Logos A4 UI - Doesn't Match PC Version

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Mike Binks | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Jan 20 2010 2:06 AM

Thanks for the pictures Joe,

The all in one window is driving me nuts.

Sometimes I want my bible and commentary side by side.

Sometimes I want to be looking at the resources in passage guide

Sometimes I want to be using a bible that is free of links set up in other studies.

Why O why would I want them all in a frame that looks like a one of those sliding block puzzles or narrow ribbons of text 5 words wide you can buy for 10p (or 10c).

I know I can float window off but why is the box the default?

Expose is built in - use it.

 

Mike

Posts 45
WAM Project | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Jan 20 2010 2:20 AM

Mike Binks:

 

I know I can float window off but why is the box the default?

Expose is built in - use it.

 

Mike

Comes down to taste I guess. I hated the layout of Logos 3. I love the all in one feel of L4 with floating when I choose... 

 

Side note. I'll be glad when they make the verses clickable in the Biblesearch window instead of JUST the words. or fix the word wrap in the Bible search window

Posts 15805
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Keep Smiling 4 Jesus :) | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Jan 20 2010 5:43 AM

Over the years have seen many personal tastes for color combinations and screen backgrounds, wonder about UI skins for Logos ?

Cross platform UI skin possibilities: Logos for Mac 1.2.2, Logos 3, and Logos 4.

Some people have varying degrees of color blindness - being able to customize colors and fonts can dramatically affect product usability.

Firefox has wide variety of themes to customize appearance across platforms; also has extensions to modify functionality (e.g. tab close button on left or right, different tabs have different colors).

On Microsoft windows, have used PowerDVD and media players with skins that change location of functionality and appearance.  Remember one player had a button to show/hide advanced controls.

Several post comments are consistent with range of ribbon bar comments: from Big Smiles to disgusting frowns.

Automobiles also have variety of shapes, colors, and instrument controls.

From dust to dust - amazing variety of dust around world in shape and color - God is Good :)

Keep Smiling :)

Posts 55
Scott Criswell | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Jan 20 2010 8:28 AM

I would agree that you should always use the Apple menu bar. This is a standard UI metaphor for the mac and I would say a requirement. The current alpha does use the menu as expected. What I'm recommending is duplicative functionality.

Having the main (or most used) features from the Apple menu bar located within the application window itself is a common feature of many fine mac applications. This will also aid users of the PC version if they ever need to study on a mac (and vise versa. You will always know where your core features are.

Also, with regard to "one window" as apposed to several floating windows by default I would say first to each his own. I understand the desire to work this way. I will add though that I believe Logos has struck a very good balance with the new UI and I'm happy to have the ability to "float" what ever window I like.

Personally, managing several floating windows while I'm studying would be a chore. I don't like having to worry about where my documents are within a clutter of application windows. Sure that's what expose' was designed for but I think Apple designed this solution with the mindset of offering users a convenient tool to quickly de-clutter their work environment. That said I think this was in response to a real need for many users to find a way to become organized within the design of the OS itself, not a way to stop 3rd party developers from maintaining organization within their own applications. - Just my 2 cents. ;)

Another piece of food for thought. many of Apple's own applications are one window by design. Apple Motion, Aperture,  iTunes, iPhoto, Garage Band, etc... Each team at apple chose to go in this direction for varying reasons but this design choice in of itself is no less mac like that one that floats many windows. And with Logos you can do both with the "Float this panel" command.

This updated comp shows the apple menu bar in all her glory. :)

 

"Let the words of my mouth and the meditation of my heart
be acceptable in your sight, O Lord, my rock and my redeemer."

- Psalm 19:14

Posts 2793
J.R. Miller | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Jan 20 2010 9:27 AM

Scott Criswell:

This updated comp shows the apple menu bar in all her glory. :)

Nice job.  I could live with (and adjust) to everything, but I have one really long question regarding the custom menu option for the main window.

1. I like the home icon on the left.  Don't you think the "mac" solution would be an adjustable toolbar that would simply let each user add icons and space them where they want?  I had a mock-up on another thread with the "customize toolbar" suggestion.  What do you think about adding the customize toolbar?  How should that look?  How should it operate?  Also, keep in mind that the L4win has the ability to put shortcuts on the menu that are not in this Alpha yet.  Have you seen that?  How should that work?  I ask because I have given a lot of thought to this, but have yet to think of a good UI design solution worthy of posting

 

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Posts 55
Scott Criswell | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Jan 20 2010 10:17 AM

Nice job.  I could live with (and adjust) to everything, but I have one really long question regarding the custom menu option for the main window.

1. I like the home icon on the left.  Don't you think the "mac" solution would be an adjustable toolbar that would simply let each user add icons and space them where they want?  I had a mock-up on another thread with the "customize toolbar" suggestion.  What do you think about adding the customize toolbar?  How should that look?  How should it operate?  Also, keep in mind that the L4win has the ability to put shortcuts on the menu that are not in this Alpha yet.  Have you seen that?  How should that work?  I ask because I have given a lot of thought to this, but have yet to think of a good UI design solution worthy of posting

Interesting thoughts. You know I think this could be done. I need to review the shortcuts feature on the Windows version. Can you send me a screen grab of that option so I can get a better idea of how it works on the PC? My initial thought is that these shortcuts could be handled in a similar way to Safari's bookmarks bar.

Let me spend some time on this after work and see what I can come up with.

