Sermon Published without my permission
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Mark said:Brad said:
we might have more users willing to engage the benefits of the Sermon Editor Tool without the fears of unwanted side effects like blasting our rough ideas and rough drafts before they are "ready for prime time."
We appreciate you working through this with us, Scott. Thank you again for the thoughtful discourse.
Brad said:Perhaps more of us would jump in with both feet if FL simply eliminated the "automatically publish" check box and steered us to rely on the intentional "Export" button.
[Y][Y]
Blessings,
FloydPastor-Patrick.blogspot.com
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Why would anyone ever want automatic publishing... this is daft in my opinion. Publishing something is a deliberate act when you feel that something is worth publishing... you wouldn't even have this feature for a forum post... something as important as a sermon should never wind up published in draft... this is a terrible bug!
גַּם־חֹשֶׁךְ֮ לֹֽא־יַחְשִׁ֪יךְ מִ֫מֶּ֥ךָ וְ֭לַיְלָה כַּיּ֣וֹם יָאִ֑יר כַּ֝חֲשֵׁיכָ֗ה כָּאוֹרָֽה
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Wait a minute, I just noticed I have 7.5 version and the check box for automatically publishing to sound faith is not showing on my sermon editor. Any idea why? Is that feature still in beta? My Spanish sermon published to soundfaith which I don't mind, but it'd be nice to have the option which one I want to publish and which one not.
DAL
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DAL said:
Wait a minute, I just noticed I have 7.5 version and the check box for automatically publishing to sound faith is not showing on my sermon editor. Any idea why? Is that feature still in beta? My Spanish sermon published to soundfaith which I don't mind, but it'd be nice to have the option which one I want to publish and which one not.
DAL
OK, so it's showing on a new sermon when I open a blank sermon document, but the option is not available when I click on the edit sermon link on previously created sermons. Now what? How do we fix this to unpublish and publish back and forth?
Thanks!
DAL
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DAL said:
but the option is not available ... on previously created sermons
This is by design. Sermons created before the introduction of the autopublish feature do not have any autopublish options. If you'd like to publish those to SoundFaith, you can use the "Export... > Post to SoundFaith" option to manually publish.
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DAL said:
but the option is not available ... on previously created sermons
This is by design. Sermons created before the introduction of the autopublish feature do not have any autopublish options. If you'd like to publish those to SoundFaith, you can use the "Export... > Post to SoundFaith" option to manually publish.
If the option to publish a sermon to SoundFaith is already available in the Print/Export, then what is the purpose of the auto publish button option? Why not simplify things and take the auto publish button out?
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Lonnie Spencer said:
what is the purpose of the auto publish button option
The typical workflow for Sermon Editor is creating a new document at the start of the week; working on it throughout the week; delivering it on Sunday; and then starting a new Sermon the following week.
In this typical workflow, there's not a convenient time to publish the completed Sermon after delivering it on Sunday. Auto-publish is a convenient way to schedule publishing and not have to remember to open last week's sermon to publish on SoundFaith while working on this week's sermon.
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In this typical workflow, there's not a convenient time to publish the completed Sermon after delivering it on Sunday.
Of course there is. It's at 8:15 on Monday morning, right after you've poured your first cup of coffee and fired up your computer, and right before you open a new document for the following Sunday.
Opening a document and selecting "publish" just isn't that hard.
I apologize if this comes across as a bit harsh - I'm not trying to be combative. I'm just not seeing any significant user benefit here - certainly nothing that would outweigh my concerns about Logos publishing my work by default unless I explicitly tell them not to. That seems fundamentally backwards. I want to be able to trust my software tools. If they may do things that I don't expect - especially things with potentially public consequences - it's unsettling. And the last thing FaithLife should want would be for users to feel safer doing their work with other tools in part simply to be more confident that they can control if and when that work is published.
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EastTN said:
Opening a document and selecting "publish" just isn't that hard.
EastTN said:I want to be able to trust my software tools. If they may do things that I don't expect - especially things with potentially public consequences - it's unsettling.
I am thankful for this thread. My concerns are not alleviated. And until they are, I cannot and will not use the sermon editor.
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Use it or don't use it, nobody cares. This is why we can't have nice things.
Your precious sermon isn't that precious. I used to be a preacher. I hated gatherings with other preachers because all they talked about was how to save money (cheat) on taxes, what was wrong with their churches, and why they deserved better. It was quite disillusioning for a young preacher boy. This is just an extension of the same old thing.
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No, Randall, this is not an extension of the same old thing. This is positively hilarious (no offense to the victims). I'm just surprised a company that says pastors are their bread and butter, would rationalize this. Part of their workflow these days, I guess.
Next will be the Faithlife prayer editor, complete with auto-publish from the pastor's contact list.
"If myth is ideology in narrative form, then scholarship is myth with footnotes." B. Lincolm 1999.
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Randall McRoberts said:
Use it or don't use it, nobody cares. This is why we can't have nice things. Your precious sermon isn't that precious.
I am confused... Are you "for" or "against" auto publishing? For the record, I am not against it... I just think that it should be an "opt in" rather than "opt out." There are many legitimate reasons why someone would not want their sermons published. One popped up in the forums recently... Missionaries in "limited access" countries can have their visas revoked... or worse.
We have a few regular "privacy hawks" on the forums. Although I don't fully agree with their position(s), I am sensitive to their desire/need for privacy. Companies that don't listen to their customers, even if they are in the minority, are tone deaf. I love FL and am regularly accused of being a "homer," but they are really wrong on this one.
