Original Languages Study
Since migrating from Accordance, I have been blown away by how Logos is miles ahead of Accordance in studying the Biblical texts. Here is just one example of a layout that I have created for studying the Old Testament. I took my inspiration from BibleWorks that I used to use before I tried Accordance. Check it out:
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I love what Logos can do in researching the Biblical texts in the original languages! Here is how to set up this kind of layout if you want to try it:
1. Set your Double Click Action to SEARCH INLINE and your Triple Click Action to Look Up
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2. Then, from your Tools menu, open Collections:
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3. Then create a collection of your favorite Hebrew Lexicons and then create a collection of your favorite Hebrew theological dictionaries and make sure you click Show in Parallel Resources!:
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3. Then, from the tools menu, select Collections and create a collection of your favorite Hebrew lexicons and then create a collection of your favorite Hebrew theological dictionaries. Make sure that you select Show in Parallel resources:
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4. Then open your favorite Bible and select the Multiple Book View and add the Lexham Hebrew Bible and Ralf's Septuagint with Logos Morphology:
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5. Then drag and drop your favorite English Bible and then open the Lexham Hebrew Bible and drop it at the bottom of your English Bible and link them together with link set A:
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6. Then select the Send Hyperlinks Here in the panel where your English, Hebrew, and Septuagint Bibles are located:
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7. Then go to your English Bible in the right top panel and right click any word in your English text and select your highest priority Hebrew lexicon and it will open to the right of your English Bible and then link it to your English Bible. Then open Parallel Resources in the panel and make sure you check mark Your Favorite Lexicons:
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8. Then, you can hit the Right Arrow key on your keyboard and you can flip through your favorite Hebrew lexicons and hit the left arrow key to go back to your top Hebrew lexicon:
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9. Then go back your English Bible and right click on any word and select your top Hebrew dictionary and open it and move it to the bottom part of the panel where your Hebrew lexicon is located and link it to your English Bible and select the Parallel Resources tab and check your Favorite Theological Dictionaries:
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10. You then can also flip through your favorite Hebrew Theological Dictionaries using the right and left arrow buttons on your keyboard:
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11. Then open your information panel next to your lexicons and theological dictionaries and you can adjust the settings to show whatever word information you like:
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12. Then, from your Tools menu, open the Text Comparison Tool with your favorite English Bibles that you want to see and link it to your English Bible and place it next to your English, Hebrew, and Septuagint panel:
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12. Then, from your tools menu, open your text comparison tool with your favorite English bibles that you want to see and link it to your English bible and place it next to your three bibles on your left panel:
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This looks interesting. I came from Bible works too. I'll give this a try when I have a chance.
Robert
Robert
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Windows 11 -- Max
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13. Then, right click on any word in your english bible and select the specific morphological form on the hebrew word and it will open the search panel next to your text comparison tool. Then click on send searches here on that panel:
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Now that you have the layout created, you can save it and name it whatever you want and close and open it from your layouts button and save your work on it anytime. Here is the awesome thing with this: now you can click one time on any word and it will automatically display your hebrew word information in your information panel. Double click any english word and it will automatically open your lexicons and dictionaries and automatically perform an inline search for the hebrew lemma in your english, hebrew, and septuagint bibles instantly. Right click on any english word and search that specific hebrew morphological form in your english bible. Add the lexham hebrew bible and septuagint with logos morphology and you can search all three for any specific morphological form:
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Many accordance users believe that logos is only for pastors and pew sitters and is useless for any original language work. Nothing could be further from the truth. I have also set up a layout just like this for studying the new testament using greek lexicons and dictionaries and I love it. Logos is so much better than accordance in speed and use in studying the biblical texts in their original languages.[H]
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You can also see the chart of your search results for your specific hebrew lemma that you search for:
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And you can also see a chart of the search results of the specific hebrew morphological form of any english word in your bible that you want to search:
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Here are some screenshots of the Greek new testament layout that I created that is comparable to what I created for the old testament:
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Bravo! This is outstanding! I will be looking at this to compare my current workflows to yours.
Thanks for sharing!!
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Brian Leathers said:
You can also see the chart of your search results for your specific hebrew lemma that you search for:
Lots to unpack here, but on my second pass through your series of posts, I often look at the charts when I run an in-line search. There are two enhancements I would love to see brought to this.
1. I would like to just leave it open and set a target that anytime I click charts, that it just updates the current charts rather than opening another instance in a new tab.
2. It would be so useful if I could click on a bar to navigate to the results of the search in the Bible. This would save me having to go back to my Bible, then key in the book in the reference box to go there.
I'll be unpacking your post for a bit... this is a very nice contribution to the community!
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One more quick post... here is one of my recent Greek layouts.
This is a layout which I call ‘Greek Reading (simple)’ With this layout, I aim to create a single level of tabs that keeps me focused on deep study work and requires minimal movement to and from additional tabs. The trouble with Logos is that I can easily get distracted and go down rabbit holes. There is also a higher cognitive load and friction when I am thinking more about making the software do what I want. Sometimes less is more.
With this said, I want to use the entire pane of tabs as a launch pad for deep research when I do want to chase an idea. So, I don’t want to be unnecessarily constrained; but I also want to focus.
The main elements here are:
- My primary Greek text and NET 2 with translation notes—I have the in-line search bar ready, to search directly in the text and I have double-click configured to conduct in-line searches.
- One of my exceptions to layers of tabs is in this 'zone', where I have BDAG at the ready and linked. Like you, I can use the right arrow key to navigate through my top lexicons,.
- I have configured additional translation notes zone at the bottom to compare against NET 2. There is some duplication, but the different approaches are helpful. I do make an additional second-layer tab exception in this zone as well, where I have the Exegetical Summaries nested behind these notes. I can right-arrow to EGGNT, Baylor, UBS Handbooks, etc.
- I also have information pane set up, with the usual. I particularly like DBL Greek and LN to appear here. This gives me definitions at a glance, plus links to TDNT, DBL Hebrew, Strongs (for historical study purposes) and LN. etc. If I want, I can run a full word Bible study with one click. It also gives me an overview of various translations of the word in different Bible versions.
- In the bottom right I have text comparison, with a number of text families set up on Greek, my main English bibles, comparing the evolution of various versions over time (i.e. ASV, RSV, etc.)
- I keep my notes in a floating Logos pane. I can jump back and forth between this main panel and not tie up space for notetaking.
In general, this means I start with the text in the upper left, then go right to the information panel, examine definitions, then proceed to the bottom left to look at textual notes, and finish with seeing how a number of texts read.
I would love to have a second layout open simultaneously to use a commentary and theological centric workflow to see how scripture has been treated over the years. Because this is a limitation of Logos, I am experimenting with using the web app to see if I can create that step without muddling what I have established here.
Like you, I often use charts and wish they could be used to drill down and navigate. I would love it if we could rename groups of tabs. I wished I could tweak the tooltip popup of parsing information to make it faster/easier to glance at.
As always, this is a continuous work in progress! I'll be digging through your screen shots to see if I can import some of your ideas to improve mine.
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You can use a floating window as a second layout as another option.
Orthodox Bishop Alfeyev: "To be a theologian means to have experience of a personal encounter with God through prayer and worship."; Orthodox proverb: "We know where the Church is, we do not know where it is not."
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MJ. Smith said:
You can use a floating window as a second layout as another option.
Thanks for that. I tried that a few months ago and I hit a limitation at the time that bugged me enough that I set it aside. This is a useful prompt to revisit it again.
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OK, I remember now.
Here's the problem. Unless I am missing something (and I seem to learn something new about Logos every week, even after 20+ years), when I open a floating panel and if I drill into something by clicking a link, I have no control of where the new resource tab appears. So in my tests, it would appear back in my main layout workspace, taking me backwards into my workflow and muddling those tabs.
There are two solutions to this that I can think of:
First, allow for multiple independent or linked layouts to be opened. There is a feedback on this: https://feedback.logos.com/boards/logos-desktop-app/posts/allow-multiple-application-instances. (albeit probably mislabelled as 'multiple application instances) The workaround for this is to run Verbum, and now maybe the web app as it is becoming more functional.
Second, create zones or groups of tabs. So my current layout could have zones of study, but be incapsulated by a tabbed megazone which holds them all. Then you could create and tie another megazone behind it. In my case it might be a Greek Reading Mega-Zone, then a Historical Christianity Mega-Zone. There is a feedback that seems to be some movement in this direction: https://feedback.logos.com/boards/logos-desktop-app/posts/ability-to-create-tab-group and https://feedback.logos.com/boards/logos-desktop-app/posts/rename-tabs
Whether we will any time soon, or ever, see some help in this I don't know. I kind of wonder if at times, Logos should run a contest for people to display and share their layouts and workflows, giving out awards in different categories. This would be similar to some software platforms that give awards for user designed themes and plugins. If this were to happen and more use cases were socialised, perhaps some of the constraints in the current software would be more widely highlighted and new solutions developed.
Without knowing the overall roadmap of Logos, the more I think about the direction of travel with the new dynamic toolbar, the more I am curious if this signals a direction which will exasperate some of what I struggle with in some of my workflows. If Logos really breaks some of what I do, I keep asking myself, where can I go to find a tool that will do what I need with less friction? The options are not good, particularly given the situation at Accordance.
Anyhow, let's see what emerges... I will try to adapt, but I also hope Logos is listening.
