Logos 9 Wishlist

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This post has 559 Replies | 33 Followers

Posts 544
J. Remington Bowling | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, May 15 2020 10:58 AM

Denise:

- Logos is making a killing, even after royalties (along with the iffy tagging)

- Logos has a really bad contract

Since resources like WBC and NICOT have been on Logos a long time, I'm guessing it's at least partly bad contract? Remember how reluctant publishers were to get into digital books? About as much as the music industry with digital music... and movie industry with digital purchases/rentals. I sometimes get the impression that publishers would still like to go back to a print only world if only they could. (Look at the ridiculous way the C. S. Lewis books are handled.) My guess is that Faithlife had to give a pretty nice carrot to get some rights. 

At some point though, with some of these resources, someone is making a huge amount of profit off of these digital resources, since it seems like the cost of overhead (is that the right term?) approaches zero over time.

Potato resting atop 2020 Mac Pro stand.

Posts 3
cshover8669 | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, May 15 2020 11:26 AM

I know I am late to the party, but I would really like to see the following:

1. Personal Book conversion from .pdf.

2. Personal books in mobile.

3. More interactive maps like Accordance and richer graphics.

Those would be my top 3 requests. 

Posts 3544
Forum MVP
PetahChristian | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, May 15 2020 11:43 AM

cshover8669:
richer graphics

Since Carta is coming to Logos, FL may be delivering "a high-quality image experience" for those resources.

One could hope that might also generally benefit other new resources.

My top three Logos 9 Wishlist items: Carta, Dark mode, and Hebrew audio bible, please.

Posts 510
Nick Steffen | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, May 15 2020 12:29 PM

One more thing to add to the Logos 9 Wishlist:

Let's get a relationship going with Norton! Norton anthologies, critical editions, even Robert Alter! Rosie rightly pointed out, there's a strong desire for Robert Alter's work, which is largely through Norton, and given Logos' emphasis on tagging and Norton Critical Editions' (and their anthologies') emphasis on annotation, they honestly seem ideally fitted to each other. My favorite study Bible just happens to be the Norton Critical edition English Bible, which I would love to see come to Logos. If the primary value that Logos adds is tagging, then wouldn't a library filled with with Norton volumes all interlinked with one another be an incredible example of what that could look like?

Posts 76
Tim Bray | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, May 15 2020 1:19 PM

A feature request for the time-line tool.

Link the Bible and tool so that the TL tool follows the verse / Era/ names in Bible.

Thanks

 

Posts 60
Tom Vidal | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, May 15 2020 2:48 PM

I am very happy with Logos 8, and I agree that further improvements and refinements (particularly to datasets and tools that are already available) is the most important focus. As for specifics, there are so many great suggestions on these pages that I like, I will try to distinguish those suggestions to which I wanted to add my agreement with the ones that I think are new(ish) to this list.

Notes.

1. I agree with Ruben Helmuth's post regarding additional notes facet searching. Low hanging fruit would be a facet for note-flag icons and one for note color. Many of us use note icons and colors in a systematic fashion, so being able to filter for them would be great. Another facet that I would find particularly useful is accessing dates of my notes. I may want to review all the notes I created last week. So being able to get at dates would be nice. I'd like to expand facet filtering so that I can make additive filters (all notes in Notebook X and Notebook Y; all notes tagged with X + all notes tagged with Y). I guess that would be a Boolean "or" search. I'd also like to have exclude filters e.g., "all notes on 1 Samuel in this notebook, but not in these." I'd like to be able to group these additive an exclusionary filters into complex filters. Finally, I'd like to be able to save those queries.

2. I agree with James Hudson's idea of being able to insert a graphic, diagram, etc. into our notes would be helpful. Making a canvas and linking to a note with an L4 works fine, but there are sometimes it would be great to have a graphic embedded right in the note.

3. I would like to be able to tag notes with Topic categories so that they could be surfaced in Topic Guides or even Factbook entries.

4. I agree it would be helpful to have searches queries w/i notes highlight the search terms IN the notes.

5. Having an accessible list (index) of all tags you use would be helpful, especially when you start to develop a lot of tags.

Personal Books.