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I couldn't possibly care less. It isn't auto-publishing. The man told how to avoid publishing your sermon. Just follow instructions and go on your way as usual.
Additionally, if people don't like it they don't have to use it.
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Randall McRoberts said:
It isn't auto-publishing.
With respect, mine did publish automatically with the box unticked.
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Software sometimes has bugs. Logos is good about fixing stuff quickly. I haven't bothered enough to read every post, but I'm pretty sure a way to make it not public has been given.
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Randall McRoberts said:
Software sometimes has bugs. Logos is good about fixing stuff quickly. I haven't bothered enough to read every post, but I'm pretty sure a way to make it not public has been given.
I agree...and...they will fix the bugs. What is not being said is what they will do with the opt-in option rather than the opt-out default.
BTW, it may be made "not public" but the document will not go away.
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And why is that a problem? I thought you didn't want it published. If it isn't public it isn't published.
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alabama24 said:
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We have a few regular "privacy hawks" on the forums. Although I don't fully agree with their position(s), I am sensitive to their desire/need for privacy.
I'm offended at this statement ... hawks? I prefer eagles.
After the recent decision to give the world all the Americans' data and then some, I tried out Onion Browser, figuring the user servers would be only gigabytes away from crashing. The Logos sites refused Onion. I'm sure there's a reason but it was funny too.
"If myth is ideology in narrative form, then scholarship is myth with footnotes." B. Lincolm 1999.
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Randall McRoberts said:
And why is that a problem?
Forgive me...I didn't make myself clear. It was published. I wouldn't have known that it was automatically published (the box was unticked) unless this thread brought it to my attention to check. I went to soundfaith and clicked delete. It's not deleted but hidden, which may not really mean it is deleted. It's an entirely other matter whether or not something is hidden if this is still considered "published" (which I will let others parse).
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Randall McRoberts said:
Additionally, if people don't like it they don't have to use it.
That's absolutely correct. And there's value to FaithLife in explaining why you might not use it - especially if the fix is simply changing a default setting. They may, for a variety of reasons, choose not to change that setting. But at least they'll have a better idea of why they aren't reaching a segment of their user base.
There's another aspect of this that hasn't been discussed. Authors have certain legal rights to their work. This is not my area of expertise, but I'm surprised their attorneys gave them the permission to do it this way. If I were in effect the publisher of sermons, I'd want to have explicit permission from the authors before publishing anything. There may be some legal language covering this in the fine print somewhere, but they would seem to have a much better defense against someone saying "I never intended to give you permission to publish that" if this were an opt-in rather than an opt-out.
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John Fugh, Jr. said:Randall McRoberts said:
And why is that a problem?
Forgive me...I didn't make myself clear. It was published. I wouldn't have known that it was automatically published (the box was unticked) unless this thread brought it to my attention to check. I went to soundfaith and clicked delete. It's not deleted but hidden, which may not really mean it is deleted. It's an entirely other matter whether or not something is hidden if this is still considered "published" (which I will let others parse).
John, it looks like you belong to a Proclaim presentation group. Have you by chance exported any Sermon Editor sermons to Proclaim? When this action is performed a draft sermon is automatically created on SoundFaith. The draft sermon is not visible to the public. It's purpose is to support the workflow of publishing a sermon recording from Proclaim to SoundFaith -- the recording is attached to the draft document on SoundFaith, preserving the original Sermon Editor content.
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I have a different problem. I received an email that the message (photo attached) would automatically be published. However, when I open the Sermon editor, the checkbox does not even exist. I have 7.5.0.0045. The challenge I face is that this particular 'sermon' was a response to a congregant's theological challenge. The document contains personal information that I exported and emailed to him. Now that information will be published without my consent and I have no way to turn it off.
Any ideas as to why I don't get the checkbox?
Marc
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Marc Brule said:
Any ideas as to why I don't get the checkbox?
When was the sermon written?
I think this button only appears for "new" sermons - those created with this version (or later) of the Logos software
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I wrote it March 30. I received an email yesterday (Sunday) that is would publish today (Monday). Yet the document was created before the feature went live.
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Scott Alexander said:
Have you by chance exported any Sermon Editor sermons to Proclaim?
I do have Proclaim. Would that account for the multiple instances of the same file?
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John Fugh, Jr. said:Scott Alexander said:
Have you by chance exported any Sermon Editor sermons to Proclaim?
I do have Proclaim. Would that account for the multiple instances of the same file?
Yes, if you're exporting your Sermon Editor document to Proclaim.
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WOW. All I can really say is wow. Thank you for this very informative series of posts about this feature. FL's answers are very indicative of how seriously they take their users. It makes it very easy to never use Logos for writing sermons or keeping prayer notes, etc.
I'm also curious as to how many pastors actually bring their sermons to a publishable state every week. I've not met many who write complete manuscripts every week, much less then make them general enough for broad consumption.
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Graham, I'm not able to reproduce this behavior.
The checkbox remembers the last explicit value choice. (Which can be different from the value from your last sermon, say if you check it, and then delete that sermon.)
Are you sure the last choice you made was to uncheck it, and then a new sermon started with it checked?
Hi Jacob
I've created a number of sermon documents over the last week and they all started with the publish box unchecked.
But then I have just created another one and the publish box was checked - I haven't touched this setting for some time
Attached is the logfile of the session at the time although not sure if that will help at all
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Graham--
I'm sorry to hear that! We'll investigate.
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