Liturgy of the Hours/Breviary for Verbum??
I know this has been requested before, but is there any chance we will get the Breviary/Liturgy of the Hours for Verbum?
I love how we have the Missal and Lectionary, but it would be wonderful to have the Liturgy of the Hours as well! And if there could be a card on the Homepage for Verbum 8 even better!
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This is one of our most requested resources, and it's something we would love to include in Verbum. It would be a large and complicated project to build the Breviary into the platform, so there is no timeline about when this will happen.
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This would be at the top of my most wanted resources, especially if the Latin of the Liturgia Horarum were included.
A book such as Fr. Devin's excellent resource on the Sacraments, Fulfilled in Christ, would become that much more powerful in Verbum, since it cites Second Readings from the Office of Readings extensively, but does not contain the full texts. One can use iBreviary or other sources to track down the texts in either Latin or English, but to have it fully integrated would be a great boon.
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Chris K said:
I know this has been requested before, but is there any chance we will get the Breviary/Liturgy of the Hours for Verbum?
Some years ago, the US English four-volume LotH and the full Latin edition were all listed together as a Pre-Pub that ended up being culled for lack of interest, so the next attempt needs to be planned out well. (iBreviary and similar apps cut into demand somewhat.) It's worth noting that a new English translation of the Liturgy of the Hours is being worked on by the relevant authorities, publication date unknown.
“The trouble is that everyone talks about reforming others and no one thinks about reforming himself.” St. Peter of Alcántara
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This is one of our most requested resources, and it's something we would love to include in Verbum. It would be a large and complicated project to build the Breviary into the platform, so there is no timeline about when this will happen.
Thanks so much for the response. By no means do I mean to sound disrespectful, but if Faithlife really wanted to make (which I believe they do) such a distinctive and "top" Catholic Study Software/Application, shouldn't this be a high priority item/project? After all, outside of the Mass, this is the daily Prayer of the Church.
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Chris K said:
After all, outside of the Mass, this is the daily Prayer of the Church.
Yes, the official Catholic daily prayer that most Catholics know nothing about, and hardly any pray.
“The trouble is that everyone talks about reforming others and no one thinks about reforming himself.” St. Peter of Alcántara
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SineNomine said:Chris K said:
After all, outside of the Mass, this is the daily Prayer of the Church.
Yes, the official Catholic daily prayer that most Catholics know nothing about, and hardly any pray.
That doesn't take away from it's importance and beauty! And, since Verbum is also a tool of evangelism, incorporating it into the software would also give those ignorant of it exposure to it.
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Chris K said:
That doesn't take away from it's importance and beauty! And, since Verbum is also a tool of evangelism, incorporating it into the software would also give those ignorant of it exposure to it.SineNomine said:
Yes, the official Catholic daily prayer that most Catholics know nothing about, and hardly any pray.Chris K said:After all, outside of the Mass, this is the daily Prayer of the Church.
I completely agree. The trouble is that often a business case has to be made for producing things, especially expensive ones.
EDIT: I should note that Eastern Catholics do not use LotH.
“The trouble is that everyone talks about reforming others and no one thinks about reforming himself.” St. Peter of Alcántara
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Chris,
I hear your passion! I will be overjoyed the day we can have a breviary in Verbum. There are a lot of Catholics (and non-Catholics!) who want to participate in traditional prayer and learn to pray the daily office, and I agree that incorporating it into the software would expose it to new people and make it more accessible.
Please keep the suggestions coming. The powerful search and linking tools within Verbum mean that it takes us time to put new resources on the platform, but we share your desire for a Verbum breviary.
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I remember back in 2000 being told at a catholic book store not to waste my money because a new edition was being worked on. While I am sure it is I have no idea when it will be done and certainly stopped holding my breath a long time ago. Liturgy of the Hours like the full New Jerusalem Bible desperately needs to be part of Verbum but I do not see either coming, while LOTH may be a more specialiced item if FL valued them they would be done. Smyth & Helwys Bible Commentary Collection (34 vols.) never even made it half way through PrePub yer it is being developed after being thrown into the higher end base packages. Had NJB or the breviary been added to Verbum bronze and above I would bet we could have had both. But it obviously is not a priority with the right people. I do realize that currently both this mentioned projects have issues In that There are 2 official office sets for the English speaking world and currently it is only NA rights full NJB is being pursued by FL. But it is a start. I find it very frustrating when some items get special treatment while other items that feel more important are languishing in PrePub or simply not even offered..