1. I agree with James Hudson's idea about allowing PBs to be accessible on mobile. Maybe allowing self-hosted servers or webDAV servers could facilitate this.

2. I love the power and potential of PBs and think the PBB tools should be greatly expanded. The parser should better handle MS Word styles. I have PBs where the formatting breaks the book after building, but I have no way of discovering how to troubleshoot the problem. I agree that it would be nice to be able to add PDFs as personal books. Maybe the PBB tool could be improved to allow tagging of topics, pages, Bible references, etc., directly in Logos. Maybe the idea of an external parser, like Chrisser, suggested would work better.

3. In addition to PDF, allow building personal books from epub and mobi besides just .docx?

Clippings.

Clippings are a neglected tool that can be a very flexible workhorse.

1. Enabling us to create clippings for outside resources would be helpful.

2. Enabling us to make a single clipping from several resources would be ideal. I appreciate that the standard academic workflow would be one resource per index card, but there are many times I've wanted to group several resources onto a single card. Maybe the solution would be more powerful organizational tools for clippings.

3. Better citation capturing, as someone else mentioned, would be idea.

4. Better design on the export. I'd like to just generate a PDF of my clippings, which we can do, but the presentation is unhelpful. Sure, you can dump clippings into a text editor and clean them up the way you want them, but it would be great if there were at least one way to have a no fuss/no muss pretty presentation that you could generate and share with someone (like a Bible study group).

5. I'm indifferent as to whether clippings should be incorporated into the Notes tool or remain standalone. I'd like the best, most organized functionality. If that means incorporating with Notes, I'd welcome that. It certainly would be nice to be able to use a universal set of tags to tag clippings that we use for notes.

Mobile Parity.

Mobile needs to be vastly "improved." The more I use the powerful features of Logos, the less I'm able to get anything done on mobile. My focus is on iOS. The Android versions may act differently, so I don't speak for Android.  I recognize there may be some technical limitations at present that make implementing some Logos features untenable. But my gut tells mere that there is much more that can be done to add feature parity between mobile and desktop.

1. If I'm working one something, I want to be able to start and complete a task on the platform I'm using. Right now on mobile, there are somethings that I can do, but then I hit a wall. So, I have to mark my notes with a special icon flag that tells me there is something I need to complete when I get back to desktop Logos.

2. As Liam requested, visual filters would be ideal to have on mobile

3. Having the guides be able to access our content would also be ideal.

4. The text selection is terrible. I cannot tell you how many times I have to start over on selecting text from a resource that I want to take a note about. I have to pray if I want to capture a long block of text that extends beyond what's on the screen. Also, after you select text, sometimes you can't adjust the selection because the context menu gets in the way. The whole touch interface needs to be vastly improved in the sense of polish ease of use. It's very frustrating and hard to be productive. It almost seems to me that nobody at Logos actually takes notes on their iPhones because I'm not sure how this has been left this way. Logos 8's text navigation, selection, etc. has improved over previous versions but it needs attention. Plenty of other apps have solved this problem, so it strikes me that this is just something that needs attention.

5. I'd like access to Passage lists on mobile.

6. At least on iPad, being able to access canvases without going to the web would be nice.

7. Improving the sermon editor on mobile would be welcome.

8. Accessing notes tags should be improved. I have trouble with the current system that only keeps the top 30 tags in memory. There are plenty of notes that I need to access that have tags that are not heavily used. I have to use a work around, were I first filter for a more popular tag, filter to the less heavily used tag, and then remove the first filter. This is not a polished professional workflow.

User Interface Elements.

I use desktop Logos on my laptop connected to a 27" display. I have gotten used to some great layouts when I work this way, but I cannot re-create those working on my laptop (15" display) alone because there are a lot of UI elements (especially in notes) that make it impossible. I'd like Logos to have some more methods of minimizing the UI elements so that we can get more information on screen. They are useful elements, particularly on a big screen, and even on the small screen. But sometimes you need more room to see and interact with the content, not the interface. 

Miscellaneous.

1. So much promise in the home page. I'd like to be able to use it more as a dashboard and information resource. It would be great if it could aggregate content from sites of our choosing in addition to Faithlife's content. Maybe RSS feed aggregation could do the trick?

