A new type of pre-pub - it isn't in print yet!

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Mark Smith | Forum Activity | Posted: Thu, Sep 2 2010 4:40 PM

I know Logos has had a couple of digital-only releases, but this is different. Apparently (from the copy) it will be printed and be available digitally. You sign up to get the volumes as they are completed. Looks like 4 are to be released in 2011.

So for $700 and a long wait you can get a new set of so-far not published and unreviewed volumes. Very interesting.

http://www.logos.com/products/prepub/details/7565

Pastor, North Park Baptist Church

Bridgeport, CT USA

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DIsciple II | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Sep 2 2010 4:51 PM

Mark A. Smith:

I know Logos has had a couple of digital-only releases, but this is different. Apparently (from the copy) it will be printed and be available digitally. You sign up to get the volumes as they are completed. Looks like 4 are to be released in 2011.

So for $700 and a long wait you can get a new set of so-far not published and unreviewed volumes. Very interesting.

http://www.logos.com/products/prepub/details/7565

Yes it is an interesting situation.... a big upfront commitment for something unseen.

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Mark Smith | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Sep 2 2010 4:59 PM

I think I'll have to pass. I am not planning out to 2019 and beyond at this point. It will be interesting to see what will happen with this.

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Bridgeport, CT USA

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Mark Smith | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Sep 2 2010 5:08 PM

Here is more information. Seems the initial work will be digital-only and Logos is the publisher.

http://www.evangelicalexegeticalcommentary.com/about/

Interesting. If I were a younger guy I would probably bite.

Note the blurb about a print edition:

"The digital edition will be unabridged, but an abridged print edition will also be published for those who want it."

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Bridgeport, CT USA

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Rich DeRuiter | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Sep 2 2010 5:41 PM

Mark A. Smith:

I know Logos has had a couple of digital-only releases, but this is different. Apparently (from the copy) it will be printed and be available digitally. You sign up to get the volumes as they are completed. Looks like 4 are to be released in 2011.

So for $700 and a long wait you can get a new set of so-far not published and unreviewed volumes. Very interesting.

http://www.logos.com/products/prepub/details/7565

I did preorder, but mostly to lock in the price. The authors look interesting enough to warrant the price, I think. I'll keep looking into this and decide whether or not to cancel my pre-order later.

The anticipated release dates can be found on this page:http://www.evangelicalexegeticalcommentary.com/volumes/

Looks like the first volume will be out in April of 2011.

 Help links: WIKI;  Logos 6 FAQ. (Phil. 2:14, NIV)

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Matthew C Jones | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Sep 2 2010 5:54 PM

Mark A. Smith:
I am not planning out to 2019 and beyond at this point.

 

They ought to rename it      "The Lord Willing" Commentary  James 4:13-17

 

But I think Logos already knows many of us place Pre-Pubs orders with a "Lord willing" view to completion.

Logos 7 Collectors Edition

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DIsciple II | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Sep 2 2010 6:03 PM

Matthew C Jones:

Mark A. Smith:
I am not planning out to 2019 and beyond at this point.

 

They ought to rename it      "The Lord Willing" Commentary  James 4:13-17

 

But I think Logos already knows many of us place Pre-Pubs orders with a "Lord willing" view to completion.

Big Smile

 

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Rosie Perera | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Sep 2 2010 6:15 PM

Interesting. I wonder what happens if you pre-order this and then, after receiving the first volume or two change your mind and wish not to get the rest. Presumably it would be too late to cancel your prepub order at that point. I suppose you'd have to return those ones since otherwise you're locked into the purchase contract for the rest of them.

Another point to ponder: will our credit cards be charged the full $699.95 when volume 1 ships or only after all volumes have shipped, or will they be charged a percentage when each volume ships?

It's already listed as "Under Development" so it must have enough orders already right off the starting block, or else Logos has committed to share the risk with the publisher if it doesn't sell enough copies.

It is risky dishing out such money for an unreviewed commentary set, but as Richard pointed out, many of the authors are known from their other work, some of which I already have in Logos.

Incidentally, this isn't the first time a commentary has been published in digital form without being preceded by a print edition. The five-volume tome, An Exposition on Prayer in the Bible, by James Rosscup, was never published in print. It was released as a Logos edition only. There might have been other instances, as Mark alluded to. But this EEC does seem like a new concept. Not unlike subscribing to series in print, which has been around for a while. This is now just a final admission that we are really in the digital age.

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Kent Hendricks | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Sep 2 2010 6:23 PM

 

Rosie,

The full $699.95 (or more…if you wait too long to pre-order… Big Smile ) will be charged when the first volume is ready, and then the remaining volumes will download for free as they are completed.

 

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Mark Smith | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Sep 2 2010 6:23 PM

Rosie Perera:
This is now just a final admission that we are really in the digital age.

Apparently that is what the print publisher they approached concluded:

"Furthermore, the publisher could no longer be sure they could successfully market such a massive commentary series. For many pastors and scholars, spending thousands of dollars on a set of print commentaries is a thing of the past."

Rosie Perera:
Not unlike subscribing to series in print, which has been around for a while.

Yes, but those are charged a volume at a time, not the whole set in advance.

One is trusting that the series will not run into financial trouble after you pay your $700, and that it will not be inordinately delayed.

However, if it is completed by 2019 that $700 could look like gas and coffee money by then.

