A new type of pre-pub - it isn't in print yet!

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DIsciple II | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Sep 9 2010 9:34 PM

Rosie Perera:
. You might enjoy my blog, too, then. Faith & Technology: http://blog.faithandtechnology.org.

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Matthew C Jones | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Sep 9 2010 10:37 PM

Mark A. Smith:
(BTW: I have no problem with digital-only, just Logos-only.)


Mark A. Smith:
One issue that was raised by a commenter was that this electronic version would seem to be limited to Logos-only format, as it seems it will be.


If Logos is footing the entire bill to bring it to fruition, why should they share the bounty at harvest? The other software companies started this "exclusive rights" thing. Maybe Logos is assembling some bargaining chips to trade a few  "exclusives" back and forth, (- say, EEC for John Philips Commentaries & Complete Biblical Library?)

Alex Scott:
OK - I guess I'm a bit confused here.  Are you suggesting that Logos should produce all the volumes and take a financial loss on those that don't sell, or should they just not produce them all so that those of us that might want all the volumes can do without just to satisfy the desires of those that want more for less?

               <edit note: Alex was asking Todd why individual volumes should be made available>
Alex, I did not read Todd's post that way at all. But I could see how you'd take issue with that idea. I would too.

Todd Phillips:
I was just asking why individual volumes are never going to be sold (according to to the website). I can buy individual NICNT volumes in print--can't Logos do the same in digital?


I don't think you can purchase each volume of NICNT individually, can you? And at what price would you? But I said earlier, it appears Logos is committed to the whole EEC project. They don't want to add a few individual volumes, hodge-podge, here and there. So they offer, beg & coax us to get with the program and reward those who do. Nobody is forcing is to buy it.

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Todd Phillips | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Sep 10 2010 5:36 AM

Matthew C Jones:
I don't think you can purchase each volume of NICNT individually, can you? And at what price would you?

Since you asked, here are a couple I'd buy if I still bought paper commentaries:

http://www.amazon.com/Epistle-Romans-International-Commentary-Testament/dp/0802823173

http://www.amazon.com/Letter-Philippians-International-Commentary-Testament/dp/0802825117

Matthew C Jones:
Nobody is forcing is to buy it.

Nope. I'm just pointing out that they will just get my money if they offer the individual volumes eventually.

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M.J.D. | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Sep 10 2010 6:15 AM

This thread has now gone to seven pages and I have not read them all. Hopefully I'm not duplicating what someone else has already pointed out but there is a blog post by John Dyer over at Don't Eat the Fruit that touches on this new series and what it might portend for the future of research and digital books.

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Todd Phillips | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Sep 10 2010 6:34 AM

Mark Denning:

This thread has now gone to seven pages and I have not read them all. Hopefully I'm not duplicating what someone else has already pointed out but there is a blog post by John Dyer over at Don't Eat the Fruit that touches on this new series and what it might portend for the future of research and digital books.

Yep, there's some discussion of it on the previous page (6), if you're interested in reading it.

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Matthew C Jones | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Sep 10 2010 10:34 AM

Todd Phillips:
Since you asked, here are a couple I'd buy if I still bought paper commentaries:

I'm sorry. I thought you were talking about individual digital volumes of NICNT. 

Todd Phillips:
Nope. I'm just pointing out that they will just get my money if they offer the individual volumes eventually.

Another analogy (sorry MJ) : Sometimes I need a socket wrench. I frequently lose sockets when my 2 year old helps me..... After enough of them go missing I need to decide whether it is better to buy a new set or replace the missing sockets individually. I will never need extra sockets sized 3/32  but I save money buying the whole set.

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MJ. Smith | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Sep 10 2010 11:31 AM

Matthew C Jones:
Another analogy (sorry MJ) :

Hey, this one works ... but you haven't given your 2-year-old their own set yet?Wink

Orthodox Bishop Hilarion Alfeyev: "To be a theologian means to have experience of a personal encounter with God through prayer and worship."

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Todd Phillips | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Sep 10 2010 11:57 AM

Matthew C Jones:
Another analogy (sorry MJ) : Sometimes I need a socket wrench. I frequently lose sockets when my 2 year old helps me..... After enough of them go missing I need to decide whether it is better to buy a new set or replace the missing sockets individually. I will never need extra sockets sized 3/32  but I save money buying the whole set.

Yes, but the analogy breaks in many ways: one socket set is like another so there's no mystery as to what you'd get, plus the socket set costs less than $100, and you'd get the whole set at once--not a few a year for the next decade, and if you've already got one socket set, you probably wouldn't buy a second set to compare how they work (assuming the set already contained both metric and SAE sockets) without being convinced that the second set had distinct advantages.

I already own many socket sets in Logos.Big Smile

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Alan Macgregor | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Sep 10 2010 1:31 PM

After consideration … I'm in. Smile

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Matthew C Jones | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Sep 10 2010 1:55 PM

Gotcha Todd!

Todd Phillips:
I already own many socket sets in Logos.Big Smile

WHY do you own more than one set? Whatever motivated you to get multiple sets already, should also work towards selling you on the EEC.

(Please come on board. I need to tell my wife "Everybody else is buying it.")

