Worldwide flood myths and Noah's Flood

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Lee | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Apr 20 2014 11:01 AM

Not being particularly acquainted with this topic, I wouldn't want to flood this thread further.

I recall that The Genesis Record by Morris (ICR founder) had some mention about the topic, which was far from exhaustive.

A search on the web washes up sites like http://www.talkorigins.org/faqs/flood-myths.html and http://www.icr.org/article/why-does-nearly-every-culture-have-tradition-globa and http://www.answersingenesis.org/articles/am/v2/n2/flood-legends 

Posts 4889
David Paul | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Apr 20 2014 11:17 AM

I've made this point a few times in the past, but the way I attempt to prove my view of Scripture is to attempt to prove it wrong...not by finding someone else who agrees with me. I give the other view(s) as many opportunities to derail my perspective as they can manage, at least until they become pointlessly repetitive. If they can take a 1000 swings and 1000 shots without hitting or touching my view, I start thinking I may be on the right track. Of course, if they do make contact, I make adjustments and start the process anew.

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MJ. Smith | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Apr 20 2014 11:26 AM

Lee:
Anecdotes and personal reactions can cut many ways, and aren't necessarily better evidence or indicators of anything than the myths

Narrative is can be an effective communication tool, reaching people in ways logic does not. But I agree that it is time to drop the topic. Sorry I got carried away. One of my two papers in lieu of a Master's thesis was on folktales/myths (the other on linguistics) so its a topic a love and care about.

Orthodox Bishop Hilarion Alfeyev: "To be a theologian means to have experience of a personal encounter with God through prayer and worship."

Posts 176
Bill Coley | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Apr 20 2014 11:55 AM

David Paul:

Add to this the situation I have addressed in other threads--that YHWH has stated explicitly that He has deliberately introduced disinformation and misinformation into the mix--and it becomes hideously easy to draw false conclusions about important concerns.

And I wouldn't rely too heavily on the Holy Spirit to keep you out of the weeds...that is precisely what the guy is doing who thinks you are wrong about most of what you believe, and he isn't right about anything, is he?

David, you and I exchanged views on this matter in another thread, a thread that strayed far from forum guideline expectations, so I will limit my reaction to your words that I have quoted above to this: Wow. Especially to the part about not relying on the Holy Spirit to lead out of the weeds. Really wow.... Wow.

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David Paul | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, Apr 20 2014 12:34 PM

You have no idea how "wow" it really is. Enjoy your Ishtar...er, I mean Easter. Say "hello" to the Spirit for me.

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Josh | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Apr 21 2014 3:48 PM

Lee:

@ MJ, Denise, David Paul

Anecdotes and personal reactions can cut many ways, and aren't necessarily better evidence or indicators of anything than the myths Josh wants to explore. If we are to aid in Josh's search, let's stick to Logos resources before emotions run high.

I can't tell you how disappointing I am with this thread. I posted a legitimate question and was expecting some friendly suggestions. This is not what I got. Milkman had asked early on if I could be more specific about what I was asking for, I probably said too much. That unleashed a flood of pretentious comments. Like I said before, its not hard to read between the lines.

Posts 389
James C. | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Apr 21 2014 5:00 PM

Josh here is a website that might be of help to you: http://www.nwcreation.net/noahlegends.html

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MJ. Smith | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Apr 21 2014 5:04 PM

Josh:
Like I said before, its not hard to read between the lines.

Unfortunately, you read between my lines incorrectly. Please remember that I did offer recommendations that met your needs and became

Josh:
pretentious
only when you indicated that you would abuse the material. Had I known up front your intended use of the material, I would have offered no resources. I will try to remember not to offer resources or suggestions to you in the future. No problem. No ill will.

Orthodox Bishop Hilarion Alfeyev: "To be a theologian means to have experience of a personal encounter with God through prayer and worship."

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MJ. Smith | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Apr 21 2014 5:19 PM

Denise:
I agree with MJ (probably accidentally).

Or remember a shared background firmly planted in Hume and the British empiricists i.e Campbell and the Restoration movement.Wink

Orthodox Bishop Hilarion Alfeyev: "To be a theologian means to have experience of a personal encounter with God through prayer and worship."

Posts 1509
Josh | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Apr 21 2014 8:44 PM

MJ. Smith:

Josh:
Like I said before, its not hard to read between the lines.

Unfortunately, you read between my lines incorrectly. Please remember that I did offer recommendations that met your needs and became

Josh:
pretentious
only when you indicated that you would abuse the material. Had I known up front your intended use of the material, I would have offered no resources. I will try to remember not to offer resources or suggestions to you in the future. No problem. No ill will.

