Surface Go and Logos
I picked up a new Microsoft Surface Go on Thursday. This is a 10-inch tablet that looks just like a Surface Pro. It is designed and crafted with the same attention to quality as the Surface Pro. I got the version with 8GB RAM and a 128GB NVMe SSD. There also is one that has 4GB of RAM and a 64 eMMC drive, but I wouldn't recommend that. The tablet weighs 1.15 lbs. without the keyboard. The keyboard must be purchased separately.
The weakest point of this tablet is the processor, an Intel Pentium Gold 4415Y, that runs at 1.6 GHz with no turbo boost. The graphics chipset with the Pentium Gold 4415Y is the Intel HD Graphics 615, which is supposed to be an improved graphics chip.
The Surface Go comes with Windows S on it, which means that out of the box you can only install programs from the Microsoft Store. This, of course, means you can't install Logos on it. But a 10 second free fix changes that and you have Windows 10 Home running instead.
You'd think with a processor like the Intel Pentium Gold 4415Y that Logos wouldn't run acceptably, but I can tell you that Logos runs pretty well on it. After a fresh boot, it's about 45 seconds to launch Logos and get to my layout. Once inside the program, two key things -- being able to rearrange windows easily and smoothly scroll through open windows with the pen or touch -- work pretty well.
It is a fanless computer and so that could mean it could get hot, but it certainly doesn't get hot when running normally. The heat rises when indexing or charging, but that is all I have noticed.
It took approximately 2.5 hours to download and index Logos for the first time (my Logos data folder is just under 36GB). I thought that was pretty good. Credit my fast wifi connection at work and the NVMe SSD for that.
Projecting to my 27-inch Dell monitor with Microsoft's USB-C to HDMI dongle worked flawlessly, but another dongle I had didn't work, so I guess all USB-C to HDMI dongles aren't created equally.
I haven't had a chance to really gauge battery life. There are some concerns with this, given that the Go has a 26.1Wh battery pack. For comparison, the Surface Pro has a 45Wh pack and the 2018 iPad, 32.9Wh.
Let me emphasize that this should not be your main computer, but if you are looking for a smaller device that lets you run the full version of Logos with all of your PBBs (unlike the iPad or Android mobile apps), then you may want to take a look. Taking sermon notes this morning in One Note was great! 
Comments
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Thanks for the great review Bill
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Bill, you are always so complete and helpful in your reviews. THANK you!!
For those who see the title of this thread and are unaware, Logos does have a Community Pricing project - https://www.logos.com/product/50060/windows-universal-bible-app
And a uservoice that currently has the 3rd most votes - https://logos.uservoice.com/forums/42823-logos-bible-software-7/suggestions/619605-focus-on-tablet-and-touchscreen-features
Making Disciples! Logos Ecosystem = LogosMax on Microsoft Surface Pro 7 (Win11), Android app on tablet, FSB on iPhone & iPad mini, Proclaim (Proclaim Remote on Fire Tablet).
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OK, thanks Bill for that review. Because of that review I went out and got a Surface Go as well. I got the 128 gig version. I have a very large library. It is actually right over 80 gigs for the download, because of that I decided to put the library on an external card. I have been pleasantly surprised at how well it does with the program. It seemed like forever to get everything downloaded and indexed but once it is all there I have been very impressed with how it has handled it all.
I am coming from a 13 inch MBP with 16 gigs of ram and 1 TB drive and honestly I can say that it does almost as well.
The only thing I have found to be frustrating is that when it is PREPARING LIBRARY (which seems to happen way too often) it gets really slow. Thanks for the review and if you know any key for it to stop preparing the library when nothing new is in there let me know.
The form factor of this device is amazing seeing that I can walk around and study from right at 55,000 resources. Thanks again.
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Chris Gardner said:
OK, thanks Bill for that review. Because of that review I went out and got a Surface Go as well. I got the 128 gig version. I have a very large library. It is actually right over 80 gigs for the download, because of that I decided to put the library on an external card. I have been pleasantly surprised at how well it does with the program. It seemed like forever to get everything downloaded and indexed but once it is all there I have been very impressed with how it has handled it all.
I am coming from a 13 inch MBP with 16 gigs of ram and 1 TB drive and honestly I can say that it does almost as well.
The only thing I have found to be frustrating is that when it is PREPARING LIBRARY (which seems to happen way too often) it gets really slow. Thanks for the review and if you know any key for it to stop preparing the library when nothing new is in there let me know.
The form factor of this device is amazing seeing that I can walk around and study from right at 55,000 resources. Thanks again.
I am glad to hear you are liking the SG, Chris. Yes, when Logos is indexing, things slow down. It might be slower in your case because you have your library on the SD card. Has your SG completed its initial index?
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Yes, I have used it for 10 days after indexing. The preparing library makes no sense to me, sometimes it does it when I open Logos and it takes 30 minutes and sometimes it takes 3 hours.
I have prepped from start to finish 3 different messages, so far so good.
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and I forgot to say sometimes it doesn't do that at all and it works perfectly.
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Thank you, Bill. Very helpful review.
"In all cases, the Church is to be judged by the Scripture, not the Scripture by the Church," John Wesley0 -
Bill Anderson said:
I am glad to hear you are liking the SG, Chris. Yes, when Logos is indexing, things slow down. It might be slower in your case because you have your library on the SD card. Has your SG completed its initial index?
I'd just add to what Bill said that if you get a microSD card, consider getting one that's fast. Here's what I've been using on my Surface Pro (2017), although I haven't moved my library resources to it. That said, it has worked great for everything else. I much prefer it to the slower card that I used for my old Surface 3 (non-Pro model).
https://www.amazon.com/SanDisk-Extreme-128GB-microSDXC-UHS-3/dp/B06XX3X9JD
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Adam Olean said:
I'd just add to what Bill said that if you get a microSD card, consider getting one that's fast.
Great point Adam!! many people do not realize that all microSD cards are NOT the same speed.
Making Disciples! Logos Ecosystem = LogosMax on Microsoft Surface Pro 7 (Win11), Android app on tablet, FSB on iPhone & iPad mini, Proclaim (Proclaim Remote on Fire Tablet).
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Thanks Adam, I have a card that is very fast. I do videography on the side with 4k cameras so I made sure it was a fast card. I honestly can say that I love the experience of the Surface Go just have some issues starting out some times until the preparing library thing goes away.
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Bill, thanks for your review. I am, however, not having such an easy go at logos on my new surface go. I have tried several times without success to download the windows version of logos on this tablet and have continued to receive an error stating "Setup as unable to download a required file." I apologize if this issue has already been mentioned in other forums but I was not able to find any related information. Please help??
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Jadrian,
Welcome to the Logos forums. I am sorry you are having trouble. Just to ask the obvious, did you take your Surface Go out of Windows S mode? You won't be able to install Logos until you do.
Bill
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Actually, this is a great question Bill and yes I did take it out of S mode. I do not believe I would have been able to download it in s mode.
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Adam Olean said:Bill Anderson said:
I am glad to hear you are liking the SG, Chris. Yes, when Logos is indexing, things slow down. It might be slower in your case because you have your library on the SD card. Has your SG completed its initial index?
I'd just add to what Bill said that if you get a microSD card, consider getting one that's fast. Here's what I've been using on my Surface Pro (2017), although I haven't moved my library resources to it. That said, it has worked great for everything else. I much prefer it to the slower card that I used for my old Surface 3 (non-Pro model).
https://www.amazon.com/SanDisk-Extreme-128GB-microSDXC-UHS-3/dp/B06XX3X9JD
Please be patient with this question. I have a Surface Pro 3 and I am running out of room with a large library. My Surface doesn't have a slot for a SD card but it does have a USB port. Is there a storage solution for models that lack the SD port or am I sunk?
Meanwhile, Jesus kept on growing wiser and more mature, and in favor with God and his fellow man.
International Standard Version. (2011). (Lk 2:52). Yorba Linda, CA: ISV Foundation.
MacBook Pro MacOS Sequoia 15.4 1TB SSD
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Beloved said:
Please be patient with this question. I have a Surface Pro 3 and I am running out of room with a large library. My Surface doesn't have a slot for a SD card but it does have a USB port. Is there a storage solution for models that lack the SD port or am I sunk?
hi Beloved,,
Firstly are you sure your machine doesn't have a micro SD slot ? I have an older model than you and the SD slot is difficult to find but it is there
This may help
https://www.lovemysurface.net/add-a-micro-sd-card-to-surface-tablets/
If not you can get a USB stick that takes microSD cards. You may just want to run it off the USB itself. If you have USB 3 then it will be very fast. If it is USB 2 then unfortunately it won't be :-)
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Dave Thawley said:Beloved said:
Please be patient with this question. I have a Surface Pro 3 and I am running out of room with a large library. My Surface doesn't have a slot for a SD card but it does have a USB port. Is there a storage solution for models that lack the SD port or am I sunk?
hi Beloved,,
Firstly are you sure your machine doesn't have a micro SD slot ? I have an older model than you and the SD slot is difficult to find but it is there
This may help
https://www.lovemysurface.net/add-a-micro-sd-card-to-surface-tablets/
If not you can get a USB stick that takes microSD cards. You may just want to run it off the USB itself. If you have USB 3 then it will be very fast. If it is USB 2 then unfortunately it won't be :-)
I looked for it in the past. I took it to Geek Squad they told me that my model didn't have one. How can I distinguish between the two USB ports? Thanks, Dave.
Meanwhile, Jesus kept on growing wiser and more mature, and in favor with God and his fellow man.
International Standard Version. (2011). (Lk 2:52). Yorba Linda, CA: ISV Foundation.
MacBook Pro MacOS Sequoia 15.4 1TB SSD
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Never mind, from the illustration in your link my model does indeed have a slot [:D]
Thanks Large!!!
Meanwhile, Jesus kept on growing wiser and more mature, and in favor with God and his fellow man.
International Standard Version. (2011). (Lk 2:52). Yorba Linda, CA: ISV Foundation.
MacBook Pro MacOS Sequoia 15.4 1TB SSD
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Another tech dummy question. What file is my Logos library in? How do I find it?
Meanwhile, Jesus kept on growing wiser and more mature, and in favor with God and his fellow man.
International Standard Version. (2011). (Lk 2:52). Yorba Linda, CA: ISV Foundation.
MacBook Pro MacOS Sequoia 15.4 1TB SSD
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Beloved said:
Another tech dummy question. What file is my Logos library in? How do I find it?
https://wiki.logos.com/Quick_Installation_onto_multiple_computers gives some pointers as to locations.
If you right-click the Logos icon, then select "Logos Bible Software" and Properties you should get the option to "Open File Location".
That will open to the top-level Logos directory with everything else depending on that.
The actual library files are stored in Data/uniqueid/ResourceManager/Resources under there
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Thanks, Grande Graham!
Meanwhile, Jesus kept on growing wiser and more mature, and in favor with God and his fellow man.
International Standard Version. (2011). (Lk 2:52). Yorba Linda, CA: ISV Foundation.
MacBook Pro MacOS Sequoia 15.4 1TB SSD
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Beloved said:
my model does indeed have a slot
Beloved,
As a Surface Pro user myself, I have found that moving most of my OTHER data to the SD card allows me to keep Logos on the SSD, which increases performance (since my other programs are not as resource intensive as Logos is). --Just a suggestion that may help you get a little more life out of your current machine that isn't THAT old.