Pastor, North Park Baptist Church

Bridgeport, CT USA

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DIsciple II | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Sep 2 2010 8:08 PM

Rosie Perera:
It's already listed as "Under Development" so it must have enough orders already right off the starting block, or else Logos has committed to share the risk with the publisher if it doesn't sell enough copies.

Logos is the publisher..... and from their tweet its already been five years in the making:

 

 

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Mark Smith | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Sep 2 2010 8:16 PM

Andrew McKenzie:
Logos is the publisher..... and from their tweet its already been five years in the making:

The whole story is in the extra link above: http://www.evangelicalexegeticalcommentary.com/about/

Logos didn't get involved until sometime last year. Seems to be an ambitious undertaking for them, although I suspect their role is mostly funding.

Pastor, North Park Baptist Church

Bridgeport, CT USA

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Mike Childs | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Sep 2 2010 8:17 PM

Don't think I afford the whole set now.  I am still making payments on the NICOT/NICNT set.  But I sure would like to buy some of the volumes as they come out - (especially the John Oswalt volume on Kings.)  I wonder if that will be possible?

Maybe after I finish paying for the NICOT/NICNT set I will take a good look at this.

"In all cases, the Church is to be judged by the Scripture, not the Scripture by the Church," John Wesley

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Mark Smith | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Sep 2 2010 9:35 PM

Michael Childs:
I wonder if that will be possible?

The pre-pub page is pretty clear about the fact that Logos does not intend to release these volumes individually.

Pastor, North Park Baptist Church

Bridgeport, CT USA

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Alain Maashe | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Sep 2 2010 11:28 PM

Logos is asking a lot faith from its customers and providing little when it comes to guarantees.

What if individual books (or even the whole series) are cancelled, delayed, or reassigned? Do we get a refund if the product is substandard or not as promised?

What if after the first volume is published, I realize that the great idea was poorly executed and that the series does not bring anything new to the discussion (besides updated bibliographies)?

The reason why I bought series like NICOT/NICNT, AYBC, BECNT, and other series was because they were known quantities and proven series. While I believe that the authors of the EEC are very capable (as I personally know some of them or have books by most of them), committing $700 of my hard earned money to the ECC requires a leap of faith that only the Lord gets from me.

 

The matter might have been different if Logos had provided one or two volumes that are representative of the series (excerpts or entire volumes like what happened with the CBC series). Additionally, the idea of being charged the full $700 after the first volume with no guarantee that I would get my money worth produces a "critical failure/deal breaker message" for me (from a financial stewardship perspective). It would be something else if I had the option of opting out if the product turned out to be less than all it was cracked up to be (This would not be the first time that a “promising” series with great scholars attached to it ends up being a disappointment).

 

For me to get on board or recommend the upcoming series to anyone (it is still vaporware for now), three conditions need to be met:

 

The structure, goal, layout, depth, and so on of the series needs to be given with much more details in additional to showing exactly how it will be better than what I already have in my library (e.g. NICOT/NICNT, BECNT).

 

I need to get my hands on representative samples or entire volumes and read informed reviews of early volumes.

 

I need to know that my investment is guaranteed against cancellations, delays, or reassignments? This means that I will only be charged for volumes when they are published and that Logos’ failure to honor any part of the contract (cancellations, delays, or reassignments…) gives me the right to opt out of the program without being charged for unpublished volumes.

 

I am excited about the idea of primarily digital biblical resources and this series looks like a very good idea, however, I find the terms to be unacceptable and rather one sided (besides whatever commitment Logos might have made to the potential authors). The idea of loaning almost $700 interest free to Logos for x number of years and part of it for almost a decade just does not compute.

I hope Logos is listening because the ECC appears to be promising

Alain

 

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Scot Wright | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Sep 2 2010 11:41 PM

I think I will pass on this as well. The stipulations and the length of time to publish these volumes is not practical. I will be retired from ministry before I would ever get the oppotunity to use the entire set.  Some of the authors I would consider getting the separate volumes for but it is way to much money for me to put up front with nothing to show for it.

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nicky crane | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Sep 3 2010 12:06 AM

does the refund guarantee within the first month apply if I get the first volume and don't think it's worth the money?

Could we PLEASE have some sample pages from at least one of the volumes to help us make up our minds?  I shall order it, to lock in at the price, but may well decide to cancel my order if not convinced that it's a good and safe investment.  I've decided not to order several commentaries because they are more technical than I need as a non-academic missionary.Hmm

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Tim Hogan | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Sep 3 2010 2:51 AM

If someone gets frustrated because of a pre-pub's release date gets pushed pack (time after time) then what if that pre-pub is already paid for, like when we get the first volume of the set. It looks like it will be good, but I'll have to pass as well.

love the try,

tim

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Juanita | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Sep 3 2010 3:21 AM

I pre-ordered but after reading this thread I going to re-think my decision.  Thanks for all the valuable comments.  And without a sample page(s) to actually see, I won't be ordering it at all.  I agree with Nicky!

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TCBlack | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Sep 3 2010 3:25 AM

As I continue to contemplate this one, I think it provides the necessary exception to the rule that Prepubs are not on the payment program.  I would gladly start a payment program for them, but alas my pockets have bottoms; and coming up with $700 for a sight unseen project hurts worse than taking the next two years to pay it off in monthly installments.

As much as I would like to be a part of this one, I regretfully won't be able to.

Hmm Sarcasm is my love language. Obviously I love you. 

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