Dutch translation mistake

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This post has 13 Replies | 3 Followers

Posts 116
Piet Huttenga | Forum Activity | Posted: Tue, Sep 24 2013 7:56 AM

How can I make you aware of a translation mistake in the Dutch version? The word "Klasiekers" (for Classic texts) should be "Klassieken". ("Klasiekers" looks very ugly, not to blame you, but I think it is important to correct this mistake.

Thank you very much for the Dutch version (and also the possibility for choosing other language versions,

Piet

Posts 195
LogosEmployee
Seth Copeland | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Sep 24 2013 9:42 AM

Piet Huttenga:

How can I make you aware of a translation mistake in the Dutch version? The word "Klasiekers" (for Classic texts) should be "Klassieken". ("Klasiekers" looks very ugly, not to blame you, but I think it is important to correct this mistake.

Thank you very much for the Dutch version (and also the possibility for choosing other language versions,

Piet

Hi,

Thanks for the suggestion. We use crowdin.net to provide most of our translations.

If you logon here you can see all the translations for all the strings.

http://crowdin.net/translate/logos-desktop-ui

It is open to anyone, so if you simply sign up, click on Dutch, click on any file, and it should bring up the list of translations. I typically then go to the project tab, click All Strings (this will search all files, not just the one you clicked on), and then searching should find it.

That particular string you mentioned is located here.

http://crowdin.net/translate/logos-desktop-ui/35/en-nl#14116

If you ever see bad translations, you can go to crowdin, find the string, there you can ask for more context, create an issue indicating the source string or translation is bad, down vote bad translations, up vote good translations, or provide your own translations. The ones with the highest votes, (or more often, the only translation provided), or whatever one has been approved by a proofreader will make it into the next release. We don't have proofreaders for many languages yet, but hopefully down the road we will.

I can provide the translation you suggested, for that string, and feel free to post about any other translation mistakes, or you can login and provide better ones yourself.

Thanks,

Seth Copeland

Logos SW Development

Posts 7874
LogosEmployee

Seth Copeland:

Thanks for the suggestion. We use crowdin.net to provide most of our translations.

As Seth said, the current translations are crowd-sourced, so you may see mistakes or poor-quality translations. (However, you can also correct them.)

In Bob's announcement of this project, he mentioned that we do eventually plan to hire translation managers for some of these languages to ensure a uniformly high-quality translation. We do not currently have a translation manager for Dutch.

Posts 116
Piet Huttenga | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Sep 24 2013 3:56 PM

I think that the approach quoted below only will work if the proof reader is qualified.

"If you ever see bad translations, you can go to crowdin, find the string, there you can ask for more context, create an issue indicating the source string or translation is bad, down vote bad translations, up vote good translations, or provide your own translations. The ones with the highest votes, (or more often, the only translation provided), or whatever one has been approved by a proofreader will make it into the next release."

I have a degree in my own language (doctorandus, which is similar to MA) and have some experience as a proof reader, so if you want you could hire me for this job.

(not full time, but I would be willing to go over the Dutch menu items)

Greetings,

Piet

Posts 116
Piet Huttenga | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Sep 10 2015 3:41 PM

Dear all,

So far there are improvements, but there are still some serious mistakes in the Dutch translations. I think that you should not let the changes be decided by votes, but by somebody really qualified.

I have decided for the moment to choose English as the language so that I do not have to see the mistakes. I am happy that you did not choose the same approach for the English. It feels as if you do not take my language really serious.

Greetings,

Piet

Posts 570
HansK | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Sep 10 2015 4:11 PM

Pas het dan aan drs. Piet zoals aangegeven en begin niet te klagen :-)

Nederlands is geen wereldtaal en geen prioriteit voor FL.

Ik gebruik trouwens standaard Engels omdat de meeste boeken ook in het Engels zijn.

Hartelijke groeten van Hans

MacOS Sierra / Logos 7 Collector's Edition & All Base Packages / Logos Now

Posts 9945
George Somsel | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Sep 10 2015 4:35 PM

HansK:

Pas het dan aan drs. Piet zoals aangegeven en begin niet te klagen :-)

Nederlands is geen wereldtaal en geen prioriteit voor FL.

Ik gebruik trouwens standaard Engels omdat de meeste boeken ook in het Engels zijn.

Hartelijke groeten van Hans

Why should he not complain?  I would if it was a poor translation into my language.

george
gfsomsel

יְמֵי־שְׁנוֹתֵינוּ בָהֶם שִׁבְעִים שָׁנָה וְאִם בִּגְבוּרֹת שְׁמוֹנִים שָׁנָה וְרָהְבָּם עָמָל וָאָוֶן

Posts 116
Piet Huttenga | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Sep 10 2015 11:31 PM

Hi Hans and George,

I do complain, since I think that the approach does not work.

