highlighting Hebrew pronominal suffixes via a filter

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Posts 175
Danny Zacharias | Forum Activity | Posted: Tue, Jan 17 2012 4:48 PM

I think I may have run into a bug.

I have a Hebrew filter I've created and I've set it up so that "@RP" (pronoun suffixed) are colored red.

 

The problem is that the filter doesn't actually identify the pronominal suffix, it identifies the entire word the suffix is on. I know that Logos can tell the two apart, as it parses them both AND in an analysis window it recognizes a pronominal as the next "word".

Am I correct that this is a bug?

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Keep Smiling 4 Jesus :) | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Jan 17 2012 8:58 PM

If using beta Logos 4 version, then recommend posting bug question in PC Beta or Mac Beta forum.

If using stable Logos 4 version, suggest posting in Logos 4 Windows or Logos 4 Mac forum.

Using Logos 4.5 Release Candidate 1 to search Anderson-Forbes Hebrew Morphology for @RB (pronoun suffixed) highlights entire word with pronoun:

Keep Smiling Smile

Posts 175
Danny Zacharias | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Jan 18 2012 4:00 AM

Okay, I guess it is a bug.

 

Question - if the bug appears to be on the PC and Mac (you have a PC and I have a Mac) should it still go into a specific forum?

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Jack Caviness | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Jan 18 2012 4:38 AM

Danny Zacharias:
Question - if the bug appears to be on the PC and Mac (you have a PC and I have a Mac) should it still go into a specific forum?

Suppose you could post in both with a link to this thread.

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Keep Smiling 4 Jesus :) | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Jan 18 2012 6:22 AM

Danny Zacharias:
Question - if the bug appears to be on the PC and Mac (you have a PC and I have a Mac) should it still go into a specific forum?

Logos 4 on PC and Mac share a common code base.  Since you have a Mac, suggest posting in appropriate Mac forum.

Note: personally have Logos 4.5 RC 1 installed on Mac OS X 10.6.8 and Windows 7.

By the way, Logos 4.5 RC 1 has a font slider in Morph Search that works. Big Smile

Edit: posted thread => 4.5 RC 1 - highlighting Hebrew pronominal suffixes ? Bug/Design ? in PC Beta forum with reference to this thread.

Keep Smiling Smile

Posts 5337
Kevin Becker | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Jan 18 2012 6:43 AM

Bug or imprecise application of highlighting from a search/Visual Filter. I initially thought it must be a limitation of tagging but running a morph search cleared that misconception up

The morph search is much more precise in indicating the search for the pronominal suffix.

Posts 433
Vincent Setterholm | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Jan 18 2012 12:38 PM

There's nothing in the way the data is structured that prevents highlighting one lexical segment of a longer grapheme - we do that in search results views. I'm guessing that the issue is one of two things: 1) the developers were just using standard word-breaking characters to define the limits of any visual filter element (or relying on the way surface forms are indexed without reference to the segmentation of a surface form into one or more lexical elements), and/or 2) they tried using the same code we use for search results but were unhappy with the number of dotted circles that imposes in the Hebrew text in the numerous instances where a pronominal suffix begins with a vowel. If you try to highlight or put some other formatting element a consonant without the vowel mark beneath it, or vice-versa, you get at least one dotted circle in the text (more, if other marks like accents are present at the intersecting spot).

A database could be structured to be less fastidious about where to draw the line between one lexical segment and its suffix as a concession to what displays well on a computer screen in conjunction with different highlighting elements. That would make certain searches more difficult to construct (for example if one wanted to find places where the 1cs accusative pronoun is -ani versus -eni versus -ni - they'd all look like -ni without constructing a search to look at the vowel that ends the previous segment). The route the Westminster database takes of including the pronominal suffix with the word it is attached to in one segment avoids most* of these display issues, but isn't as useful for things like reverse interlinears or syntax graphs where these elements really need to be separated out. Perhaps one could write extra code into the way search results and visual filters are handled to prevent orphaned combining marks in the display without changing the underlying segmentation, but I don't know what the performance cost of that would be (and that could introduce some strangeness to the search results in the analysis view where one searches on -ani and gets a list of -ni hits back that happen to be correct, but require looking at the previous segment to understand that the hits are good - though I find dotted circles least disturbing in the analysis view where the segments are broken apart anyway, so the answer there could be not applying the visual filter 'fix' to that particular search results view). (*The one case that would always insert circles is when an article segment is only a vowel letter underneath a preposition, but I think few people would be making visual filters for elements as common as articles and prepositions, so we can probably live with that regardless.) We can kick some ideas around here.

 

Posts 175
Danny Zacharias | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Jan 19 2012 3:54 AM

Thanks for looking into this. I had hoped to use a visual filter highlighting pronominals with my students this semester, but I'm not sure the fix will come that quick :-)

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