Making Disciples! Logos Ecosystem = LogosMax on Microsoft Surface Pro 7 (Win11), Android app on tablet, FSB on iPhone & iPad mini, Proclaim (Proclaim Remote on Fire Tablet).
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David Thomas said:Beloved said:
my model does indeed have a slot
Beloved,
As a Surface Pro user myself, I have found that moving most of my OTHER data to the SD card allows me to keep Logos on the SSD, which increases performance (since my other programs are not as resource intensive as Logos is). --Just a suggestion that may help you get a little more life out of your current machine that isn't THAT old.
Excellent suggestion and not one I thought of solves the implied performance issue. Thank you very much David! My sd card should arrive Saturday.
Meanwhile, Jesus kept on growing wiser and more mature, and in favor with God and his fellow man.
International Standard Version. (2011). (Lk 2:52). Yorba Linda, CA: ISV Foundation.
MacBook Pro MacOS Sequoia 15.4 1TB SSD
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Jadrian Haywood said:
Actually, this is a great question Bill and yes I did take it out of S mode. I do not believe I would have been able to download it in s mode.
Jadrian, I am just checking back to see if you were able to determine the problem with your installation.
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Yes! I am not sure what exactly the issue was but I was able to install the program today. It is not performing very well though so I will not be able to load many programs while using logos.
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I got my micro sd card but I've encountered some problems. I moved OneDrive, Documents and Downloads to the card I get an Error notice when I try to move my Music files to the card. My Printscrn key no longer functions so I had to employ a work around. I'm uncertain that Logos has not been effected by the changes I made. Need advice.
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Meanwhile, Jesus kept on growing wiser and more mature, and in favor with God and his fellow man.
International Standard Version. (2011). (Lk 2:52). Yorba Linda, CA: ISV Foundation.
MacBook Pro MacOS Sequoia 15.4 1TB SSD
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I've looked for help on line but I'm getting no where. Thanks for your guidance.
Meanwhile, Jesus kept on growing wiser and more mature, and in favor with God and his fellow man.
International Standard Version. (2011). (Lk 2:52). Yorba Linda, CA: ISV Foundation.
MacBook Pro MacOS Sequoia 15.4 1TB SSD
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Beloved said:
I get an Error notice when I try to move my Music files to the card
The folder/file name in the screenshot looks very long; just a guess, but it's possible you might be running into a limitation on file name length in whatever filesystem the microSD card is formatted with.
If my guess is right, you may be able to work around the problem by renaming some of the files/folders to make the name shorter. You may need to do this in whatever program you use to organise your music library so that it doesn't get out-of-sync with the files.
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David Thomas said:
As a Surface Pro user myself, I have found that moving most of my OTHER data to the SD card allows me to keep Logos on the SSD, which increases performance (since my other programs are not as resource intensive as Logos is).
Also, we only support Logos when it is installed on an internal drive, not on a removable card: https://www.logos.com/system-requirements
We have that there is a much higher incidence of crashes, corrupted data, and poor performance when an external SD card is used.
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I have seen similar message trying to move files/folders (even with Windows Explorer) when the new Ransomware Controlled Folder Protection is turned on.Beloved said:I've looked for help on line but I'm getting no where. Thanks for your guidance.
You could see if it is on and then disable it temporarily in Windows Defender Security Center > Virus and threat protection > Ransomware Protection...then retry.
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Beloved said:
I get an Error notice when I try to move my Music files to the card
The folder/file name in the screenshot looks very long; just a guess, but it's possible you might be running into a limitation on file name length in whatever filesystem the microSD card is formatted with.
If my guess is right, you may be able to work around the problem by renaming some of the files/folders to make the name shorter. You may need to do this in whatever program you use to organise your music library so that it doesn't get out-of-sync with the files.
The file name is Music. I don't know why it is reading contents of the file as the file name. Thanks for your help Bradley.
Meanwhile, Jesus kept on growing wiser and more mature, and in favor with God and his fellow man.
