I'm new to this myself! It works for me if I type this in as a bible search, but I don't know if I'm relying on datasets that aren't universal - I think anyone with a Logos 6 core bundle/crossgrade is ok?
child* WITHIN {Speaker <Person Jesus>}
EDIT: Hang on, that's just when Jesus says it, not when he addresses someone specific by it. Sorry! Still bumbling my way through, so I'll be quiet now.
Please help me! I am trying to find all the verses in NT where Jesus addresses somebody "child" or "children". Is this feasible in Logos? How?
((<Sense ~ child>, <Sense child (endearment)>) WITHIN 0 WORDS <LogosMorphGr ~ NV???>)
Or, just in the words of Jesus:
((<Sense ~ child>, <Sense child (endearment)>) WITHIN 0 WORDS <LogosMorphGr ~ NV???>) WITHIN {Speaker <Person Jesus>}
To take you through it from left to right:
Feel free to ask additional questions if you wish.
Mark posted a good explanation while I was working on mine, so this is pretty redundant.
If you were using a basic search engine, you would be stuck with something like Jesus AND (child OR children). As you know, this is lousy. It will find things like "Jesus and the children sat together," but not "The Son of Man said "My child, I love you."
In Logos, I begin with a more sophisticated but fairly brute force type approach:
(children, child) WITHIN {Speaker <Person Jesus>}
This finds children or child where the Speaker is Jesus. The list (multiple terms in parenthesis, separated by commas) will find any of the terms inside of it. The WITHIN means it will find that, exactly like it says, WITHIN sections of text where the speaker is Jesus; if you don't use all caps, it will search for the word "within" instead of creating a powerful search. Curly braces show that it is a section of text. The <Person Jesus> is how Logos shows that it will find the places where Jesus is speaking, even if the text says "He" or something similar.
A list of places where Jesus used the word child or children is still too broad, but it gave me some examples. So I clicked on John 13:33, where Jesus calls His disciples little children. I right clicked on "children" as a kind of cheating way to see how Logos actually tags this. I see the Sense icon with "child (endearment)."
I go back to my original search and change it to:
<Sense child (endearment)> WITHIN {Speaker <Person Jesus>}
Which gives exactly what you are looking for.
Actually, I think we need a few more senses:
((<Sense child>, <Sense child (endearment)>, <Sense child (offspring)>, <Sense child (little)>, <Sense child (young)>) WITHIN 0 WORDS <LogosMorphGr ~ NV???>) WITHIN {Speaker <Person Jesus>}
Mark - I really like this but it does give results when Jesus addresses people in terms other than "child*"
Combining this with an earlier suggestion gives
which may be closer to what is being asked for?
You can search for:
(child, children) WITHIN {Speaker <Person Jesus>}
It is difficult to have a search distinguish whether he is addressing them or talking about them, but you can easily find the one's of interest in the 40+ verses.
Actually, I think we need a few more senses: ((<Sense child>, <Sense child (endearment)>, <Sense child (offspring)>, <Sense child (little)>, <Sense child (young)>) WITHIN 0 WORDS <LogosMorphGr ~ NV???>) WITHIN {Speaker <Person Jesus>}
I don't think those senses add anything to just <Sense child (endearment)>, since I assume the study isn't interested in people in parables who are referring to their children, or to actual children. Maybe Luke 8:54 should be tagged as child (endearment), though. I think the Morph is good to add (pedantically), even though it doesn't change the results in this case, since endearment is usually in direct address.
((child, children) WITHIN 0 WORDS <LogosMorphGr ~NV??>) WITHIN {Speaker <Person Jesus>} probably literally answers the question best, but I assume son and daughter are included in the reasoning behind the question.
Yes, but different English translations will give different results for that search. The distinction between child/boy/girl isn't really there in Greek, so I'm not sure it's a good idea to search for 'child' in this instance, or more generally to search in English for these types of seaches. You could, of course, do a grid search across all major versions if you really wanted English.
I don't think those senses add anything to just <Sense child (endearment)>, since I assume the study isn't interested in people in parables who are referring to their children, or to actual children. Maybe Luke 8:54 should be tagged as child (endearment), though.
Possibly, but (a) I wasn't 100% sure of the intention of the original question, and (b) you don't know unless you try, do you? One of the problems with senses is that there are often multiple terms with similar meanings, and personally I find it a good habit to check the BSL for possible terms, rather than just relying on a cue from a familiar verse (although like you, I often see how Logos tag a verse before I attempt to search).
Yes, but different English translations will give different results for that search. The distinction between child/boy/girl isn't really there in Greek, so I'm not sure it's a good idea to search for 'child' in this instance, or more generally to search in English for these types of seaches
Totally fair point
You could, of course, do a grid search across all major versions if you really wanted English.
From his post it looks as though this was what Placyd was looking for
This search (and the other searches built on it) are not working for me in the KJV 1900. They work in the ESV and NIV for me, however.
I broke it apart and each section works fine until I try to join them with WITHIN 0 WORDS.
Can anyone confirm?
This search (and the other searches built on it) are not working for me in the KJV 1900. They work in the ESV and NIV for me, however. I broke it apart and each section works fine until I try to join them with WITHIN 0 WORDS. Can anyone confirm?
Tested and working fine on my setup! Have you tried typing "reindex KJV" into the command box....?
I rebuilt the Bible Index and also tried reindexing KJV itself, but it still comes up with zero results.
Works fine in other versions:
I'm not able to reproduce this problem:
What is the support info for your KJV1900? I have:
LLS:KJV1900 2014-11-13T00:16:50Z KJV1900.logos4
RVI:KJV1900NT 2014-11-13T00:05:12Z KJV1900NT.lbsrvi
RVI:KJV1900OT 2014-11-13T00:05:12Z KJV1900OT.lbsrvi
Anyone else seeing (or not seeing) this problem?
I cannot reproduce the problem either. Everything is functioning normally for me.
Here's my support info, which appears to be the same as Bradley's:
What is the support info for your KJV1900?
Looks to be the same:
