NT Quotes of the OT

Kevin and Bruce, Peace to you!

          Have either of you downloaded into your Logos Note Files the magnificent super-large note file by Kevin Becker who started the group!

That document is listed under the group documents ....

I have been personally working with that file for quite some time now and probably should have posted the odd comment onto this FaithLife group!  I think there's the possibility of some great discussions there; however, I've been so pressed for time lately that I've not been pro-active -- but rather re-active!

If you haven't downloaded that file, I strongly suggest it!         and then compare it with your studies and efforts ....     *smile*             It represents untold hours of labour and is quite thorough and well-done indeed!              Extremely helpful!

          Blessings!               This old guy has to go to bed soon!.......................            eh???

Anyone interested in the subject line of this thread should consider getting Beale & Carson's Commentary on the New Testament Use of the Old Testament while it's 75% off:

http://www.logosmarchmadness.com/2013/round-7-deals/#carson

Bruce Dunning said:

It also has been my experience that not much happens in many Faithlife groups. Perhaps it will take time for them to catch on.

It has been my experience that there's a bit of interest up front when a group gets created and people are invited/encouraged to join, but then the novelty wears off and people go back to whatever else they were doing. Kind of like Google+ turned out to be a big fizzle as far as I'm concerned (most of my friends who opened accounts on it kept their Facebook accounts and don't post anything on G+ anymore).

It's a self-reinforcing problem. If nobody is posting anything good, other early adopters are going to stop visiting after a while.

I don't know how social media gain traction. It seems there has to be a critical mass. And perhaps a felt need that is strong enough to overcome inertia and the pull from Facebook and the forums and in-person Bible studies. Who is really sitting around in their small groups thinking -- gee, I really wish we could carry on this conversation throughout the week online until we meet again? But that's kind of the audience that Faithlife is aimed at. So where's the felt need? That's what I'm wondering?

It's a good concept, and I hope it takes off. But I have my doubts. Nobody in my personal circle of fellow Christians is a Logos user. So I'm not likely to be using Faithlife at all. I gave it a beta trial to see what it was all about, but my general response to it is "meh."

Bruce Dunning said:

Every time I try to use Faithlife I find it totally clunky and not very intuitive. Maybe I just don't understand it or maybe it is just awkward. For instance I tried to find the note file by Kevin Becker and and it took a while. Once I found it, it seemed to be greyed out so that I could not access it.  From this thread it looks like others have also been frustrated.

Peace, Bruce!                        I'm becoming a wee bit fond of you because of your positive and intelligent posts over many a moon and also because you are my neighbour living just North of me!         You are appreciated!            ........... and FaithLife IS awkward!

                    That said .....            I also had difficulty at first learning how to download a document into my notefiles.  But, please keep trying.  Kevin's note is fantastic.  I will be working with it and building on it for years to come ....   probably "splitting" it a few times in the process .....

            (The worst thing about FaithLife "grouping" is there is NO documentation.   I know I'm missing all kinds of things.      I want to do a group with seniors in my own congregation, but I need first to find the time to come up with my own "manual" since I can't find organised notes anywhere on establishing and operating a good group.  This troubles me  ....         however, I am the patient and optimistic sort of guy   (usually ...    *smile*)

          Right now what I need is a few extra hours a day!     *smile*                                ....   AND a MANUAL!

Graham Criddle said:

Hi Milford

Milford Charles Murray said:

I want to do a group with seniors in my own congregation, but I need first to find the time to come up with my own "manual" since I can't find organised notes anywhere on establishing and operating a good grou

Have you seen the video on creating a group (and related topics) at https://faithlife.com/help?

Does it help at all?

Graham 

Yes, indeed!             It does help!           I'd never seen that page before.         Actually, I think I'd better really, really study FaithLife before I start inviting people.  Which I will do!                I think FaithLife might be very helpful in my relationships with my Brothers and Sisters; and I plan to patiently work on the "rough edges"!      *smile*                  Maybe I'll have to write my own .docx Manual???

Rosie Perera said:

Milford Charles Murray said:

Finally back from my peregrinations! 

I love that word! A friend of mine in seminary wrote a paper once on "peregrinatio" as a spiritual discipline, ranking up there with other Latin terms like lectio divina, which encompasses lectio (reading), meditatio (meditation), oratio (prayer), and contemplatio (contemplation).

Amen, Rosie!       *smile*                                                                                                              Peace!

Your post makes me feel good about Luther; and I thank you indeed!

The Attainment of Theological Aptitude

Luther writes in the preface to the first part of his German books in 1539 (St. L. XIV:434ff.): "Let me show you a right method for studying theology, the one that I have used. If you adopt it, you will become so learned that if it were necessary, you yourself would be qualified to produce books just as good as those of the Fathers and the church councils. Even as I dare to be so bold in God as to pride myself, without arrogance or lying, as not being greatly behind some of the Fathers in the matter of making books; as to my life, I am far from being their equal.²⁵⁴ This method is the one which the pious king David teaches in the 119th Psalm and which, no doubt, was practiced by all the Patriarchs and Prophets. In the 119th Psalm you will find three rules, which are abundantly expounded throughout the entire Psalm. They are called: Oratio, Meditatio, Tentatio." Matthias Hafenreffer, professor of theology and chancellor of the university of Tuebingen (d. 1619), places this axiom of Luther at the head of his dogmatics,²⁵⁵ at the same time expanding it on the basis of Scripture and applying it to conditions of his day. Among the theologians of the last century Rudelbach (d. 1862) had this to say in an address on Luther’s instruction as to the study of theology: "You are familiar with the great word of Luther: Oratio, meditatio, tentatio faciunt theologum. This word comprises our entire theological methodology. Here, just as is the case with every thought sealed by the Spirit of God, there is nothing to add, nothing to subtract." ²⁵⁶There can be no doubt that the distressing lack of true teachers would be quickly ended if Luther’s methodology were observed everywhere.