Another thing that needs to be improved on the next mockup is the visual design for the File, Guides, & Tools menus within the window. They look OK but not as mac like as I'd like. The challenge is improving there look and functionality without deviating too much from the Windows client. That's the goal anyway.

Thanks a bunch for the feedback!

 

"Let the words of my mouth and the meditation of my heart
be acceptable in your sight, O Lord, my rock and my redeemer."

- Psalm 19:14

Posts 2793
J.R. Miller | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Jan 20 2010 10:42 AM

Scott Criswell:
. Can you send me a screen grab of that option so I can get a better idea of how it works on the PC?
sure, I can do you something even better... see item #4 here on the wiki

http://wiki.logos.com/Visual_Glossary_–_Home_Page

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Posts 2793
J.R. Miller | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Jan 20 2010 10:55 AM

Hey Scott, here was my early mockup

http://community.logos.com/forums/p/6325/49072.aspx#49072

I actually propose some other things in this thread, but since you are far more informed and skilled than I, please build something usable from anything you find worthwhile :-)

My Books in Logos & FREE Training

Posts 55
Scott Criswell | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Jan 20 2010 7:02 PM

I'll be posting more screens in a bit. But I do have a minor update to the UI that I think makes the top navigation really feel at home on the mac.

Notice the the main navigation options are now Apple standard pill buttons. I'll be working on a version of the navigation manager that Joe has been thinking about later tonight. I hope to have it posted by morning if time allows.

Oh, I've also added some sample "Shortcuts" to the main navigation. Thanks for the tip Joe!

Take care all.

.

 

"Let the words of my mouth and the meditation of my heart
be acceptable in your sight, O Lord, my rock and my redeemer."

- Psalm 19:14

Posts 2793
J.R. Miller | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Jan 20 2010 7:58 PM

I like it. It  I was not sure about moving the Home button to the right, but it is growing on me.

My Books in Logos & FREE Training

Posts 55
Scott Criswell | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Jan 20 2010 9:05 PM

This screen shows the potential to have "Customize Toolbar" options. Since we will have a consistent Apple application window (top of screen) on the mac version that should duplicate all of the core features of the main navigation we can give the user the ability to rearrange some of the elements of the main navigation to their hearts content.

When the "Use small size" option is selected the Home, Library, and Search icons will be made smaller to fit within the second half of the menu bar leaving the griper bar to match the normal mac UI standard. I'll be posting this variant in just a bit.

Thanks Joe for the thought. I think this is what you were hoping to see. I think touches like this really make the UI more and more mac like.

 

"Let the words of my mouth and the meditation of my heart
be acceptable in your sight, O Lord, my rock and my redeemer."

- Psalm 19:14

Posts 55
Scott Criswell | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Jan 20 2010 9:25 PM

Here's the variant with the small Home, Library, and Search Icons. This variant would be available as an option via the "Customize Toolbar" feature. Note that the hide menu "pill" will be available in this view. This is a standard mac OSX control used to minimize/hide options found in the application header. If the pill where clicked you would not see any of the options below the main gripper. The positive of this being available is that some people may want to remove as much UI clutter as possible. This would be a potentially good option for anyone whom wanted to clear the UI and just read the results of their research.

 

"Let the words of my mouth and the meditation of my heart
be acceptable in your sight, O Lord, my rock and my redeemer."

- Psalm 19:14

Posts 102
Andrew Mercer | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Jan 20 2010 10:13 PM

Scott,

I really like where you have positioned the shortcuts icons, and the fact the home, library and search icons are on the far right. I appreciate your time in providing food for thought for the Mac development team. I can sense that a great product is really taking shape - both under the hood and in the interface. Us Mac enthusiast 's tend to expect great GUI design.

Bless you.

Posts 505
Michael Kares | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Jan 20 2010 10:38 PM

Love the mockups!  Excellent Work Scott

Posts 55
Scott Criswell | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Jan 20 2010 10:53 PM

Andrew & Michael,

I'm glad you like the Interface that I've put together. Who knows maybe I'll me able to help in an official capacity someday. I have a heart for ministry and software design is my passion. The chance to combine the two while producing these sample mockups has been a true blessing to me.

My hope is that these concepts will prove valuable to the Logos team in some fashion, that's the real reason I'm doing this. I want Logos to be the very best it can be. If I can help with that in any way then I will be blessed to have had the opportunity.

"Let the words of my mouth and the meditation of my heart
be acceptable in your sight, O Lord, my rock and my redeemer."

- Psalm 19:14

Posts 1931
Donovan R. Palmer | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Jan 20 2010 11:10 PM

These are awesome. I would love to see a mock up for a floating tool bar. I know that is not in the windows version, but hey, this is a mac!

Posts 55
Scott Criswell | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed, Jan 20 2010 11:19 PM

Donovan R. Palmer:

These are awesome. I would love to see a mock up for a floating tool bar. I know that is not in the windows version, but hey, this is a mac!

Hmm, I may be able to do that... Are you thinking of the options found in the Tools menu? If so I have an idea that I think will really combine the best of the mac and the tools menu design found in Logos for Windows. I could even see it used on the PC version with some minor tweaks. I'll start on that tomorrow. I have some things to take care of at home Thursday & Friday evening so I may not be able to post the design until this weekend.

Thanks again for the kind words and the feedback.

"Let the words of my mouth and the meditation of my heart
be acceptable in your sight, O Lord, my rock and my redeemer."

- Psalm 19:14

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