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Donovan R. Palmer said:
when I open a floating panel and if I drill into something by clicking a link, I have no control of where the new resource tab appears
In most (all?) cases instead of clicking a link you can drag it - which enables you to place it where you want.
Does that help in this scenario at all?
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Graham Criddle said:
In most (all?) cases instead of clicking a link you can drag it - which enables you to place it where you want.
That merits some consideration. I was taking my usual interaction with the UI into the floating window and this might be yet another workaround to this challenge. Thanks!
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--accidental double post--
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Thanks Donovan. Thanks for the screenshot of your layout. It looks really great and I'm going to incorporate aspects of yours as well. Thanks again for sharing!
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Great post of a method.
Someone should turn this into a Wiki entry.
My own are slightly different...I keep an SBL and a NA28 apparatus on tabs as well as Comfort's NTTTC. I also keep a second copy of my primary bible set to receive hyperlinks so I don't lose my place. (I'm not Hebrew-fluent so mine are Greek-only.)
Nice work.
Eating a steady diet of government cheese, and living in a van down by the river.
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Good stuff, Brian!
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Thanks for sharing Brian! I agree that Logos blows away Accordance for original language research in many areas. I think a lot of Accordance users disparage Logos because they haven't taken the time to learn the intricacies of a new interface. So far, I haven't found anything that Accordance can do that I can't do in Logos. And there are several things I can do in Logos that Accordance will literally never be able to do.
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Mark Allison said:
So far, I haven't found anything that Accordance can do that I can't do in Logos. And there are several things I can do in Logos that Accordance will literally never be able to do.
Smiling, but maybe you haven't used Accordance much (joking). I have a monster Logos OL investment, but still hit Accordance daily. One of my recent favs is the Targum mapping. Similarly, the Cambridge LXX apparatus, and Vetus Latina. Many more.
"If myth is ideology in narrative form, then scholarship is myth with footnotes." B. Lincolm 1999.
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Doc B said:
My own are slightly different...I keep an SBL and a NA28 apparatus on tabs as well as Comfort's NTTTC.
I was thinking about this the other day. In my NA28 texts, I can hover over to get apparatus information, and it made me wonder if it would be beneficial to look at adjusting how this fits into my layout configuration.
Doc B said:I also keep a second copy of my primary bible set to receive hyperlinks so I don't lose my place. (I'm not Hebrew-fluent so mine are Greek-only.)
This is a very good idea... hmmmmm... that would reduce some friction. I'm going to play with this.
I do like the left hand side of @Brian's layout where he has some target tabs, running alongside a group of linked tabs on the right. Hard for me to articulate, but it's almost a workflow that has parallel tracks, rather than a circular track to my current layout. I was engaged in a convo in another thread with @MJ earlier about her use of the term text-centric that might factor into this as well. I'll probably start a fresh layout based on Brian's layout and have a play.
Everyday is a school day!
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DMB said:
One of my recent favs is the Targum mapping. Similarly, the Cambridge LXX apparatus, and Vetus Latina. Many more.
Yes, it definitely depends on your specific use case as to whether or not Logos will work for you. I've worked with the Accordance Targums wordmap a lot, but only in development and not for research. I really hope Accordance will keep the ball rolling with the project. I'm not sure they've pushed any updates since I left. And I had the choice of taking Latin or working with the only computer in the building when I was in high school. I made the right decision, but now the only Latin I know is found on US currency (and maybe a couple of other random phrases) :-)
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The targums wordmap is nice in Accordance, but it only covers genesis-deuteronomy. I would love to see Logos morphologically tag the multivolume aramaic english bible series and the targums project so that we can perform some neat word searches with those and see the percentage differences in those texts in the text comparison tool. That would be very cool.[H]
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Brian Leathers said:
I would love to see Logos morphologically tag the multivolume aramaic english bible series and the targums project so that we can perform some neat word searches with those and see the percentage differences in those texts in the text comparison tool. That would be very cool.
Just me, but I can usually work between CAL/morphs, and Aramaic Bible english. But targums are really hard to do a compare text diffs, for CAL, since Logos Text Comparison works off the lead or 1st book.
"If myth is ideology in narrative form, then scholarship is myth with footnotes." B. Lincolm 1999.
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DMB said:
Just me, but I can usually work between CAL/morphs, and Aramaic Bible english. But targums are really hard to do a compare text diffs, for CAL, since Logos Text Comparison works off the lead or 1st book.
With all the other topics of linking, dynamic resource bar, in-line search, subscriptions, etc.. I am not sure if this will get any real notice by Logos.
With that said, for a while now I have wanted to see if there was any interest in discussing our wish list and ideas for the Text Comparison tool. It is something I use every day and it has not really changed much in years.