International Standard Version. (2011). (Lk 2:52). Yorba Linda, CA: ISV Foundation.
MacBook Pro MacOS Sequoia 15.4 1TB SSD
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SeeHisFace said:
I have seen similar message trying to move files/folders (even with Windows Explorer) when the new Ransomware Controlled Folder Protection is turned on.
You could see if it is on and then disable it temporarily in Windows Defender Security Center > Virus and threat protection > Ransomware Protection...then retry.
Hi SeeHisFace,
Would provide a screenshot of what I am to disable? Thanks!
Meanwhile, Jesus kept on growing wiser and more mature, and in favor with God and his fellow man.
International Standard Version. (2011). (Lk 2:52). Yorba Linda, CA: ISV Foundation.
MacBook Pro MacOS Sequoia 15.4 1TB SSD
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SeeHisFace said:
Sure...here you go...try disable this while moving folder....could be the problem.
McAfee is my antivirus program. I don't have the screen your showing, What I see is below.
Meanwhile, Jesus kept on growing wiser and more mature, and in favor with God and his fellow man.
International Standard Version. (2011). (Lk 2:52). Yorba Linda, CA: ISV Foundation.
MacBook Pro MacOS Sequoia 15.4 1TB SSD
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Can you scroll down below 'Virus & threat protection updates'. The Ransomware protection section is below that on mine, I click on that.
Sorry I must go sleep now. Hoping it works for you.
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Meanwhile, Jesus kept on growing wiser and more mature, and in favor with God and his fellow man.
International Standard Version. (2011). (Lk 2:52). Yorba Linda, CA: ISV Foundation.
MacBook Pro MacOS Sequoia 15.4 1TB SSD
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Beloved, I know you have a specific need to fix on your Surface Pro. Please start your own thread so that this thread on the Surface Go may be useful to people inquiring about the Surface Go.
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Im contemplating the SurfaceGo. How readable is the text without an external monitor? I would think the text would be too tiny. I currently use an iPad Pro and while the logos app is obviously limited feature-wise compared to the the full version, it was designed for a tablet and the text is very readable. Applications like the full version of Logos are usually designed to be used on bigger monitors and trying to fit it into a 10” screen seems like it would almost make it unreadable (at least for my older eyes).
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Thomas,
Just like on the desktop version of Logos, you can increase the font size of the resources. Also, within Windows you can increase the scaling of the fonts to make the fonts larger system-wide.
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How can I find out how much memory my LOGOS library is using?
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Michael S. said:
How can I find out how much memory my LOGOS library is using?
Right-click the Logos icon, right-click "Logos Bible Software" and then right-click properties
Click "Open file location" to get to the Logos folder structures
Select all the folders in that directory, right-click and select Properties
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Excellent help Graham! Thanks very much.
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Thanks for the Surface Go review, Bill!
You used to have an 8 inch Windows tablet with an Atom processor. How does the Go compare to that in terms of performance? I would guess that with the SSD and 8 gb of RAM, the Go should "go" better!
Thanks!
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Mark,
The performance of the Surface Go is better than the Asus 8" tablet I had back then. Yes, the additional RAM (8GB vs. 2GB for the Asus) and speed of the SSD (NVMe SSD vs. eMMC for the Asus) make a sizeable difference. But, that Asus tablet ran Logos off of a micro SD card and it was amazing that Logos was usable on it.
Logos on the Surface Go is good except when it is indexing. Then, it bogs down and I can't scroll windows with my finger. I will typically have to wait until the indexing is complete to read on it.
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Mark Nolette said:
Thanks for the Surface Go review, Bill!
You used to have an 8 inch Windows tablet with an Atom processor. How does the Go compare to that in terms of performance? I would guess that with the SSD and 8 gb of RAM, the Go should "go" better!
Thanks!