Luther explains the necessity of the oratio thus: "First, you should know that Holy Scripture is a book such as will make the wisdom of all other books appear as folly, since no book teaches anything concerning eternal life but this one alone. Therefore you should straightway despair of your own wit and intellect, for with them you will attain nothing, but by such arrogance y        (Sorry ...    a bit long ....    could go on and on; however, will just read it again for myself    ..      *smile*          If anyone wants me to continue re. meditation, tentatio faciunt theologum, please respond to this post or start a new thread, and I'll give you ...  "the rest of the story" ......... )

^[1] Pieper, F. (1953). Vol. 1: Christian Dogmatics
(electronic ed.) (186–187). St. Louis: Concordia Publishing House.

Bruce Dunning said:

That word caught my attention too but I must confess it is not a regular part of my vocabulary.

per·e·gri·na·tion

[per-i-gruh-ney-shuhn] noun 1. travel from one place to another, especially on foot. 2.a course of travel; journey.

You probably were aware of the word's root without realizing it: peregrine falcons are so named because of their migratory habits.

Bruce Dunning said:

Again this is a great example at how clunky Faithlife is..... It should be easier than this.

alabama24 said:

For example: If I ask 10 questions about a chapter in a book - How do you separate responses to each question?

What if you asked each question in a post

then they would reply to each post as to a thread

Question one

john's reply one

jane's reply one

etc     I took the admin responsibility for the group for my church [some one had to fix the phone number] Had someone post three posts and I could reply to each and faith life seems to keep each thread together - only did a simple one reply to each test.

EDIT: Ask question number 10 first! so that question number 1 will list first - if you ask question one first it will be on the bottom

alabama24 said:

David - Deep and Wide Discussion Group in Faithlife. You can see how our discussion went. 

OK, joined and looked at the group,  got the book - will not make sense if I don't read it.  Answered the first question.  [repeated below]

Question: What made you want to read Deep & Wide? Have you read anything by Andy Stanley before? If so, what? Have you ever visited North Point Church (or one of its campuses)?

Answer:

""alabama24 asked me to 'review' this group so, as it was only $13, I got a copy.

No, I have never read anything by Andy Stanley.

And No to visiting that church.

May take until Monday to read that section [2013/04/08] [yr mo da the only correct way to list dates] [imho]""

Maybe if you let a few of us review that group 'WE' can make the next one work better [that is maybe hold off for a while for feed back]

Looked this up on Amazon. Based on the subtitle of this book, I decided to read the 1's. To be sure, there aren't many, and the book is a solid 5 stars,which is hard to pull off when your book has more than a dozen or so reviews. But for me, the tornado sirens went off when I looked at the full title, and the first review here confirmed exactly what I would expect to gather from the book if I read it myself. I won't be reading it myself.

David Paul said:

But for me, the tornado sirens went off when I looked at the full title, 

When I finish reading it I will get back to you.  That review is my first guess about the book but as we were also asked to comment on Faith life as a discussion media have to read the book to join in the discussion.  Will try to keep an open mind until after reading the last page. [just as if I was on Jury Duty and that book was the defendant] 

alabama24 said:

I love the subject line of the "one star" review: I dislike this book because he is right!

I'll take that any day.

I think what he meant by that is that people are easily sucked into phenomena that appeal to them. The summation he gives--these principles will fill stadium seats whether God is involved or not--is the point. What I gather from the statement is that he means "this author makes the case that sheeple are easily manipulated and can be allured with creature comforts, glitz, and soothing messages." If that's the message of the book, then the reviewer is right...the author is right.

fgh said:

David Ames said:

Make up the identity of your dreams and use that

The way Faithlife is designed you have to use the same identity as in your Logos account.

alabama24 said:

Sounds good. It took me a while to find your post, but eventually I got there. 

Have answered the next question [define church]

Yes, the forums are more useful. 

Also it took me three posts to post my current answer - was too long.

[at this point we are still in the section where he is telling what he did]
The interesting part will be when he starts "guiding" us into reforming to his way.
[Where most of us are "locked" into some version of church rules handed down by our denomination.]

Have given you simple answers as my main purpose is to comment on the usability of faith life.

it is lacking - too hard to find old stuff - you can not just jump to question one and all its answers with out reading all the other questions.  and if some one comes in late [as I did] they are going to get frustrated real fast.  [what if you had had 200 members?] 

David Ames said:

David Paul said:

But for me, the tornado sirens went off when I looked at the full title, 

When I finish reading it I will get back to you.  

David Paul: update: am about half way though.  Two statements he made:

"Jesus didn’t try to balance grace and truth. He didn’t water down the law. He didn’t put a condition on grace. He gave her a full dose of both."

"It is our misunderstanding of the grace Jesus modeled and taught that leaves us feeling as if grace allows people to “get by” with things. It is often our misapplication of truth that leaves people feeling condemned and isolated."

Later he mentioned his visit to a church and left his child in the children's division. They did not require signing the child in. It bothered him. Have mentioned that to the children's division leader at my church. We will be putting a sign in procedure for visiting children. That thought alone paid for my copy of the book. And that was just a statement he made in passing.

Jury is still out on the book over all.