I

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Friedrich | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Sep 10 2010 2:04 PM

Matthew C Jones:
I need to tell my wife "Everybody else is buying it.

include me

I like Apples.  Especially Honeycrisp.

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DIsciple II | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Sep 10 2010 2:47 PM

Dan DeVilder:

Matthew C Jones:
I need to tell my wife "Everybody else is buying it.

include me

But sweetheart,  everyone else is getting it,  there's Bob, and Jack, you remember Jack, and of course there's Matthew and Dan, and ... oh the list is too long...I just gotta get it,  and all the cool Pastors are getting it too... now you don't want me to be uncool do you ?  Please, I'll remember our anniversary till at least 2019 without your prompting..... tell you what when each new volume ships I'll even buy you flowers and a box of chocolates and we can spend sometime together reading the new volume......

 

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Ronald Quick | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Sep 10 2010 3:54 PM

I'm in - but I haven't told my wife yet.  I figure I have until April to convince her.

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Rich DeRuiter | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Sep 10 2010 4:23 PM

Ronald Quick:

I'm in - but I haven't told my wife yet.  I figure I have until April to convince her.

If you put it on your credit card, you have until the statement comes - probably May, maybe even June. Wink

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Eric Weiss | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Sep 10 2010 8:22 PM

Well, I just convinced myself to pre-order, even though now my pre-pub orders total more than I paid for Logos Platinum, I think. [:)

Optimistically Egalitarian (Galatians 3:28)

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Jack Caviness | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, Sep 11 2010 3:46 AM

Eric Weiss:
now my pre-pub orders total more than I paid for Logos Platinum,

Congratulations. You are now an official Logosaholic! Big Smile

Posts 1
Jeff Straub | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Sep 13 2010 2:31 PM

I sent a long email to Logos about this proposal. Several things come to mind, much of which has already been written. But let me enter the fray

Logos is an amateur at publishing, at least commentary publishing . . . yes, they have done a lot of cranking stuff out that has been written and published by others but taking stuff through the initial editorial process not so much. What do they know about this? They will scream loudly that they are hardly amateurs, but take Dan's last comment as a case in point. He hopes that by showing their seriousness, it will get the writers to speed up . . . Like Eerdmans couldn't get the NIC contributers and T& T Clark couldn't get the ICC guys and Word couldn't get the WBC guys to speed up, what because their writers didn't think the publishers were seriously committed to the projects--their respective series? The reality is that life happens. Scholars die, get sick, get sacked, get . . . you fill in the blank. Wayne House is writing on 4 books . . . sure Philemon should be "easy" but Corinthians? In ten years? Like he is planning not to sleep?

It would be nice to see the proposed format of one, just one commentary. What is it the authors are supposed to do with their commentaries? Technical lexical stuff? Exegetical stuff? From the hype, I see nothing on the proposed content or format. There is a big difference between a TNTC and a BEC and a NIGTC and a NIC commentary. I mean Bock wrote two whole large volumes on Luke. What is there left for Porter to say?Big Smile

An abridged print form? You gotta be kidding . . . who would use that? No prof would allow a student to use it at any reputable seminary. But the digital will be in accessible because you cannot put it in the library, so if you cannot buy it, you cannot use it. No writer can afford to BUY everything they cite and no serious writer would cite an abridgment. So a print abridgment is of little value.

Some of the commentators are not even assigned. Unless God is on the staff of Logos and has made his mind known, not even Logos can guarantee the aggressive timetable. I talked with on friend who considered participating but decided against it because of the overly aggressive time-table.GeekedNo

I think Logos needs to rethink the $700 up front part of this. I wrote to Bill Barrick about my concerns and he replied that "the early bird gets the worm." Well . . . I don't eat worms. And I am also reluctant to "buy a pig in a poke" (sack) for you less literate types.

I love Logos . . . but I am not sold on this 

Jeff Straub

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Paul N | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Sep 13 2010 2:46 PM

Pig-in-a-poke has a great wikipedia article

... I must be a little rusty on my Late Middle Ages English

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Friedrich | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Sep 13 2010 2:53 PM

You have put a lot of thought into this.  The only comment I feel even 5% qualified is regarding:

Jeff Straub:
An abridged print form? You gotta be kidding . . . who would use that?

I would think there'd be a lot of "lay Bible students" etc who'd love a nice recent commentary, especially with all the technical stuff removed.  Especially if they (Logos) deliver on the application part of the commentary.  Just saying, it doesn't seem outlandish.

I like Apples.  Especially Honeycrisp.

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Todd Phillips | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Sep 13 2010 2:59 PM

Dan DeVilder:

You have put a lot of thought into this.  The only comment I feel even 5% qualified is regarding:

Jeff Straub:
An abridged print form? You gotta be kidding . . . who would use that?

I would think there'd be a lot of "lay Bible students" etc who'd love a nice recent commentary, especially with all the technical stuff removed.  Especially if they (Logos) deliver on the application part of the commentary.  Just saying, it doesn't seem outlandish.

True.  But inability of libraries to shelve the full commentaries is a good point, and it seems it would marginalize the set if the unabridged text is only available in Logos.  Of course Logos might have future plans for these issues that they haven't shared with us yet.

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