2. Improvements to the favorites tool, such as more organizational tools, would be welcome.

3. I echo the request to flesh out and normalize the library metadata. I imported my entire bibliography into Zotero and discovered how much information is missing or inconsistently applied.

4. I agree regarding more audio Bible options. I have the Scourby KJV audio Bible, and I'd love to be able to use it (or an equivalent, if there is such a thing) the same way the ESV audio works.

5. I agree that a better offline mode would be useful.

6. Improvements to the courses tool would be great, particularly tools that enable you to revise your schedule (e.g., if you fall behind).

7. Ruben mentioned enabling easier access to specific translations of Bible references, and I agree. I have plenty of places where an author cited a specific translation of a Bible verse. I would be nice to have easier access to those translations.

Thanks for reading through all this. I appreciate Logos' commitment to quality. I also want to contextualize this wishlist. Logos is a most powerful Bible/theology research tool. So much of this program is absolutely perfect; please do not let this get lost in a wishlist post like this. I love Logos and spend a lot of time in it. More importantly, I get a lot of delight out of using it. That in turn has fueled my eagerness to study the Word, which even standing alone makes it worth the price of admission.

Posts 853
Armin | Forum Activity | Replied: Fri, May 15 2020 6:52 PM

Tom, great ideas.

I also wished that the Prayer List got improved. The editing is painful as the window size is very small when editing. Maybe sub-items could be added. I often have several prayer items for a situation or a person. I cannot select those sub-items as "answered". And the prayer lists on mobile devices are even more challenging.

The Courses Tool also needs some more work. "Continue" actually means "Done". And if I accidentally click "Continue", I cannot undo it.

Posts 510
Nick Steffen | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, May 16 2020 7:20 AM

This may be a rather boutique request, as it would only affect the handful of users who have purchased or who would purchase the CNTTS apparatus, but I believe a simpler user interface for CNTTS would vastly benefit its users and I would love to see this happen in Logos 9.

Posts 10774
Denise | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, May 16 2020 7:33 AM

Nick Steffen:
simpler user interface for CNTTS would vastly benefit its users

True, though my 'suspicion' is that it's a specially coded software section for one resource that they'd be reluctant to touch. In addition to improved display (and updated resource?), linking really drags the layout down. I have to keep mine unlinked.

A partnership with New Orleans could provide a great tool for visually displaying mss sequences, that would be a first among the software platforms.

"I didn't know God made honky tonk angels."

Posts 2540
David Ames | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, May 16 2020 2:02 PM

cshover8669:

I would really like to see the following:
1. Personal Book conversion from .pdf.


One main problem for PDF files is that some are just pictures of text. Yes, maybe they could be converted but only as page after page of pictures of text. And thus, not searchable


cshover8669:

2. Personal books in mobile.

See https://community.logos.com/forums/p/126859/848584.aspx#848584    
With the way Bob Pritchett feels about personal books we just might wake up some morning and find the best feature in Logos GONE!

Posts 60
Tom Vidal | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, May 16 2020 3:07 PM

David Ames:
One main problem for PDF files is that some are just pictures of text. Yes, maybe they could be converted but only as page after page of pictures of text. And thus, not searchable

There's not actually a problem here, though, is it? Tools that make PDFs text searchable are easy to get hold of and do a pretty good job. Moreover, many authoring tools (like printing to PDF from a word processor) create text searchable PDFs in the first instance. I can't speak to the experience of other users, but I have a script that automatically OCRs any new PDFs that I get. Logos could easily generate a warning if a user trie to build a book that didn't have a text layer. The PBB could also just not compile any non-text-searchable PDFs. So, there is a minimal technical challenge here. On the other hand, there could be a reason one wanted to build a PDF that was not text searchable. Maybe you have a PDF of diagrams and you only want access to them but don't need to search anything. That's probably a very narrow use case, of course. The real benefit of the PBB is to get the text processed, indexed, and accessible to your library. So, the best solution could be for PBB to error-out of any PDF that is not OCR'd.

Also, there is the issue of figuring out how to enable metadata tagging over a PDF. That's a more complicated issue, I'm sure.