-Dan
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Chris,
I hear your passion! I will be overjoyed the day we can have a breviary in Verbum. There are a lot of Catholics (and non-Catholics!) who want to participate in traditional prayer and learn to pray the daily office, and I agree that incorporating it into the software would expose it to new people and make it more accessible.
Please keep the suggestions coming. The powerful search and linking tools within Verbum mean that it takes us time to put new resources on the platform, but we share your desire for a Verbum breviary.
I would be happy if the Breviary was released with minimal tagging, just whatever could be automated - like any scripture verses, at least then I could pray with it daily. I pray it daily, I am not sure how many direct user links there would be any way, although I can understand it would be nice for breviary entries to show up because they are tagged, in some of the guides, etc.
As it is now I use another tool, but I would love to consolidate it into Verbum. FL has done minimal tagging in the past, then tag it further over time. That's much better than not having it at all. BTW, the one tool I use on my iPad, it shows number of people concurrently praying with the tool, and every hour I have been in there, there are 500 -1200 people using it to pray at any one time. What FL may want to consider is a robust Catholic Bible tool that offers the breviary, it may incentivize Catholic clergy to use it - they are using other tools now. I agree it's hard to promote Verbum as "the" Catholic tool without the daily prayer of the Church.
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[Y] Deacon Don
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I'm a layman who bought the four volume LotH decades ago and has used Universalis is the past few years. I would love to have the LotH integrated into Verbum.
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Hearing all of this loud and clear. This is easily one of the top requested resources for Verbum. I too would love to have the Liturgy of the Hours in Verbum, to go along with my daily morning Lectio.
I will be revisiting the possibility of offering the Liturgy of the Hours in Verbum. It is a large and technically difficult resource to process and, before I came on board, Verbum had started to walk down this road.
Stay tuned....
Craig St. Clair | Verbum Product Manager |
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Thanks Craig! Maybe we can help - maybe we can crowdsource some of the effort - and/or some of the clergy on here would help I am sure (I would).
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Crowdsourcing is one possibility (and thank you for the offer!). I think you're right Don, others would likely be willing to help too.
Another possibility, not mutually exclusive, is working on the text in stages. Minimal processing first and then a timeline for completion of various other features and functionality over time. That way you all get a minimally functional text faster.
Craig St. Clair | Verbum Product Manager |
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I think you're right Don, others would likely be willing to help too.
Likewise, I would be very interested in helping bring this to fruition.
Craig St. Clair (Faithlife) said:
Another possibility, not mutually exclusive, is working on the text in stages. Minimal processing first and then a timeline for completion of various other features and functionality over time. That way you all get a minimally functional text faster.
Craig - this would be great. Having just the bare text itself in Verbum would be a great start, if simply for the ability to run searches on the full text of the LH from within the software.
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I too am just an average Catholic in the pew and have no other liturgical role or function at my parish. I bought the four volume LotH decades ago as well in order to follow along with the brothers on EWTN. (It's very frustrating to learn how to do LotH if you're trying to figure it out on your own.) But I've used Universalis the past few years as well, since it's easier to carry around in the iPad I'm already schlepping everywhere. Now that Universalis supports Car Play and has an audio option I'm back to listening along on the way to work. But I would certainly welcome the ability to have it "launch" me into further study in my Verbum library - particularly based on the second reading.
Logos didn't start out targeting Catholics to my knowledge, but they had something for us decades ago. I bought it on floppy disks. But about 2001 I switched to a Mac and Accordance was the only game going there. Now I have both. But all new purchases will be Verbum for now because there is so much more specific Catholic content there at the moment. However, an earlier poster was correct. You can't really be THE Catholic library software without the universal prayer of the Church. It's just that simple. You might be the "best available option" but you aren't THE ROMAN CATHOLIC library. To put it in the vernacular, you're sort of just a "poser" LOL.
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Any news on this?
Thanks.
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For the last five years a new English language edition of the Liturgy of the Hours has been almost released. It is still almost released so I anticipate two years at the earliest. Here is an announcement from the USCCB. http://www.usccb.org/prayer-and-worship/liturgy-of-the-hours/liturgy-of-the-hours-second-edition.cfm
The Latin is certainly available should demand justify its being licensed. For the English, I think a print publisher has been selected (just a rumor, can't find a source for that). I don't know if electronic rights are being offered at all.