Let me give an example. The word "prioriteren" was used. -eren is a good suffix to add to for instance a noun to make it into a verb, compare format and formatteren, but the word "prioriteren" does not exist in Dutch. "prioritize" is difficult to translate. Maybe we could go for a noun "prioriteit" (priority) which does exist, or "verander prioriteit" (change priority) which would be possible. Or maybe go a bit further away from the original "prioritize". A possibility would be just to use "voorkeur" (preference), which in my opinion would be a simple solution which would work. "verander voorkeur" would also be possible, but in my opinion not necessary.

I agree that translation is not easy and implies choices and that it would be good to have the input of several Dutch speakers. My choice "voorkeur" does not have to be the best. But it would be good to have another procedure how to deal with this input. I have no objection against  other native speakers making suggestions, but this should not be a matter of voting. I appreciate the effort that the children of Dutch immigrants and American students of Dutch may put into this, but they should not be allowed to vote on this. And voting is not the solution. Democracy is not the solution for everything. Although the opinion of the world may be that what the majority thinks is right and have no absolute standards, I hope that you agree that there are some standards towards what is proper Dutch and not proper Dutch. I agree that languages are changing, but there are rules. I think that somebody/a committee who is/are a specialist/specialists should have the final say in this. If the decision is only based on voting the result will always be lacking. (hopefully good English). So I am in favour of a different approach. Maybe Logos should ask some volunteers among the Dutch native speakers who use Logos to form a committee to address this issue. Or hire some specialists to do the job.

I don't know whether you have read some of the earlier user manuals in English produced by the Chinese - I think that they are getting better now. They gave the impression that the product you are buying is of poor quality. The poor Dutch (but a bit improving) gives a similar impression and I don't think that this is necessary. Why not go for a good solution.

Piet

Posts 116
Piet Huttenga | Forum Activity | Replied: Thu, Sep 10 2015 11:55 PM

Sorry Seth, I overlooked your message:

"In Bob's announcement of this project, he mentioned that we do eventually plan to hire translation managers for some of these languages to ensure a uniformly high-quality translation. We do not currently have a translation manager for Dutch."

My reaction to this would be: Why do you already use the intermediate results, which give a bad impression and do not really help for a better understanding. (Most Dutch people are highly proficient in English and especially the ones who have bought Logos so far do not need a poor Dutch translation). As I mentioned before, I would be willing to help part time or be involved in a committee, but I see not much use in this crowdin.net approach. See above. (if this message indeed appears below Smile I am looking forward to the appointment of a translation manager for Dutch and may eventually not last too long. If you really would like to reach the wider Dutch market, you will have to put much more effort in this!!!!

Piet

Posts 116
Piet Huttenga | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Sep 11 2015 12:02 AM

Sorry for the bracket I missed. The smiley already had a bracket.

(Smile)

Posts 116
Piet Huttenga | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Sep 11 2015 12:13 AM

Dear George,

Thank you for your support! The Hebrew quote of Ps 90:10 gives the impression that you are one of the strong people, is that right? Smile

Posts 116
Piet Huttenga | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Sep 11 2015 12:53 AM

Beste Hans,

Het verbeteren in crowdin.net is niet zo eenvoudig. Ik vond een lijst van 5 bladzijden, maar niet direkt de zin waarvoor ik een verbetering wilde voorstellen. Ik wil wel alle voorbeelden doornemen, maar dat gaat behoorlijk veel tijd kosten en als er daarna alleen maar over gestemd gaat worden, weet ik niet of dat wel de moeite waard is en bovendien heb ik het druk met andere dingen. Het zou mooier zijn als je ook bij de menu items een typo kon doorgeven. One thing at a time.

Trouwens, ik gebruik ook liever het Engels om dezelfde reden.

Hartelijke groeten,

Piet

Posts 9945
George Somsel | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Sep 11 2015 1:02 AM

Piet Huttenga:

Dear George,

Thank you for your support! The Hebrew quote of Ps 90:10 gives the impression that you are one of the strong people, is that right? Smile

But of course !  After all, the name comes from 'Samson.'  Wink  (I do cut my hair regularly)

george
gfsomsel

יְמֵי־שְׁנוֹתֵינוּ בָהֶם שִׁבְעִים שָׁנָה וְאִם בִּגְבוּרֹת שְׁמוֹנִים שָׁנָה וְרָהְבָּם עָמָל וָאָוֶן

Posts 80
Joseph | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Sep 11 2015 5:30 PM

Piet Huttenga:

Sorry Seth, I overlooked your message:

"In Bob's announcement of this project, he mentioned that we do eventually plan to hire translation managers for some of these languages to ensure a uniformly high-quality translation. We do not currently have a translation manager for Dutch."

My reaction to this would be: Why do you already use the intermediate results, which give a bad impression and do not really help for a better understanding. (Most Dutch people are highly proficient in English and especially the ones who have bought Logos so far do not need a poor Dutch translation). As I mentioned before, I would be willing to help part time or be involved in a committee, but I see not much use in this crowdin.net approach. See above. (if this message indeed appears below Smile I am looking forward to the appointment of a translation manager for Dutch and may eventually not last too long. If you really would like to reach the wider Dutch market, you will have to put much more effort in this!!!!

Piet

Actually they are hiring for this position now. It is an onsite job in Bellingham

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