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Posts 194
KPK | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Aug 21 2012 1:28 PM

Some of these comments worry me. I just bought the platinum package! 

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JT (alabama24) | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Aug 21 2012 1:53 PM

Janice:
Some of these comments worry me. I just bought the platinum package!

Give Logos a test drive. If you aren't happy, Logos will refund you. 

Out of curiosity… what are your study needs? How do you intend to use the software?

macOS, iOS & iPadOS | Logs |  Install

Posts 743
Scott E. Mahle | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Aug 21 2012 3:20 PM

Janice:

Some of these comments worry me. I just bought the platinum package! 

Forget those comments. And, congratulations! You already own the world’s most incredible Bible study software! Enjoy. Big Smile

 

Logos Series X Pastor’s Library | Logos 3 Leader’s Library | 4 Portfolio | 5 Platinum | 6 Feature Crossgrade | 7 Essential | 8 M & W Platinum and Academic Professional | 9 Academic Professional and Messianic Jewish Diamond

Posts 194
KPK | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Aug 21 2012 3:48 PM

Thanks everyone. 

I have an online ministry and I write, a lot. 

I plan on using logos just to study because I also lead a bible study with 70 women online. 

I just want the software to grow along with me as I'm learning and  to pass it on to my children too. 

I love it so far and have been using it everyday just afraid that one day logos will go out of business and I'm left to myself with no more resources or anyone lol.  I'm aware that technology is always advancing and maybe that's why.

Thanks everyone for reassuring me. 

 

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Jack Caviness | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Aug 21 2012 4:58 PM

Janice:
just afraid that one day logos will go out of business

Of course, that can happen with any business, but some are better positioned for survival than others. Logos is by far the largest company in the Bible Software market, and appears to quite strong financially. All its stock is closely held, so not subject to the whims of the stock market. It is more likely that the others will fade away before Logos does.

On any public forum, there will always be a few "Chicken Little" types for whom disaster is lurking around the next corner. Having said all that, the Mac version does have its problems, but so far Logos development is making regular improvements.

Congratulations on your wise choice of Bible Software.

Posts 93
Robert C. Beckman Jr. | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Aug 21 2012 6:07 PM

I don't want anyone to think of my participation in this thread as negative. I use logos every day. It hardly goes off on my mac. My hope is that Logos does the same thing that Accordance has obviously done: look at the competition and raise the bar. It is an exciting opportunity for any cutting-edge, tech driven company. They know where the competition is, and have a good idea what needs to be done to take their product beyond the current level of the competition. BMW's slogan "the ultimate driving machine." Is not just aimed at the potential consumer, but at Mercedes Benz. "The best, or nothing.", Mercedes, slogan likewise throws the gauntlet down to BMW. The consumer benefits from the competition. If BMW settles for "The Pen-ultimate driving machine" The game is up and a lot of folk switch platforms. Logos claims to be the best. Many of us have voted with our dollars. Now it is for Logos to "re-imagine Bible study; again."

Posts 1506
Wild Eagle | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Aug 21 2012 7:50 PM

Robert C. Beckman Jr.:

..... Logos claims to be the best. Many of us have voted with our dollars. Now it is for Logos to "re-imagine Bible study; again."

Yes

"No man is greater than his prayer life. The pastor who is not praying is playing; the people who are not praying are straying." Leonard Ravenhill 

Posts 757
Fr. Charles R. Matheny | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Aug 21 2012 11:26 PM

Accordance has already issued 10.01 to fix a couple glitches. Thats pretty fast, new version is not three days old yet.

 

Posts 32
Neal Gordon | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Aug 22 2012 4:31 AM

It does look interesting and yes it seems very fast. For me, the main deciding factor is what resources are available. There are so many choices in terms of commentaries and other resources in Logos which Accordance can't really match. Also the prices are very competitive.

On the negative side, I just wish that the mac version was faster, and a bit more reliable (I still sometimes get unexplained crashes).

