Prices on Morris Proctor-200.00 price tag!

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This post has 69 Replies | 5 Followers

Posts 87
David Emme | Forum Activity | Posted: Fri, Apr 1 2011 12:55 AM

Far be it for me to complain, if our economy was the best in the world and everyone living the good life and perhaps some tv evangelist burning money because it was so good financially this year, 200 dollars for two DVD's!

I know this is a business but wandering what your forecasts for your break even point. Many competitors are not as strong and somewhat wander-are these high prices because of a lack of a competitor?

Posts 1142
Juanita | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Apr 1 2011 3:52 AM

David Emme:
are these high prices because of a lack of a competitor?

As others have said or intimated (in another thread), Morris is a great, great teacher so one could say they are worth the price from that standpoint.

There is no other paid competitor who has quantity and quality of output that is on par with Morris Proctor's and IMO, if there was a paid competitor, prices may reflect that.  We have some unofficial Logos tutorial videos of very high quality that we can all access freely.  So I am thankful for those.

I would be interested in different opinions from others.

 

Posts 219
Dennis Miller | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Apr 1 2011 4:25 AM

I don't have a fully functional Logos Mac program yet that justifies the cost of learning how to use it to it's full potential. If I had that I would definitely consider it but for me Logos has become a secondary resource for my studies and that only because of what I already had invested in it before I found an alternative that works as advertised.

Posts 982
David Carter | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Apr 1 2011 4:49 AM

It's the "if it costs a lot it must be good" pricing model. Zip it!

I wouldn't buy them myself or recommend them.

I much prefer the price tag on these excellent resources:

  • The wonderful videos by Mark Barnes
  • The comprehensive Logos Wiki
  • The amazing contributions from the incredibly knowledgeable members of this forum

 Having said that, I am not a professional theologian, academic, scholar or preacher - maybe other peoples needs are different from mine.

 

Posts 1142
Juanita | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Apr 1 2011 5:08 AM

David Carter:

I much prefer the price tag on these excellent resources:

  • The wonderful videos by Mark Barnes
  • The comprehensive Logos Wiki
  • The amazing contributions from the incredibly knowledgeable members of this forum

 Having said that, I am not a professional theologian, academic, scholar or preacher - maybe other peoples needs are different from mine.

 

Yes, I prefer their price tag, too, David.  But, can I rely on a member of the Logos community who does the videos to make just the one I need help with-some time in the future which is also unknown to me?  Particularly when I know Morris covers it in his dvd series.

 

 

Posts 3810
spitzerpl | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Apr 1 2011 5:17 AM

My guess is that these videos represent the bulk of information he shares during his classes and that he created them because people asked for them. If he sold these videos for $40, why would anyone go to his seminars? And if no one goes to his seminars, he can't afford to feed his family. and if he can't afford to feed his family he will need a different job. And if he has a different job, he won't be able to produce $40 videos.

I have no idea how Morris arrives at his pricing, and honestly I don't really need to. If I want to go to his seminar for $250 I'll pay it and go. If I don't want to go to his seminar's for $250 I won't. Same deal for the videos. His pricing model is completely his business (I imagine Logos' opinion fits in there somewhere) and he is the one accountable for his motives before the Lord. My paying model is completely my business and I am the one accountable to it before the Lord.

I can say I've been to his seminars (the Camp 1 series) and he does a great job teaching Logos. For those who need to learn Logos and learn better in an interactive, Q&A environment, I recommend them. I cannot speak for the videos, though, as I have not seen them.

Posts 103
Lonnie Ritchie | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Apr 1 2011 6:33 AM

David, honesty and a limited pocketbook compel me to agree with you.  I have attended Morris's seminar and it was quite informative and worth what I paid to attend.  However, $200 for two DVDs is out of my price range.  Especially when I can go to the Wiki and get tutorial videos free of charge.  I have found Mark Barnes to be excellent and thorough in his "unofficial" tutorials.  He covers a great deal of how the program works, and I believe you'll be well served, and your pocketbook fatter, by going there and taking a look.  I hope this helps.  Peace.

Lonnie

Posts 579
Jim VanSchoonhoven | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Apr 1 2011 7:04 AM

I think I have bought every resource Morris put out for Libronix 3!!!  I have also bought every other resource I could find for Libronix 3, no matter who put it out.

I have bought the training manuals for Logos 4, twice already and have bought John's videos.  I have also watched every video I can find for Logos 4.  I love those Mark Barnes videos.

So will I put out the 200.00 bucks for these???  No!!!  But it is not because they are not worth it, He is beyond any doubt the best Logos teacher I have seen.  He knows how to teach, I am not the smartest guy on the block, but he knows how to make the hard stuff easy!!!  I would much rather have his videos then go to his seminar, the videos allow me to go through them as often as I need to to refresh my memory.

I just can not afford these videos because of the economy,  I am disabled and can not work and the high prices of gas and food are forcing my wife and I to cut back on things like this.  I would like to see his prices reflect the times we are in and be lowered to allow more people to see what a great teacher he is.  But keep in mind although I think the price is way to high, I will be the first to admit the value of his videos are way beyond the 200.00 dollars he charges for them.

Using his Libronix videos allowed me to learn more in less time than from all other resources put together.  I learned so much from his videos that I was inspired to start work on my ThD degree, and I am so glad I did.  It has changed the way I study more than I could have ever imagined.  I see almost no limit with what I can learn using Logos, and I give the credit to his videos.

I have never seen a better teacher in any class I have ever been in.

I am sold on his videos, but I still can not get them.

There are still some great resources out there that are a great help in learning Logos 4 and worth every penny and don't over look the Mark Barnes videos they are great and I can afford them!

In Christ,

Jim VanSchoonhoven

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Friedrich | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Apr 1 2011 7:35 AM

if you are a camp alumn, you can get them for 150.

I like Apples.  Especially Honeycrisp.

Posts 634
Pastor Michael Huffman | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Apr 1 2011 8:29 AM

My Suggestion is that people look up John Fallahee at Learnlogos.com. He is a former Logos employee and an absolutely extraordinary teacher. And you will find that His training materials are very reasonably priced. And HE gives FREE webinars a few times a  month and a free news letter. I understand that Morris' products are needlessly high ,he is not a not-for-profit organization and neither is John, but his work is equally as good to Morris', if not a bit better because John's DVD's are interactive which makes the learning curve better because you do each step. Give it a look. 

Pastor Michael Huffman, Th.A Th.B Th.M

Posts 219
Dennis Miller | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Apr 1 2011 10:37 AM

I second that, John's stuff is very good and reasonably priced.

Posts 2666
mab | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Apr 1 2011 12:32 PM

My guess is that the average Logos user might have $1000 or more invested in the program and resources. That's considerable.

Years ago, my employer sent me off for a couple days of training on a software program. While I was still green, I could open the program up and do quite a bit as a result of the class time. I was productive. I actually became motivated to go way beyond what the class taught. 

If you are committed to using Logos, it's less than a cup of coffee a day for a few months. Not that much really.

The mind of man is the mill of God, not to grind chaff, but wheat. Thomas Manton | Study hard, for the well is deep, and our brains are shallow. Richard Baxter

Posts 579
Jim VanSchoonhoven | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Apr 1 2011 1:11 PM

I agree that John's materials are very good, but I also have done work with Morris Proctors videos and they taught me more in less time.  A person must decided how far they want to go with the program and how long they want to take to get there.

For myself working it was worth far more to spend the extra money for the dvd's from Morris.  However, the times have changed and I simply can not spend that kind of money on the product, but I know if I had the money I would spend it on Logos 4 because I would learn things quicker and know the program better.  The time saved would mean a lot to me, so I could study more.

I am at the place where I am working on my ThD degree in the Libronix 3 program and it works great for me, I have extra time to learn Logos 4, and I am broke, so it is easy for me to say go with the cheaper teaching programs, but I still do not see them as being of the same value as the Camp Logos 4 videos will be based on having the Libronix 3 Camps 1 and 2.

What ever a person decides they should check out Marks free videos, they have a huge value for free!

A question for those saying to go with John's videos, have you used any of Morris Proctor's Camp Logos videos?  What did you think of them???

In Christ,

Jim VanSchoonhoven

Posts 634
Pastor Michael Huffman | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Apr 1 2011 1:20 PM

Jim VanSchoonhoven:

I agree that John's materials are very good, but I also have done work with Morris Proctors videos and they taught me more in less time.  A person must decided how far they want to go with the program and how long they want to take to get there.

For myself working it was worth far more to spend the extra money for the dvd's from Morris.  However, the times have changed and I simply can not spend that kind of money on the product, but I know if I had the money I would spend it on Logos 4 because I would learn things quicker and know the program better.  The time saved would mean a lot to me, so I could study more.

I am at the place where I am working on my ThD degree in the Libronix 3 program and it works great for me, I have extra time to learn Logos 4, and I am broke, so it is easy for me to say go with the cheaper teaching programs, but I still do not see them as being of the same value as the Camp Logos 4 videos will be based on having the Libronix 3 Camps 1 and 2.

What ever a person decides they should check out Marks free videos, they have a huge value for free!

A question for those saying to go with John's videos, have you used any of Morris Proctor's Camp Logos videos?  What did you think of them???