David Ames:
See https://community.logos.com/forums/p/126859/848584.aspx#848584    

With the way Bob Pritchett feels about personal books we just might wake up some morning and find the best feature in Logos GONE!

I had never come across this. Thanks for sharing it. It was a fascinating read, and really does make a lot of sense. The PBB tool is useful (for the small segment of "NOBODY" who do use it), though, so I hope they decide some way to accommodate it on mobile. 2016 was a long time ago in the tech-years; maybe the whole mobile model needs to be rethought? I'm not a developer, but it iOS and Android have made great strides in hardware and at the OS level so maybe there is more that can be done (like indexing) native on device?

Posts 8197
LogosEmployee

David Ames:

One main problem for PDF files is that some are just pictures of text. Yes, maybe they could be converted but only as page after page of pictures of text. And thus, not searchable

Even PDFs that have text (not just page scans) can be surprisingly difficult to extract text from. I highly recommend reading https://www.filingdb.com/pdf-text-extraction to give an overview of the problems that could be encountered.

Posts 7066
DAL | Forum Activity | Replied: Sat, May 16 2020 9:09 PM

Bradley Grainger (Faithlife):

David Ames:

One main problem for PDF files is that some are just pictures of text. Yes, maybe they could be converted but only as page after page of pictures of text. And thus, not searchable

Even PDFs that have text (not just page scans) can be surprisingly difficult to extract text from. I highly recommend reading https://www.filingdb.com/pdf-text-extraction to give an overview of the problems that could be encountered.

Accordance has PDF import and they say not everything imports the same due to the various formats “behind the scenes.”

DAL

Posts 60
Tom Vidal | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, May 17 2020 11:35 AM

I think Logos 9 should also fix this. Not the tool, the hanging "e." 

Posts 87
Lee Gordon | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, May 17 2020 12:07 PM

Tom Vidal:

I think Logos 9 should also fix this. Not the tool, the hanging "e." 

Hmmm....

Posts 2540
David Ames | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, May 17 2020 3:00 PM

Bradley Grainger (Faithlife):

Even PDFs that have text (not just page scans) can be surprisingly difficult to extract text from. I highly recommend reading https://www.filingdb.com/pdf-text-extraction to give an overview of the problems that could be encountered.

Are we having fun yet? [interesting reading]  And OCR also has problems also.

Posts 44
Steven New | Forum Activity | Replied: Sun, May 17 2020 8:38 PM

I dunno if it has been suggested but a more advanced Library prioritization system would be nice.  Right now the idea of listing your Bible preferences first, then lexicons, and then commentaries isn't really that intuitive.  It would be nice to have tabs or table organization where you click on the Bible tags and can list the priority Bibles you want, in any order how many you want.  Then One for Dictionaries, Commentaries, basically anyway you want to sort your books with library tags...authors or what not.  

This could theoretically help organize and pull up resources faster and get better results for the users.  

Posts 87
Lee Gordon | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, May 18 2020 9:53 AM

cshover8669:

I know I am late to the party, but I would really like to see the following:

1. Personal Book conversion from .pdf.

2. Personal books in mobile.

3. More interactive maps like Accordance and richer graphics.

Those would be my top 3 requests. 

My understanding is they already gave a hard "no" to PDF's. Someone posted a link to this in the forums a while back, and I read the article about it, but since lost it. Here's someone noting it: https://community.logos.com/forums/p/187018/1083028.aspx#1083028 Does anyone have a link to that article again, where they basically said they're never going to do PDF's?

Posts 87
Lee Gordon | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, May 18 2020 9:53 AM

cshover8669:

I know I am late to the party, but I would really like to see the following:

1. Personal Book conversion from .pdf.

2. Personal books in mobile.

3. More interactive maps like Accordance and richer graphics.

Those would be my top 3 requests. 

My understanding is they already gave a hard "no" to PDF's. Someone posted a link to this in the forums a while back, and I read the article about it, but since lost it. Here's someone noting it: https://community.logos.com/forums/p/187018/1083028.aspx#1083028 Does anyone have a link to that article again, where they basically said they're never going to do PDF's?

Posts 60
Tom Vidal | Forum Activity | Replied: Mon, May 18 2020 10:05 AM

Yes, this problem only seems to occur when you pin the concordance to the top.

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