The "Cited By" Tool - reactions

Damian McGrath

I cannot share Phil's enthusiasm for the cited by tool as expressed elsewhere. When I read the words "cited by" I assume that It will then be followed by the name of the resource or the author who is doing the citing (implicit in the preposition "by").. This is not what we see. What we see are the citations, we then need to hover over the citations to find the name of the resource and its author:

 

 

One example of how confusing this is (for me, imho, etc.):

 

What is in Blue here ought be the "author, resource" or simply "resource". Currently, it almost always is the same as the first line appearing under it (the section heading of the resource)

Hovering over the resource gives me the cited by information:

 

 

Aaah. The Bible Knowledge Commentary. Not interested. Moving Along. I should know that this is the Bible Knowledge Commentary without having to hover in a tool called "cited by"

What is Mark 7:37 in the greyed out bit at the bottom of the excerpt and in the bottom right corner of the hover box. Is this just a badly tagged resource?

I had some examples from using the greek lexicons (Phil's approach) but I've lost or deleyed them. Personally, it's even worse for finding information on Greek words (imho, etc.)

Robert

I need to say I agree with Damian on the cited by tool.It doesn't give clear references and doesn't give the information I would expect.

For example, I was looking at a passage in a commentary. I thought it would be interesting to see if anyone cited that section of the commentary. The results give who cited the section of scripture, with no reference to the commentary.

When I was reading a Bible and ran the cited by tool it opened two windows. One window with the Cited by results, another search window automatically filled in with <bible+esv = 1 John 4:4> that gave the exact same results, but with a much better format including the resource the reference was to and ability to sort by rank or book.

Running Cited by with the commentary gave the same results in the "Cited by" window, but did not open the search window. It would be great if all "Cited by" results were formatted like the Search results. That way we can also look at them by book instead of the random(?) order they are in so we wont have to sort through so many results from the same book that we know we don't want.

For that matter, the "Cited by " feature could be removed, with the link just running a search with the search field automatically filled in with the appropriate search terms. This would give the results in the nice format of a search.

 

Running B3

 

 

Dave Hooton

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/14333#Comment_14333

When I was reading a Bible and ran the cited by tool it opened two windows. One window with the Cited by results, another search window automatically filled in with <bible+esv = 1 John 4:4> that gave the exact same results, but with a much better format including the resource the reference was to and ability to sort by rank or book.

I haven't looked at the Toys as yet, but you can get both windows from a right click menu on Reference. If you Search entire library you get the results in the more appropriate format. You have to select the verses for a range, but it is irrelevant once you know the search syntax e.g.  <Bible = Mark 8:1–4>  (drop the +esv or +nkjv bit). When the syntax is fully developed I'm looking forward to the equivalent of v3's Bible in "ref" (more inclusive than .

Note:  I just found that the Help for Cited By states what we have discussed!

Damian McGrath

Beta 5 has taken a big step in the right direction by including the name of the Resource in the descriptor at the bottom:

 

There remain many problems with this function.

1)  I still hold that in a tool titled "Cited By" the name of the work (and possibly even author) should head the excerpt, not follow in greyed-out fashion.

2) The use of section headings for the hot-link on top leads to very many repetitions or the simply incomprehensible:

3) In a search on Mark 8:1-10, the Oxford Bible Commentary appears 3 times. Other works also appear and reappear. Surely a tool called "Cited By" should list each work only once followed by the various citations. This problem appears to be due to the fact that the tool uses the Ranked results of a search rather than the By Book results (which would be more appropriate)

4) The rankings are, at the very least, odd.  If I am searching on Mark 8:1-10, why would commentaries on Luke and Matthew and a monograph on The Temptations of Jesus in Early Christianity appear above the results for commentaries on Mark? Why does the parallel passage from Matt 15 from the NKJV appear before the Pillar Commentary on Mark? Why does the section from the beginning of the Interpretation Commentary appear before the section on the passage being searched?

I simply am not convinced of the value of this tool as it stands...