 AM

Outstanding! Thank you team Faithlife!!

Posts 151
Pastor Cleghorn | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, May 21 2021 11:38 AM

Thank you Faithlife.

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Mattillo | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, May 21 2021 12:11 PM

Kyle G. Anderson:

Thank you for your feedback. We've discussed it internally and will be producing the WordSearch edition of the King James Version.

It will be available to you either Tuesday afternoon or Wednesday morning.

Thank you Kyle

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