I'm not sure what I ever did to you, but it would be nice if you would stop being so haughty towards me.

Apparently, I am not allowed to ask for recommendations on resources that I believe might bolster my current beliefs. I am not ashamed of my beliefs and I only elaborated on them because I was asked too. However, I felt that you just wanted to be disparaging towards me instead of actually provide any real help.

Posts 1509
Josh | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Apr 21 2014 8:50 PM

James C.:

Thanks. I actually just bought this book. I will have it in my hands tomorrow. Smile

Posts 109
Larry Heflin | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Apr 21 2014 9:34 PM

Maybe we can learn something from Vizinni, master of logic and reason.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E2y40U2LvKY -short version- for the impatient desiring a crash course in reasoning.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U_eZmEiyTo0  -better version to supercharge your reasoning skills. Not for the faint-hearted.

For the wisdom of this world is foolishness before God. For it is written, “He is the one who catches the wise in their craftiness”; and again, “The Lord knows the reasonings of the wise, that they are useless.” So then let no one boast in men. 1 Co 3:19–21

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MJ. Smith | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, Apr 21 2014 10:31 PM

Big Smile

Orthodox Bishop Hilarion Alfeyev: "To be a theologian means to have experience of a personal encounter with God through prayer and worship."

Posts 1509
Josh | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Apr 22 2014 8:28 AM

I found an interesting article (dated Jan. 2014) on the Biblical Archaeology Society's website. It talks about an Old Babylonian clay tablet that contains a flood story. The Noah-like hero is given detailed instructions on building a life-saving ark and placing animals aboard this ark "two each, two-by-two". 

http://www.biblicalarchaeology.org/daily/biblical-topics/hebrew-bible/the-animals-went-in-two-by-two-according-to-babylonian-ark-tablet/

I was, also, reading through many of the flood myths on the talkorigins website that someone provided earlier in this thread. Some of these flood stories seem to have no glaring parallels to the Biblical account, but this one African myth stood out like a sore thumb: http://www.talkorigins.org/faqs/flood-myths.html#Masai

Tumbainot, a righteous man, had a wife named Naipande and three sons, Oshomo, Bartimaro, and Barmao. When his brother Lengerni died, Tumbainot, according to custom, married the widow Nahaba-logunja, who bore him three more sons, but they argued about her refusal to give him a drink of milk in the evening, and she set up her own homestead. The world was heavily populated in those days, but the people were sinful and not mindful of God. However, they refrained from murder, until at last a man named Nambija hit another named Suage on the head. At this, God resolved to destroy mankind, except Tumbainot found grace in His eyes. God commanded Tumbainot to build an ark of wood and enter it with his two wives, six sons and their wives, and some of animals of every sort. When they were all aboard and provisioned, God caused a great long rain which caused a flood, and all other men and beasts drowned. The ark drifted for a long time, and provisions began to run low. The rain finally stopped, and Tumbainot let loose a dove to ascertain the state of the flood. The dove returned tired, so Tumbainot knew it had found no place to rest. Several days later, he loosed a vulture, but first he attached an arrow to one of its tail feathers so that, if the bird landed, the arrow would hook on something and be lost. The vulture returned that evening without the arrow, so Tumbainot reasoned that it must have landed on carrion, and that the flood was receding. When the water ran away, the ark grounded on the steppe, and its occupants disembarked. Tumbainot saw four rainbows, one in each quarter of the sky, signifying that God's wrath was over.

Posts 1509
Josh | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Apr 22 2014 10:03 PM

I found some more Logos resources that address this topic. Some of you may find this interesting.

The Bible and Spade collection produced by the Associates for Biblical Research has a four part article on Genesis and ANE creation and flood myths. They can be found in the Winter 1996 edition of Bible and Spade. However, you can also view the articles for free on their website.

Genesis and Ancient Near Eastern Stories of Creation and Flood: Part 1

Genesis and Ancient Near Eastern Stories of Creation and Flood: Part 2

Genesis and Ancient Near Eastern Stories of Creation and Flood: Part 3

Genesis and Ancient Near Eastern Stories of Creation and Flood: Part 4

Please post any more Logos resources if you know of any. Thanks.

Posts 1509
Josh | Forum Activity | Replied: Tue, Apr 22 2014 11:09 PM

Wow...just found this chart in the Faithlife Study Bible.

Posts 1509
Josh | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Apr 23 2014 5:53 PM

I really like charts, they really help you visualize content. Here is a chart found in the Lexham Bible Dictionary.

This information was gleaned from Wenham's Word Biblical Commentary on Genesis. Which I also own on Logos. Wenham's article was interesting, especially since he included the entire translation of Tablet 11 from the Epic of Gilgamesh. I really need to buy the ANET!

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