Licensing the current 4 volume translation, not to mention adding links and electronic bookmarks just doesn't make business sense. It may be replace real soon, now.
The list of readings and psalms for each day are available for someone who wants to make a person book, but the other prayers and comments are copyright.0 -
Eduardo Espiritu said:
Licensing the current 4 volume translation, not to mention adding links and electronic bookmarks just doesn't make business sense. It may be replace real soon, now.
Often it is important to have old versions for historical comparisons and to fill-in the gaps for resources created when the version was the mandated version.
Orthodox Bishop Alfeyev: "To be a theologian means to have experience of a personal encounter with God through prayer and worship."; Orthodox proverb: "We know where the Church is, we do not know where it is not."
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While I greatly respect your opinions on matters such as these, I can tell you that based on what we've already been told regarding the expense to FL to "verbumize" the LOTH what you're suggesting here is simply not going to happen. I have no doubt what you're saying about having old versions is true. But the simple answer is we already have the old version - on paper and digitally in Universalis. Given the expense, we'll still be LUCKY if FL actually "verbumizes" the NEW LOTH. Just forget the existing one ever getting that treatment now. Cue the first President George Bush "NOT GONNA HAPPEN"
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MJ. Smith said:Eduardo Espiritu said:
Licensing the current 4 volume translation, not to mention adding links and electronic bookmarks just doesn't make business sense. It may be replace real soon, now.
Often it is important to have old versions for historical comparisons and to fill-in the gaps for resources created when the version was the mandated version.
Perhaps I’m mistaken, but I expect that permissions for the old LOTH will be removed when the new edition comes out, similar to what happened to the NAB when the NABRE came out. If that’s the case, it’s probably not worth it to FL to make an electronic version of the current one.
I’d be happy to be proven wrong though. iBreviary works for now, but I’d rather have LOTH get the Verbum treatment.
WIN 11 i7 9750H, RTX 2060, 16GB RAM, 1TB SSD | iPad Air 3
Verbum Max0 -
I am in the process of working out the licensing for both the current and future LOTH editions. It is worthwhile for Verbum to have both the current and future editions.
The LOTH isn't as simple as "licensing a book." The four-volume LOTH is a patchwork of several different licensing agreements with different rights holders. We've managed to work out licensing for some, but not all--and the outstanding agreements are in progress right now.
Once the licensing is secured will begin development work.
Stay tuned....
Craig St. Clair | Verbum Product Manager |
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I stand corrected then. Good to know youre working on this 👍
WIN 11 i7 9750H, RTX 2060, 16GB RAM, 1TB SSD | iPad Air 3
Verbum Max0 -
That's great news!
It sounds quite strange that LOTH is licensed at all.
Is there any chance to have it in Spanish too?
Thanks!
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Well, I stand corrected. Happily corrected I might add. Sometimes you guys completely surprise me (sometimes good and sometimes bad LOL)
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Manuel Maria said:
That's great news!
It sounds quite strange that LOTH is licensed at all.
Is there any chance to have it in Spanish too?
Thanks!
if I remember rightly, the Church requires some things to be licensed to ensure that there are no unauthorized changes to the text. As for Spanish, that’s probably a different license under a different bishops conference. (I recall that the English version is for US/UK.
WIN 11 i7 9750H, RTX 2060, 16GB RAM, 1TB SSD | iPad Air 3
Verbum Max0 -
David Wanat said:
if I remember rightly, the Church requires some things to be licensed to ensure that there are no unauthorized changes to the text
But according to Craig there are different right holders. And I think any bishop could stamp his 'nihil obstat' without any further licensing.
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Manuel Maria said:David Wanat said:
if I remember rightly, the Church requires some things to be licensed to ensure that there are no unauthorized changes to the text
But according to Craig there are different right holders. And I think any bishop could stamp his 'nihil obstat' without any further licensing.
ok, I’m not an expert here, but this is my understanding: The bishops conferences and the ICEL approve the permissions for official use in a country. This is what I was referring to. There are other rightsholders for song lyrics, translations, more modern writings for the Second Reading of the Office of Readings, the Scripture translations, etc. For translation outside of English, I imagine these would have different rightsholders and a whole new set of issues.
if I’m mistaken, hopefully someone here will correct me.
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Verbum Max0 -
Regarding Scripture translations, I hope the resource links to our favourite bible, just like the daily readings.
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