I do think the Logos guys do great work, but I agree they are diversifying quite a bit with Faithlife and Vyrso, I just hope the rest of the products don't suffer as a result.

Posts 219
Dennis Miller | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Aug 22 2012 5:13 AM

Thanks Jack, love you too bro!!

I guess I just don't like investing in a promise that never gets fulfilled. How many years has it been now and we still don't have the full product we were sold? Would you be so content if you bought a car based upon advertising hype and sales promises only to find out the car you were sold is not the car you were promised? Come's with A/C, that's in a future release, Gets 40 miles/gallon - 20 right now but you'll see 40 in a future release. Built in GPS - that's complete in the other model but we're working to get it going in this one, maybe by end of year. I don't think you'd be too happy especially after laying out a significant amount of cash for your new purchase.

But, down at the other dealer is a nice model, may not have all the bells and whistles of your newly purchased model but everything it does have works as promised and when there is a problem instead of more promises you get results. But, hey your model looks nice, has great specs that beats the competition, but the reality is it doesn't live up to specs but that's OK the potential is there and the salesman told me they're working hard on it and I should have the car I purchased soon or at least in next years model.

So, I wonder Jack, why would I be so critical, because I like to or is it because I'm tired of all the unfulfilled promises from a company and product that was once great?

Posts 11433
DMB | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Aug 22 2012 7:10 AM

Well, earlier this year I had decided to consider A-company, since they seemed to have a customer base that likes the resources I can't get from Logos (that's not a complaint per se).

But I really wasn't too thrilled with an emulator. I'm not a Mac person (see note below) but I also surmised the emulator would logically hold back functionalities that A-Company would build into their mainline product.

But now with a Windows platform, this will work great. I have another Bible software (O-company) which built a windows version but it was just a reader similar to Kindle-PC. Interestingly a good part of my library there is not licensed for the PC. Deja vu. The A-Company version will hopefully have the feature set of the present Mac version.

As you can see, my decision factor is the library.

Note to Mac-ificators: I really never adjusted to the day Steve dumped the Apple II. A mouse? Yeh, right. And what's wrong with the visable little dots making up the screen fonts? They're kind of cute. But most important, was opening the hood, re-installing chips, along an the assembler. That was the last real computer Steve built.

 

"God will save his fallen angels and their broken wings He'll mend."

Posts 194
KPK | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Aug 22 2012 10:54 AM

Phew!! Appreciate that a lot. Thank you! 

Posts 611
Graham Owen | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Aug 22 2012 11:02 AM

Dennis Miller:
I guess I just don't like investing in a promise that never gets fulfilled. How many years has it been now and we still don't have the full product we were sold?

Given that 30th October will be the third anniversary of my upgrade to Version 4 it would be nice to see:

  1. As many of the as yet missing features completed by that date as possible.
  2. A commitment from Logos with dates for any features they cannot deliver by that date.

Personally I think that three years of waiting is long enough.

Once all of the features are completed, I personally would like to see some significant investement in improving performance because SSD and 8GB of RAM seems a bit excessive to me. Areas that need focus are:

  1. Notes, is it really all down to WPF?
  2. Displaying search results - forget the search complete in .nn seconds for me it is not over until the results are displayed.

Until this is all done I don't really care about what the competitors are offering because the reality is I will not be changing from Logos because I have too much invested to start over with another product. My concern is that with the recent announcement from a major competitor Logos will now focus on a raft of new and/or enhanced features to compete for new customers leaving the existing customer base waiting for the missing features. I guess the good news is that if the competitor really is a lot faster then Logos will have to do something to improve performance.

The days when I could consider taking my business elsewhere are long gone so, for better or worse, I'll be using Logos for the foreseeable future and continuing to invest. Somewhere on this journey I hope that I will once again be a happy Logos user rather than one who is becoming increasingly disgruntled and resigned to being 'locked in'.