In Christ,

Jim VanSchoonhoven

John has the advantage...He worked for Logos, he was on the ground floor of programming with Logos 3. He did all the online videos. It seems to be a difference of "why we are in it" between Morris and John, and I appreciate John for that.

 

Pastor Michael Huffman, Th.A Th.B Th.M

Posts 692
Otto S. Carroll | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Apr 1 2011 1:32 PM

I'm a Camp Alum (been to several)...where do I go to get the Alum pricing?

__________

15" rMBP 2.6 GHz i7 | 16 GB RAM | 1.0 TB Flash Drive | OS X 10.12.3 | Logos 7.0 (7.3.0.0062)

Posts 94
Rob | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Apr 1 2011 2:02 PM

Jim VanSchoonhoven:
A question for those saying to go with John's videos, have you used any of Morris Proctor's Camp Logos videos?  What did you think of them???

I have been thinking about this and would also would enjoy hearing opinions. It's not a matter of deciding between Morris' and John's stuff since I can't afford and won't be buying Morris's either way, but I would enjoy hearing comments in either direction to know how they compare and strengths and weaknesses of each.

Thank you,

Rob

www.3rdcultureliving.com - Simple Abundant Legacy

Posts 1374
nicky crane | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Apr 1 2011 2:39 PM

Dan DeVilder:

if you are a camp alumn, you can get them for 150.

HOW?  Tell me quick, because I'd ordered them at $200!

Posts 29
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Morris Proctor | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Apr 1 2011 4:35 PM

Thanks for the discussion and feedback regarding Logos training. Perhaps a little context for the Camp Logos Live DVD training, which is a joint venture between Logos and MP Seminars, would be helpful for this discussion.

As you perhaps know Camp Logos is a live, two - day, hands-on Logos training seminar presented in cities around the world. Because of schedule, location, etc. some Logos users who wish to attend simply can’t. We receive requests from some of those users to provide an alternative for Camp. In addition, many Camp alumni ask for a Camp refresher because it is hard to retain all that is covered at the seminar.

Even though there is no substitute for a live event, we decided video training was the best alternative for Camp. We knew that for video training to be a viable alternative to a live Camp it would have to be professionally produced. We, therefore, secured the services of the following professionals:

  • Videographer
  • Audio technician
  • Lighting technician
  • Video editor
  • Graphic artist
  • Software developer
  • Video graphic technician
  • Replicator

In addition, there were the costs for the studio, cameras, lights, etc.

We also decided to record two different Camps: one for PC and the other for Mac so that we could develop a unique product for each format. We did not want Mac users watching a PC screen, hearing PC instructions, or learning PC shortcuts only to have to translate them to Mac. So multiply all of the above services by two. These professionals of course had to be paid before even one DVD was sold.


Are there other  teachers of Logos and training options for Logos? Absolutely. Mark and John are but two of the many gifted individuals who know Logos inside and out. The online videos, blogs, and forums provide excellent opportunities for us to expand our use of Logos. In addition mp|seminars provides free instruction such as a weekly blog, monthly newsletters, and a training disk for every base collection of Logos Bible Software to help us use Logos more effectively.


The Camp Logos Live DVD’s were designed to meet a different need. Some Logos users want a high end, professionally produced training alternative. These DVD’s perhaps will not be for everyone nor are they designed to replace all of the other training options. They are just one more choice in an ever expanding sea of Logos training possibilities.


I hope that if you see the online preview or watch the actual DVD’s that you will appreciate the variety and multitude of gifts that went into the project. I am very grateful for the talented team that God assembled to craft the video training. I had the easy part of just standing and teaching Logos Bible Software. After I left the seminar, they went to work. They added the talking points, the highlighted screen captures, the interactive menu, and the video installer. They edited the audio so you wouldn’t have to listen to my coughs over and over. They assembled the videos so you can jump to just the right one without watching two days of training to learn how to execute a right mouse phrase search.


While Logos and I encourage you to attend Camp if at all possible, we believe this video project is the next best thing to being there. If this meets a need and you secure the DVD’s,  I think you will see that the gifted, behind the scenes team that God brought together, makes learning Logos both easy and enjoyable.

Also, whether you get the DVDs or not, please continue to take advantage of all the online training that numerous Logos users provide for us all.


Blessings,

Morris

 

Posts 452
Is Mebin | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Apr 1 2011 4:50 PM

Does anyone know if Camp Logos has ever been to Australia, or if there are plans in the future?

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Jack Caviness | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, Apr 1 2011 5:18 PM

Rob:
I have been thinking about this and would also would enjoy hearing opinions.

I have Camp Logos I & II videos for L3 and find them well worth the $400 they cost, and more. I purchased one of John's videos and gave it away. I found his approach to be overly simplistic. Others, have a different belief concerning them. You will need to decide for yourself.

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