The Surface 3 and the Surface Go both contain 1.6 GHz processors. One thing that left me scratching my head, however, is that only the Surface 3's Intel Atom x7 chip has "boost speeds" of 2.4 GHz, which it sustains except under heavy usage. It would definitely be a poor choice as a portable video rendering machine! Of course, there's more to laptop/tablet performance than a CPU's clock rate (e.g., cores, threads, wattage, memory, GPU, etc.). I recall reading that the Surface Go's "Pentium" processor has the same basic architecture as the Core-3 (7th gen?) although clearly slower. If you search around on the web, there are sites where you can compare processors.
I recall that the SSD on the higher-end Surface Go models is far superior to the Surface 3. The 8 GB of RAM would likely be noticed too. It doesn't take that much to cross the 4 GB barrier. The CPU would probably be it's biggest choke point (i.e., on higher end models).
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Surface_3
https://www.intel.com/content/www/us/en/products/processors/atom/x-series/x7-z8700.html
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Surface_Go
https://www.intel.com/content/www/us/en/products/processors/pentium/4415y.html
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Adam,
I tried to run Logos on a Surface 3 when it first came out. It was so laggy that I returned the Surface 3.
Yes, the choke point of the 8GB RAM/128GB SSD Surface Go is the processor. The other weak point is the battery life since they kept the battery capacity down a bit to reduce weight.
Many of us who like the 10" form factor would like Microsoft to put a faster processor in the Surface Go, but Microsoft positions this tablet under the much more capable Surface Pro.
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Bill Anderson said:
Mark,
The performance of the Surface Go is better than the Asus 8" tablet I had back then. Yes, the additional RAM (8GB vs. 2GB for the Asus) and speed of the SSD (NVMe SSD vs. eMMC for the Asus) make a sizeable difference. But, that Asus tablet ran Logos off of a micro SD card and it was amazing that Logos was usable on it.
Logos on the Surface Go is good except when it is indexing. Then, it bogs down and I can't scroll windows with my finger. I will typically have to wait until the indexing is complete to read on it.
Bill,
Thanks for your reply!
As we know, Logos is resource-intensive. Indexing would put a significant strain on the Go's CPU and would take much longer than, say, on a Surface Pro. The Go would probably be fine for reading resources or doing passage guides and the like. But the delays caused by indexing might test one's patience - possibly too much!
I still have my Dell Venue 8 Pro with the 4 gb of RAM. It's fine for reading a resource, but the display is a bit small and the transitions from one window to the next a bit slow for any other work on it. Also, my 64 gb of internal storage is not far from capacity - and that's with moving as much non-Logos stuff as possible to an sd card!
A number of us have had this dream of a portable Windows device that could run Logos well. The Surface Go is a possibility, if one can deal with the indexing delays. But there may not be anything out there smaller than the Surface Pro and its competitors that can truly handle Logos these days.
P.S. - Let Microsoft come out with a Surface Go Pro, with an i5, and we may have something...
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Appreciate this info. Just checked out the Surface Go and after checking the Passmark score of the processor decided I wasn't too excited about it.
Then I checked the Passmark score on the processor in the old laptop I normally use on the go and the Surface Go score was more than double and my old laptop runs Logos relatively well since I put in the SSD.
Came here to see if anyone had anything to say about the Go and, of course, this forum came through again. Will have to go to Best Buy and get hands on the Go sometime soon.
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I love mine. When indexing or preparing it is painful. I leave mine on at night and let it do that then.
I absolutely love the form factor and I can do anything with it that I can do on a big computer which is cool.
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Mark Nolette said:
A number of us have had this dream of a portable Windows device that could run Logos well. The Surface Go is a possibility, if one can deal with the indexing delays. But there may not be anything out there smaller than the Surface Pro and its competitors that can truly handle Logos these days.
P.S. - Let Microsoft come out with a Surface Go Pro, with an i5, and we may have something...
Yes, a Surface Go Pro would be fantastic -- with an eInk display! [:)]
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