My current wish list:
- A friendlier way to manage various text groups and navigate them
- More options to adjust the formatting, layout and demarcation of the text
- The ability to act more like a browser to look pull up all of my texts or a range of texts, then compare them. I suspect that I often have texts I should be looking at, but are buried. (Yes this can already be done to a degree, but there is a lot of friction in the UI)
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Donovan R. Palmer said:
I have wanted to see if there was any interest in discussing our wish list and ideas for the Text Comparison tool.
My most honest answer would be that I'm not terribly interested in enhancing the text comparison tool until the legacy issue of being able to access Bible translations embedded in commentaries is solved. Put another way, being able to compare Bible translations embedded in commentaries is my #1 issue with the text comparison. My #2 issue is dependent upon #1 being solved, assuming the ability to distinguish between commentary milestones and text milestones, I would like to be able to create collections - both permanent and temporary - based on the presence of milestones e.g. a collection of all my resources that contain Mt 5:3-12 text in any language. In other words, I have seismic shifts in Logos to make the Text Comparison tool to be able to do everything I want from it. I suspect these address the third item on your wish list.
However, I am curious as to the details of your second item.
Orthodox Bishop Alfeyev: "To be a theologian means to have experience of a personal encounter with God through prayer and worship."; Orthodox proverb: "We know where the Church is, we do not know where it is not."
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Donovan R. Palmer said:
With that said, for a while now I have wanted to see if there was any interest in discussing our wish list and ideas for the Text Comparison tool.
I'd be happy just for bug-repair. Any standard Bible text entry (eg Logos allowing a numeral, to indicate same book, chapter, different verse) is a complete disaster in Text Comparison. And any new Text Comparison literally changes any previous TCs in my layout. I have 5, and they have to all be opened first, before specifying and saving their contents. Most recently, they also duplicate badly.
But more to your question, personally I'd like some of old Libronix, and early Logos:
- Libronix had a tool to see your indices and which books benefitted. A step further, would be to open them in a TC, or Multibook.
- Early Logos TC supported single verse view, which I'd change to multi-verse view. The work around is a passage list, etc.
- Your TC formatting would be good. Right now, the Samaritan hebrew font is about 1/2 the size of the other hebrew sources, and not much you can do.
"If myth is ideology in narrative form, then scholarship is myth with footnotes." B. Lincolm 1999.
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You can also search for all of the kethiv and qere readings in the lexham hebrew bible as well and see the highlights of those readings in the information panel:
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These are really outstanding @Brian!
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Logos Free Edition has free purchase option Lexham Intro Press Collection (5 Vols) along with freely available Visual Filters that enable range of Greek verbal expression to be seen in a passage: e.g. 1 Thessalonians 5
Information Tool can be configured to show word information on hover OR click (personal preference is click).
Keep Smiling [:)]
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Complex syntactical searches in the original languages in Logos is super easy. I will walk you through my most recent search. (The bhs wivu constituency trees are a must for this particular demonstration) Check this out:
1. Open your library and type in the search window wivu and open the bhs wivu constituency trees:
2. Type Ezekiel 2:5 in the search window of the bhs wivu resource:
3. Next, open a search window on the right side:
4. Next, click on the interlinear icon of the bhs wivu and check as many boxes as you want to display:
5. Next, in ezekiel 2:5, right click on the hebrew verbal predicate to hear and select the gutteral verb grammatical construction and select search next to copy reference:
6. In the search panel right click and paste your selection in the search window:
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7. Continuing in ezekiel 2:5, right click on the hebrew verbal predicate to cease and select the guttural verb grammatical construction and select search next to copy reference:
8. Next, in the search window of the search panel type within 3 words in all caps then right click and paste your selection:
9. Next, in ezekiel 2:5 right click on the hebrew personal pronominal for they and select the verbless clause grammatical construction and select search next to copy reference:
10. Then in the search window of the search panel type within 4 words in all caps then right click and paste your selection:
11. Make sure your top english bible is selected and hit enter and I have 27 hits in 8 verses in my legacy standard bible and you can also see the results in the lexham hebrew bible and swete's and ralf's greek septuagint as well just by adding those versions:
12. And there is our verse in ezekiel:
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Congratulations, you just performed a very complex hebrew syntactical search with just a few clicks. Performing complex syntactical searches in the original languages in Logos is so easy and fun. You can even save this layout and perform searches at any time:
There's even a manual to help explain the different hebrew grammatical constructions that you can perform:
You can have a lot of fun performing complex hebrew syntactical searches in Logos with these awesome tools. I know that I'm going to enjoy these tools. [H]
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You can also add the cantillation marks to your syntactical searches for verbs, etc. Logos makes these complex searches so easy:
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This is pure gold @Brian!
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