God Bless

Graham

Pastor - NTCOG Basingstoke

Posts 757
Fr. Charles R. Matheny | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Aug 22 2012 12:33 PM

Dear Graham: Well said and I agree with you. I have both, one for Library and one for search, original language work.

I have no plan of giving up on Logos at this point , however, I have an honest expectation for them to deliver to me the product I bought. At this point, they have failed to do so. Speed and Stability are the two things highest on my list of Logos "needs to do" lists. 

If they could get those two areas up to decent functionality, I would be a very happy camper.-smile

 

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Jack Caviness | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Aug 22 2012 1:39 PM

Dennis Miller:
So, I wonder Jack, why would I be so critical, because I like to or is it because I'm tired of all the unfulfilled promises from a company and product that was once great?

I refuse to become engaged in a debate with you. <Deleted>

Accordance is good, as far as it goes<Deleted> I will use Accordance for language study, the Atlas, and the Timelines—<deleted>

Dennis Miller:
Would you be so content if you bought a car based upon advertising hype

<Deleted>

Had a change of heart Geeked

Posts 1956
Donovan R. Palmer | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Aug 22 2012 2:15 PM

I do like Accordance. There's much that I could say that I like about this new version and in fact there's little I would fault so far... but this is a Logos forum.  

I do agree with Graham Owen, we are heading towards the three year mark of L4. I can't say that I feel like we are there yet in terms of a mature product.  The concept is great, but I am tracking seven issues that I am hoping is fixed in a future release. (all are reported and others have noted them on this forum) The trouble is over the past nearly three years my list has never gone away... even if I use a very liberal view and look to heavily discount issues, I still have never been able to make my list go away.

Posts 93
Robert C. Beckman Jr. | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Aug 22 2012 3:04 PM

I think some of the disconnect is that some of us see the resource issues and the programming issues as entirely separate issues. I have original languages plus additional resources. I want the program to work, whether or not I ever buy another library resource (a.k.a books). For me having more resources is not a feature of the program. Interface, executed actions, speed, foolproof links to other programs; these are programming features. Programming features are expected. New resources are gravy.

Posts 219
Dennis Miller | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Aug 23 2012 4:38 AM

Robert C. Beckman Jr.:

I think some of the disconnect is that some of us see the resource issues and the programming issues as entirely separate issues. I have original languages plus additional resources. I want the program to work, whether or not I ever buy another library resource (a.k.a books). For me having more resources is not a feature of the program. Interface, executed actions, speed, foolproof links to other programs; these are programming features. Programming features are expected. New resources are gravy.

Nicely stated Robert!!Big Smile Exactly!! I love the resources and still purchase many but the program speed and execution is lacking significantly.

Posts 611
Graham Owen | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Aug 23 2012 4:42 AM

Robert C. Beckman Jr.:
I think some of the disconnect is that some of us see the resource issues and the programming issues as entirely separate issues.

Robert C. Beckman Jr.:
Programming features are expected. New resources are gravy.

I think that it is difficult to separate the two even though I would like to because:

  • Our investment in resources is what ties us to Logos and prevents us walking away...
  • The programming issues are what frustrate us and make us consider walking away...
  • The regular introduction of new resources simply adds fuel to this fire, I buy them:
    • On pre-pub to get the best price
    • In Logos because I like having a single system
    • They are not always available in other formats
    • Even though I know it further increases my commitment to Logos

They are also linked because the core engine is free which means that the development costs come out of the revenue generated by additional resources purchased by existing customers and sales to new users. Ironically this means that to get the software fixed I need to fund additional development resources for Logos by buying more books.

God Bless

Graham

Pastor - NTCOG Basingstoke

Posts 1674
Paul Golder | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Aug 23 2012 5:15 AM

Does anyone think that there is a conceivable time in the future where the advantages of the competition outweigh the investment in Logos?

Makes me think about Pradis...

"As any translator will attest, a literal translation is no translation at all."

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